Vienna/Munich diastatic power

I've been doing partial mashes with a couple of pounds of 2 row, some Vienna or Munich, and a handful of specialty malts (biscuit, aromatic, etc, depending on my mood).

I find myself on a quest to push the quantity of Vienna/Munich as high as it can go. But my current setup can only fit 4 pounds of grain in total, so I have to reduce the amount of base malt to make room.

I know these malts can self convert, but do they have enough diastatic power to also convert specialty malts? For instance I'm toying with something like:

• 2.5 lb Vienna
• 0.75 lb honey malt
• 0.5 lb biscuit

but I fear this may be pushing it too far and I need to fit some 6 row in there as well?

Backing up a step, can anyone recommend a good resource on how to calculate this stuff? I have info about the diastatic power of various malts, but I don't understand the units - it seems like somewhere around 30 is the ability to self convert, and then it goes up from there? Anyone got a formula for working out whether any given combination of base malt + specialty is going to work out?

Yep

Experiment, and you'll see that you can go all Vienna or Munich base malts. Talk about a malty beer when its all done too!

munich has less than vienna but can still self-convert

according to wikipedia, you need about a diastatic power of 35 Litner to self-convert. so i'd imagine anything over that and you have potential for conversion of other grains.

Diastatic power - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Vienna malt (from and according to briess) has a diastatic power of 130°L. that should be more than enough.

http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Assets/PDFs/Briess_PIS_Vienna_Malt_WK.pdf

Munich, at 40°L, might be more troublesome:

http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Assets/PDFs/Briess_PIS_Bonlander_Munich_Malt_WK.pdf

the grain bill you suggested would work just fine.

I would recommend a longer mash if you are using large amounts of Munich/Vienna without any other base malt.

T-Hops said:

I would recommend a longer mash if you are using large amounts of Munich/Vienna without any other base malt.

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Theres not really any need to go longer than 1 hour. They will convert just fine. Try it, and do the starch test

Even though munich is kilned a bit higher, it still has enough diastatic power to convert just fine. Vienna will convert no problem

Awesome, thanks for the info guys!

I've always thought of as Munich and Vienna as basically interchangeable, since they taste so similar. But it makes total sense that the lighter kilned one would have more diastatic power.

im really confused about vienna malts diastatic power. on most sites i find people saying it has about a 130 in diastatic power, but i remember asking about it before here and some people saying it is really weak in conversion, also just found a page saying it has a DP of 50 ?? whats the deal? if its 130 i was planning on using it in a rye beer

as for Munich, i did a 90% Munich Alt recently. It just took a little longer to convert (turned out to be a fine brew also).

yeah i heard it has low DP, so i made an alt that was about 50/50 munich/pils, its great but i wish i went with 80% + munich

http://www.brewingwithbriess.com/Products/High_Temp_Kilned_Malts.htm#Vienna

Briess is 130 DP, Munich is 40. The german malts may be lower, but it's still more than enough to convert itself and other adjuncts.

...and there are different levels of Munich. A lighter Munich in the 7 Lovibond range might have double the diastatic power of a dark Munich in the 20 Lov area.

But any Munich should be readily able to self-convert as it is, after all, a base malt.

In addition, those other two malts (Honey malt and Biscuit) have some DP of their own.