New Brutus with mods

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

insp79

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 10, 2008
Messages
138
Reaction score
12
Location
Double Oak, Texas
I've been researching long enough...now it's time to build. I am going to need some help.
Specs: Must be able to store Brutus in garage with cars parked.
Should be semi-automated. (user friendly)
Built from scrap metal in shop.
Portable from garage to back patio (depending on season)
Direct fired MLT and HERMS (options)
Ability to use LP propane and convert to Natural Gas
Goal: Reduce brew time, and be able to enjoy a beer while brewing. I usually have to wait until the yeast is pitched.

I have been inspired by the many Brutus builds found here on HomeBrewTalk.com
This beer is for you.
208583_1040650170550_1054415164_30224728_317_n.jpg

One build in particular caught my eye. jlandin built the blue Brutus with some very nice modifications. In particular, I like the ability to store the kettles beneath the burners while not in use.

I have scored many parts for the build already. I am afraid to add up how many $$$ I have spent so far, so I will save that for later in the build thread.
 
Here are my kettles.
They are not keggles. Originally they were used to store and dispense liquid nitrogen. The valve body was removed, and handles were welded on at the top.
They measure 16" in diameter and are 25" tall.
The shelf that they are sitting in front of is going to be removed. This is the future storage spot for the Brutus. The shelf above the Brutus is my fermentation cabinet.
brutus-001-58569.jpg

The lids came from Ace Mart Restaurant Supply in Dallas
brutus-002-58570.jpg

I purchased the Kettles from Foreman's General Store in Colleyville, Texas.
 
I have started building the frame. I chose to build it from 1.5" steel. 3/16" thickness.
60" wide x 20" deep x39" tall including 4" casters.
(fuzzy iPhone pics)
brutus-017-58587.jpg


brutus-018-58588.jpg




I am building this Brutus during breaks and lunch time at work.
I am using 2 each BG-14 LP burners. One for the HLT and one for the Boiler. I am also adding a smaller 6" banjo burner under the MLT.

I made a wind block / burner mount out of .050" SS. 6" tall for the big burners. 4.5" tall for the MLT burner. The burner height can be adjusted in 1" increments.

brutus-022-58601.jpg


brutus-020-58599.jpg

The wires on the bracket, are the direct spark ignition and sense wires. (more on this later)

brutus-024-58603.jpg


brutus-0191-58598.jpg
]

brutus-027-58606.jpg


brutus-026-58605.jpg
 
I am curious...Why do most of the Brutus brew stands have gas valves for the HLT and MLT, but not the boiler?

Would it be better to control all three burners?

Why are most of the gas valves I have seen used, are 24V? Is it cost?

Will 120V valves work?

Has anyone tried to Direct Spark the burner, without a pilot light?
 
I got some work on the Brutus today.
The gas beam was completed last week. Today I leak checked, and installed the beam on the back side of the system.
brutus-013-58590.jpg

The supply port is on the lower side.
brutus-014-58584.jpg
 
Jealous!

Wish I could work on my brewstand on breaks... frikken awesome man.
Sub'd.

Cheers
 
I also installed the Tippy Dump.
This one is different.
I made a clamp collar from .041 stainless.
brutus-008-58578.jpg

Then I made two spindles that will be welded on at 180° from each other to the collar.
brutus-010-58580.jpg


brutus-012-58582.jpg






Then I made two identical arms that are hinged in the front side of the system.

brutus-010-58580.jpg


brutus-009-58579.jpg


brutus-007-58577.jpg


brutus-006-58576.jpg


brutus-007-58577.jpg



When I dump the grain from the MLT the arms will raise to the stop on the frame, and the MLT will be raised enough to rotate and dump the spent grain safely into the trash can.

brutus-005-58575.jpg

brutus-0041-58574.jpg

brutus-003-58572.jpg

brutus-0011-58571.jpg
 
Good looking build so far, as to the 24V valves that has become an industry standard voltage for heating and air conditioning systems which makes the high volume low voltage valves the cheapest and most plentiful. The direct spark is a good idea if the burner flame is never adjusted, changing the flame level usually results in the flame sensor loosing contact with enough of the flame to keep working. With spark ignition you can use high pressure solenoids to control high pressure burners, and pilots if using adjustable firing levels.
The pilot burner has the advantage of a constant high intensity flame regardless of main burner flame level and usually is quite reliable. With the 10" burners you can mount the pilot burner between the spokes of the burner facing the flame diffuser inward with a right/left hand pattern tip to direct the flame over the burner openings.
 
