Homebrewing in public (Wisconsin)

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MetallHed

MetallHed

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I'm planning a homebrewing get-together with my brewing buddies at a public park and am wondering if anyone has any experience putting something like this together and could provide some insight.

The plan is to get between 5-10 rigs together. I rented a pavilion so we'll have some shelter and the park has grills that we can use to cook food while we brew. We are bringing our own bottled water to brew with and have a plan to pump creek water through a pre-chiller and then to our ICs to cool down our wort. We are also going to bring brew to share with each other.

This is not a "public" event. It's not going to be advertised and we aren't serving random people beer. It's just for our group of brewers to bring their rigs to a central place and brew "together but separate" instead of all of us going to one person's house and watch them brew.

The other thing I thought is we would all pitch the yeast into our chilled wort once we got home. That way no one can say we have a bunch of beer that we're hauling around in public. The way I understand it is that it's not technically "beer" until there is yeast in it.

Does anyone have any thoughts, tips, or suggestions that would be helpful? I obviously don't want to get us all arrested, fined, or kicked out. I've seen a ton of these kinds of events from around the US but I've never been to one and there definitely isn't one around my area.

:mug:
 
Definitely talk to the municipality about what type of permit you need. That way you won't have to worry about it.
 
MetallHed said:
I'm planning a homebrewing get-together with my brewing buddies at a public park and am wondering if anyone has any experience putting something like this together and could provide some insight.

The plan is to get between 5-10 rigs together. I rented a pavilion so we'll have some shelter and the park has grills that we can use to cook food while we brew. We are bringing our own bottled water to brew with and have a plan to pump creek water through a pre-chiller and then to our ICs to cool down our wort. We are also going to bring brew to share with each other.

This is not a "public" event. It's not going to be advertised and we aren't serving random people beer. It's just for our group of brewers to bring their rigs to a central place and brew "together but separate" instead of all of us going to one person's house and watch them brew.

The other thing I thought is we would all pitch the yeast into our chilled wort once we got home. That way no one can say we have a bunch of beer that we're hauling around in public. The way I understand it is that it's not technically "beer" until there is yeast in it.

Does anyone have any thoughts, tips, or suggestions that would be helpful? I obviously don't want to get us all arrested, fined, or kicked out. I've seen a ton of these kinds of events from around the US but I've never been to one and there definitely isn't one around my area.

:mug:
Click to expand...

It's not beer until yeast combines with wort.
 
I'm thinking the problem won't be the "brewing beer" part but the actual process and equipment required. Definitely talk to parks & recreation or whatever department handles parks for your city. I know ours limits what you can do (open fire, types of heating/cooking devices, etc) and what you can bring into the park (glass containers, knives, etc).
 
I would think the biggest issue would be bringing your own beer to the park. Here we're not "technically" allowed to but...

Other than that, it's basically a crawfish boil.
 
TomSD said:
I'm thinking the problem won't be the "brewing beer" part but the actual process and equipment required. Definitely talk to parks & recreation or whatever department handles parks for your city. I know ours limits what you can do (open fire, types of heating/cooking devices, etc) and what you can bring into the park (glass containers, knives, etc).
Click to expand...

+1
Always better to find out ahead of time. You never know how the random passerby might perceive your gathering, call the cops and get shut down.:mug:
 
We used to do plenty of crawfish boils at public parks with rented pavillions...40-gallon kettles and jet burners and all. I would just ask if crawfish boils are ok. It's the same principle and and asking if beer brewing is ok will just confuse people, because people don't know what that is. If anyone asks what you are doing, tell the truth and say that you are "mashing grain". The idea is to engage people's brain and interest before using words like "beer" that have a probability of turning brains off and jerking knees.
 
I don't see why it would be a problem. Like others mentioned, your basically making malt extract which isn't illegal. The only thing I can see anyone possibly hassling you about is the burners. Obviously were in different states and cities but our brew club does stuff like that about 4 times a year.

Good luck with the brew day!
 
KGB09 said:
Sometimes its better to ask for forgiveness, rather than permission.
Click to expand...

Hahahaha, but paying a fine sucks when ur wrong....

Only thing I see wrong is the "drinking in public" A, you are in the public.b, you have to drive after brewing. Now I understand a few beers an most likely you will be fine, but under the eye of the law ur not. C, who's liable for u on public grounds? The city/town? Not sure if they would be ok with it....

That **** wouldn't fly here in MA... Just my $.02 good luck tho!
 
Bostonbrewin63 said:
Hahahaha, but paying a fine sucks when ur wrong....