Good looking build so far, as to the 24V valves that has become an industry standard voltage for heating and air conditioning systems which makes the high volume low voltage valves the cheapest and most plentiful. The direct spark is a good idea if the burner flame is never adjusted, changing the flame level usually results in the flame sensor loosing contact with enough of the flame to keep working. With spark ignition you can use high pressure solenoids to control high pressure burners, and pilots if using adjustable firing levels.
The pilot burner has the advantage of a constant high intensity flame regardless of main burner flame level and usually is quite reliable. With the 10" burners you can mount the pilot burner between the spokes of the burner facing the flame diffuser inward with a right/left hand pattern tip to direct the flame over the burner openings.

Thank you Kladue for your response.

As I mentioned...I got these gas valves with all of the goodies for $$Free$$.
That being said, would I be better off, and bite the bullet to purchase 24V valves with pilot light assy?

Why is it that most brewers do not have a gas control (Honeywell) on the boiler?
 
Most of the systems have manual boil kettle control because the sparge cycle is mostly a nearly constant attention method to regulate levels. To speed up the brew day, when you get about 2" of wort in the boil kettle is when you light up the boil kettle burner, and then throttle it so as the last wort runs in it reaches a boil, otherwise you have to pour the fire to it to get going and loose about 15 minutes catching up. With constant attention it is acceptable to let boil kettle burner run without safety backup when brewing outdoors. If you go to level control and automation then the additional cost is worth the effort if the burner is fired automatically. With the free valves you need to research the BTU rating and see if they can handle 60K btu's as a minimum for the 10" burners. You should experiment with the ignition and flame sensors to see if you can get them positioned to work over a wide range of flame size, you might be able to tame the beast and start a trend.
 
I used 12v dc gas and liquid valves. That way I was able to us some very small, very inexpensive ic relays. Saved money and space, but since I have 4 two way liquid valves, I had to buy a bigger power supply. Here is view of my plumbing.

album.php
 
I am curious...Why do most of the Brutus brew stands have gas valves for the HLT and MLT, but not the boiler?

Would it be better to control all three burners?

Why are most of the gas valves I have seen used, are 24V? Is it cost?

Will 120V valves work?

Has anyone tried to Direct Spark the burner, without a pilot light?

There's almost no reason to control the BK. There's no specific temperature to be maintained as with the HLT and MT. That is why you don't normally see a valve at that burner.
 
I finally finished the brewstand frame and had it powder coated. I used high temp chrome powder coat. It looks great.

image-3877050917.jpg


image-1949404456.jpg


image-1166230815.jpg
 
I made a heat baffle on the front side of the burners to help dissipate the heat. My controls are going to be mounted on the front middle area. See pic.

image-1464675834.jpg


image-2630325883.jpg


image-732081070.jpg
 
Make sure you keep the kettles elevated off the top side of the frame or you'll burn right through that powder coat. I can't really tell if you've done this or not from the build pics but just in case you haven't :)
 
bendavanza said:
I like this build. Could you share the cost of the kettles from theForemen's store? What is the capacity?


I bought them in Colleyville,Texas at Foreman's Feed Store. They cat $100 each, and already cut with handles.
They are 16" diameter and 24" tall. They hold approximately 20 gallons. They were originally liquid nitrogen dispensers.
 
jcaudill said:
Make sure you keep the kettles elevated off the top side of the frame or you'll burn right through that powder coat. I can't really tell if you've done this or not from the build pics but just in case you haven't :)

I haven't elevated the kettles. I should have made something, before I had it powder coated. The bottom of the kettles are convex shaped, unlike a keggle. It is only 1/2" depth of convex. The flame will probably deflect downward slightly onto the frame. I will have to do something to prevent the powder coat from burning off. Ideas?
 
Well, the convex surface definitely rules the simple solution out. I have an idea but I need to draw it. Shoot something back to you here in a bit.
 
I bought them in Colleyville,Texas at Foreman's Feed Store. They cat $100 each, and already cut with handles.
They are 16" diameter and 24" tall. They hold approximately 20 gallons. They were originally liquid nitrogen dispensers.
WTF, what were they using these for at the feed store?
 