Only thing I see wrong is the "drinking in public" A, you are in the public.b, you have to drive after brewing. Now I understand a few beers an most likely you will be fine, but under the eye of the law ur not. C, who's liable for u on public grounds? The city/town? Not sure if they would be ok with it....

That **** wouldn't fly here in MA... Just my $.02 good luck tho!
Click to expand...

All good points I didn't think about because in Key West they don't care lol.
 
Keep in mind a Murphy's Law corollary that "anything that can be misunderstood will be misunderstood."

Once someone finds out you are "making beer," all sorts of misconceptions can happen. Many non-brewers don't get the fact that no alcohol is produced on brew day, that the yeast do that later. They associate brewing with distilling. I can't count the number of people I've met who think that kettle is full of "booze."

If the cops come, don't expect them to be understanding at first. Explain that you are mashing grain to take home and make beer from later. Call it "pre-beer" or "proto-beer," whatever. Even so, their job is more to maintain order than to understand arcane brewing laws. They still might tell you to move along, just to appease some "concerned parent." In any case, be civil and try to educate. You might win someone over and get to continue your fun in the park.
 
Simple terms and generic processes should work best. You're making sugar from grain and sterilizing it with the boil and hops, and thought you'd spend the day at the park since it takes a few hours. Then you're going home. :D
 
Call it a Sweet Hop Soup!

These events can be fun, we have done it before. Interesting to see the differences between other brewers rigs and styles. I keep my rig portable so I can brew inside (electric), the deck, driveway (mine or friends).
 
I'm definitely going to make sure that turkey fryers run on propane are okay with the city. I'll also ask about beer too, I guess. Let's face it, I'm in Wisconsin, and people guzzle bud light around here like it's water and you can be damn sure there is a couple cases at a picnic in the park.

I understand the point about passerby's though and I hope no one makes a fuss.
 
libeerty said:
Definitely talk to the municipality about what type of permit you need. That way you won't have to worry about it.
Click to expand...

Do you mean like an alcohol license? Or what kind of permit would I be looking into?

I thought that this would be comparable to a family reunion picnic: food being made and beer being drank. They also have weddings and other events down there and I'm not sure that they are required to have a permit as long as it's private citizens that aren't serving or making food for the general public, which we aren't.
 
MetallHed said:
Do you mean like an alcohol license? Or what kind of permit would I be looking into?

I thought that this would be comparable to a family reunion picnic: food being made and beer being drank. They also have weddings and other events down there and I'm not sure that they are required to have a permit as long as it's private citizens that aren't serving or making food for the general public, which we aren't.
Click to expand...

You very well might be right. I just meant that instead of having guests be like IS THIS OK?? CAN I DO THIS?!?! You can make a phone call, explain what you are doing, and see if there is a permit. That way if anyone bothers you, you either have a permit or the name of someone who said you did not need one.
 
So-called "alcohol licenses" may be for vendors, which, of course, would not apply you, since you are not selling beer. Call your city parks dept. and ask about private individuals consuming alcohol while "cooking out" in the park. It may be simply an issue of when (i.e., what hours in the day you can drink there). More of a parks management thing than a legal one.

Another thought is that some parks require groups of people to register if they want to reserve a picnic shelter or gazebo. This might be a good idea if you plan to have a bunch of people and you want to guarantee a good spot to brew.
 
I know of at least one municipality (in Illinois) that required $1,000,000 liability insurance be carried by the renters of a pavilion in order to be able to serve alcohol at said pavilion. This was a private party, so no beer sales, just personal consumption. So yeah, talk to whomever you're renting the gazebo from...
 
libeerty said:
You very well might be right. I just meant that instead of having guests be like IS THIS OK?? CAN I DO THIS?!?! You can make a phone call, explain what you are doing, and see if there is a permit. That way if anyone bothers you, you either have a permit or the name of someone who said you did not need one.
Click to expand...

abrix said:
I know of at least one municipality (in Illinois) that required $1,000,000 liability insurance be carried by the renters of a pavilion in order to be able to serve alcohol at said pavilion. This was a private party, so no beer sales, just personal consumption. So yeah, talk to whomever you're renting the gazebo from...
Click to expand...

Yep I'll definitely be asking about private consumption. Someone I talked to yesterday stated that a liquor license is for consuming beer out of a keg, so to avoid that we'll be putting our beer to pass in growlers.