Foreman's sells brewing supplies too, and lots of other odds and ends. They haven't just been a "feed store" probably as long as Colleyville hasn't had any cows.
 
FoundersBrew said:
WTF, what were they using these for at the feed store?

The owner of the feed store is a home brewer. He told me that he bought 40 of them, and has sold all of them except 3 over the past 10 years.
They are nice. I am going to have a tough time making a false bottom for the mash tun.
 
jcaudill said:
Well, the convex surface definitely rules the simple solution out. I have an idea but I need to draw it. Shoot something back to you here in a bit.

I might make an insert, like a stove top grate, that can be easily removed, and cleaned.
 
I've attached a really crude grate idea that should be relatively simple to build. Basically, the strip supports the kettle, the rounds elevate the strip and the tabs keep it in place. I tried to minimize the amount of metal that would block the heat from escaping. Hope this helps get the creative juices flowing at least.

grate.jpg
 
jcaudill said:
I've attached a really crude grate idea that should be relatively simple to build. Basically, the strip supports the kettle, the rounds elevate the strip and the tabs keep it in place. I tried to minimize the amount of metal that would block the heat from escaping. Hope this helps get the creative juices flowing at least.

That is a simple fix. I might be able to do something like that.
 
If I add a block, that supports the kettle above the brew frame, it will allow the flames to escape freely. My powder coat is high temp, it should be able withstand the flames.
Here is a picture of the unfinished blocks:

image-982436210.jpg


image-863879877.jpg


image-710169893.jpg
 
It's usually the contact points that are the problems. For example, your kettle sits on the frame. The points where the kettle contacts the frame get super hot (hotter than even a high-temp powder coat is rated for - most are about 600 degrees) and eventually melt the powdercoat. Search around the forums and you'll find a few examples. I think those blocks will help prevent the frame from getting too hot - what I can't really tell you is if the blocks themselves might actually get hot enough to melt the coating.
 
I am thinking about going with this design. I can shape the blocks so that the flame flows past them smoothly, and with little resistance. If it does not work, how large of an area could possibly be affected?
I could tape it off, and paint it with high temp paint.
I think that my burner mounts are going to get charred anyway, no matter what I do. They will probably end up getting painted too.
Thanks for your help.
 
You never know unless you try that is for sure! You can be assured those area under your kettle will get all kinds of ugly :) But who cares!
 
Nice buiild so far, your quite the fabricator! I like your heat baffle, tippy dump, and those unusual kettles. You've got some great ideas. Keep the pics coming, I can't wait to see it when it's finished. Jaybird (vendor on this site) may be able to come up with a solution for fabricating a false bottom for those kettles.

Good Luck with the rest of your build!

John
 
jcav said:
Nice buiild so far, your quite the fabricator! I like your heat baffle, tippy dump, and those unusual kettles. You've got some great ideas. Keep the pics coming, I can't wait to see it when it's finished. Jaybird (vendor on this site) may be able to come up with a solution for fabricating a false bottom for those kettles.

Good Luck with the rest of your build!

John

Thanks John!
I enjoy working with metal. It seems like this brewery build is taking forever. I hope to finish it soon, so I can have a home brew.
I spoke with Jaybird about making the false bottom for the Mash Tun. I just haven't began working on the kettles yet. I still need to plan on my SS fittings, quick disconnects, HERMS coil, thermometers, etc.
Thanks!
Bryan
 
Started working on the control panel today. The control will reside in front of the MLT, instead of being mounted on a arm. This will help for storage purposes.
I cut the window in the diamond plate aluminum. I used a jigsaw, and cleaned the edges up with a high speed grinder.


image-3083267100.jpg

The control panel layout includes the following:
•Keyed Master Switch
Power Switch
•Auber Temp Control for
(1) HLT
(2) Mash Tun
(3) Chiller (temp. ind. only)
•Burner over ride switches for
HLT
Mash
and 1 extra switch, possibly for boiler burner control
•Pump switch #1
•pump switch #2
•water solenoid valve.


image-3973276492.jpg

I will begin cutting out for the switches tomorrow.
I will also make a door to cover the control panel, when not in use.
 
Back
Top