MaxStout said:
So-called "alcohol licenses" may be for vendors, which, of course, would not apply you, since you are not selling beer. Call your city parks dept. and ask about private individuals consuming alcohol while "cooking out" in the park. It may be simply an issue of when (i.e., what hours in the day you can drink there). More of a parks management thing than a legal one.

Another thought is that some parks require groups of people to register if they want to reserve a picnic shelter or gazebo. This might be a good idea if you plan to have a bunch of people and you want to guarantee a good spot to brew.
Click to expand...

Yep I already have a pavilion booked so no one else can take that spot. I just put in "friends and family gathering and picnic" for the reason of booking. I'll be calling the Parks and Rec office in the next week or so to talk further about the setup.
 
abrix said:
I know of at least one municipality (in Illinois) that required $1,000,000 liability insurance be carried by the renters of a pavilion in order to be able to serve alcohol at said pavilion. This was a private party, so no beer sales, just personal consumption. So yeah, talk to whomever you're renting the gazebo from...
Click to expand...

Jeeze that sounds complicated and expensive. My buddy (who is brewing at this get-together) just had his wedding in a public park and they had over 100 guests. They were serving three kegs (two homebrew) of beer plus liquor and also had catering for food and didn't have to do anything besides book the shelter. No problems. *shrug*
 
There is a brew club in Rhinelander (BIER), and they have done many events where they brew in public, in the park, on the ice (frozen lake), I'm not sure when they pitched yeast. I know of another club in Wausau area that also does group brews, but I'm not sure about in public. Our group in Sauk/Prairie and a group from the Dells area recently brewed on the deck at The Barn in Baraboo. I'm pretty sure they didn't pitch till home. Lots of brewing in public goin on in WI!
 
I think as long as the city park doesn't have a regulation about alcohol in the park you would be fine. We do something similar, without the brewing, but we have to get an alcohol permit from the city since any and all alcohol is banned in city parks. The permit and bbq area reservation is almost 500 bucks!! We actually turned ours into a private, invite-only beer festival since if you are going to pay the money you might as well make it worth it.
 
Wisconsin just passed a law last year allowing homebrew to be removed from the home for competitions. Brewing in public is fine, if you're allowed to cook, but bringing homebrew into a public place might not be if you haven't registered a homebrew competition.

Here's the statute:

b) Notwithstanding ss. 125.14 (5), 125.315, 125.32 (6) (a), 125.34 (2) and (5), and 125.67, a person who is not a licensee under this chapter may at a private residence, and a person who is a licensee under this chapter may on the licensed premises, conduct, sponsor, or host a contest, competition, or other event for the exhibition, demonstration, judging, tasting, or sampling of homemade wine or fermented malt beverages made in compliance with the limitations specified in sub. (3) (a) if the person does not sell the wine or fermented malt beverages and, unless the person is the maker of the wine or fermented malt beverages, does not acquire any ownership interest in the wine or fermented malt beverages. No fee may be charged for consumption of homemade wine or fermented malt beverages at the contest, competition, or other event. If the contest, competition, or other event is held on licensed premises, the licensee may allow the homemade wine or fermented malt beverages to be stored on the premises if the homemade wine or fermented malt beverages are clearly identified and kept separate from any alcohol beverages owned by the licensee. If the contest, competition, or other event is held on licensed premises, the provisions of ss. 125.32 (7) and 125.68 (9) (e) do not apply with respect to the homemade wine or fermented malt beverages. If the contest, competition, or other event is held on licensed premises, the licensee shall comply with all provisions of this chapter and local ordinances that would apply if the fermented malt beverages or wine were not homemade, except those provisions made specifically inapplicable under this paragraph.

Contrast it with this paragraph:
(c) Homemade wine or fermented malt beverages made in compliance with the limitations specified in par. (a) may be consumed by the person who made it and his or her family, neighbors, and friends at any private residence or other private location where the possession and consumption of alcohol is permissible under this chapter, local ordinances, and other applicable law. This paragraph does not apply to licensed premises.

The key is "private residence" or "private location".


The whole statute can be found here: http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/pages/government-affairs/statutes/wisconsin
 
So hold a contest. Winner gets 12 Attaboys in honor of the greatest QB alive.

rodgershandlebar.jpg
 
Yooper said:
Wisconsin just passed a law last year allowing homebrew to be removed from the home for competitions. Brewing in public is fine, if you're allowed to cook, but bringing homebrew into a public place might not be if you haven't registered a homebrew competition.

Here's the statute:

b) Notwithstanding ss. 125.14 (5), 125.315, 125.32 (6) (a), 125.34 (2) and (5), and 125.67, a person who is not a licensee under this chapter may at a private residence, and a person who is a licensee under this chapter may on the licensed premises, conduct, sponsor, or host a contest, competition, or other event for the exhibition, demonstration, judging, tasting, or sampling of homemade wine or fermented malt beverages made in compliance with the limitations specified in sub. (3) (a) if the person does not sell the wine or fermented malt beverages and, unless the person is the maker of the wine or fermented malt beverages, does not acquire any ownership interest in the wine or fermented malt beverages. No fee may be charged for consumption of homemade wine or fermented malt beverages at the contest, competition, or other event. If the contest, competition, or other event is held on licensed premises, the licensee may allow the homemade wine or fermented malt beverages to be stored on the premises if the homemade wine or fermented malt beverages are clearly identified and kept separate from any alcohol beverages owned by the licensee. If the contest, competition, or other event is held on licensed premises, the provisions of ss. 125.32 (7) and 125.68 (9) (e) do not apply with respect to the homemade wine or fermented malt beverages. If the contest, competition, or other event is held on licensed premises, the licensee shall comply with all provisions of this chapter and local ordinances that would apply if the fermented malt beverages or wine were not homemade, except those provisions made specifically inapplicable under this paragraph.

Contrast it with this paragraph:
(c) Homemade wine or fermented malt beverages made in compliance with the limitations specified in par. (a) may be consumed by the person who made it and his or her family, neighbors, and friends at any private residence or other private location where the possession and consumption of alcohol is permissible under this chapter, local ordinances, and other applicable law. This paragraph does not apply to licensed premises.

The key is "private residence" or "private location".


The whole statute can be found here: http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/pages/government-affairs/statutes/wisconsin
Click to expand...

Thank you for posting that. It's very helpful! :mug:
 
Ok so I'm going to the Parks and Rec department tomorrow to pay for the pavilion and also ask about turkey fryer burners and beer on the premise.

As for the statute that Yooper posted, I'm going to print out the full version from http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/pages/government-affairs/statutes/wisconsin to have on hand for when we brew in case anyone tries to make a stink about us being there. I will also have the name and number of the person I talk to from the P&R department saying it was okay to drink beer and use turkey fryer burners. The pavilion we are at has built in grills and a brick outdoor fireplace so I don't think it'll be a problem, but I want a name and number to fall back on just in case.

It says in the statute that by definition, ""Fermented malt beverages" means any beverage made by the alcohol fermentation of an infusion in potable water of barley malt and hops, with or without unmalted grains or decorticated and degerminated grains or sugar containing 0.5% or more of alcohol by volume." And that is what they are referring to the entire statute. "The making of homemade wine or fermented malt beverages."

BUT, since we aren't adding yeast until we get home, we aren't fermenting anything. Which, to me, means that it isn't a "fermented malt beverage." It's just sugar water with hops. So wouldn't that exclude us from any threat of repercussions?
 
That's the technicality that used here. my lhbs brewed with a 100 gallon pot in a mini mall parking lot without issue. People who showed up filled their fermenters with wort and added yeast on their own.
 
I would just say you are making non-alcoholic beer...which technically at that point you are. I can't imagine anyone would give you grief over that.
 
Threads like this make my blood boil (maybe I will need a permit to boil my blood as well?!). Not anyone's fault here or any of the posts, just the spirit of it all.
 
woknblues said:
Threads like this make my blood boil (maybe I will need a permit to boil my blood as well?!). Not anyone's fault here or any of the posts, just the spirit of it all.
Click to expand...

Heh, yeah. It's pretty sad to have to jump through hoops just to have a good time not get shut down for BS reasons...
 
GenIke said:
That's the technicality that used here. my lhbs brewed with a 100 gallon pot in a mini mall parking lot without issue. People who showed up filled their fermenters with wort and added yeast on their own.
Click to expand...

Yep, I think we're good to go as far as brewing goes. Maybe if I do get "in trouble" by the police I can be a landmark case that will forever shape the future of brewing in public. lol. (Most likely they'll use me as an example and pass a law in all 50 states forbidding it.. 'Merica..)

Phunhog said:
I would just say you are making non-alcoholic beer...which technically at that point you are. I can't imagine anyone would give you grief over that.
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm pretty confident we'll be fine. I'll keep the statute with definitions printed out just in case.

I paid for the pavilion and asked about beer: it's fine (even kegs). They're going to call me back about the propane burners, which I think would be fine since they already have a built in grill and brick fireplace at the pavilion.
 

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