need help cloning a recipe

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bmason1623

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Hello everyone. I'm a newbie brewer who recently graduated to AG. I was wondering if anyone can direct me in the proper direction in cloning my current favorite beer Goose Island Green Line Pale Ale. This beer is only served in Chicago bars on tap. It's a pale ale with a nice touch of hoppiness especially Amarillo hops. I know I can plug in ingredients into Beersmith to replicate the IBUs but that would really be just an uninformed guess. I guess my question is how would one begin without doing things all 'nilly willy'? I have provided a link to the beer in question. TIA

http://www.gooseisland.com/pages/green_line_pale_ale/93.php
 
Not only did this article help me to get a handle on cloning, but it lifted me up exponentially in terms of regular recipe creation as well.

It is the introductory article in the byo 150 clone beers edition.

How to Clone, by Chris Colby. BYO magazine.
 
Ok, here is what I've come up with so far. I will try brewing this this weekend maybe. I also need to go to Goose Island and buy a growler once my batch is ready to be "tested". This is the best part. :)

Recipe: Green line Clone
Style: American Pale Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (hopefully great!)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Boil Size: 7.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.050 SG
Estimated Color: 3.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 30.0 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
10.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 100.00 %
0.50 oz Liberty [4.30 %] (30 min) Hops 5.5 IBU
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (15 min) Hops 10.8 IBU
0.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] (10 min) Hops 8.5 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] (10 min) Hops 5.2 IBU
5.50 gal Chicago, IL Water
1 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [Starter Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 10.00 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
60 min Mash In Add 12.50 qt of water at 165.9 F 154.0 F
 
I'm very interested in how this will turn out, so please post results. I live in Iowa, but go to Chicago a couple times a year and always make a stop in Goose Island. A bit off topic, but their belgian IPA, Mynx, inspired me to make my own bipa which turned out great. Back to topic, I have been tinkering around with a recipe of a Green Line inspired APA myself. I am at work and don't have access to my hop sched or IBUs, but I was planning on doing something very similar to what you are doing but I know I had the Liberty and Columbus swapped. Again, please post your results so myself and others can learn from this. I plan on brewing my "test" batch sometime in Feb.
 
I just finished kegging my GL attempt this evening after 13 days in a primary. My gravities were: OG:1.048 FG:1.009 (5% ABV). The color was a nice yellow/orange. The hydrometer sample tasted more "green" than hoppy or malty, but I did pick up the subtle Amarillo taste through the "greeness". I'm hoping that 2 more weeks in the keg at 11 PSI @36F will settle out the "green" flavor and let the hops shine through; the carbonation will help also. I'm thinking that even if it's not GL it'll still be decent and an easy beer to make. Will post again in 2 weeks or so.
 
I made the clone that you attempted, the only difference was that I used 1 ounce of amarillo and 1 ounce of Simcoe and I think that I nailed it.
It has primaried for 14 days now and when I tasted it, the hops seemed correct.
In the video that used to be on their site the brewmaster stated the he tried to get the amarillo and simcoe to come through so thats why I decided to go with the full ounce.
 
To those who've attempted this clone, did your attempts have the biscuit character that the Green Line has from 2 row only? I was going to try this over the summer, but with a handful of biscuit or victory malt.
 
bourgeoisbee said:
To those who've attempted this clone, did your attempts have the biscuit character that the Green Line has from 2 row only? I was going to try this over the summer, but with a handful of biscuit or victory malt.

Both of my batches did not have the biscuit flavor. In reading the GI website they mentioned that they only used pale malt which I interpreted (perhaps incorrectly) that they only used 2-row which is what I did. The flavor wasn't to my liking let alone similar to green line. Not to mention that I can't figure out the hop schedule which is what I think is going to make or break this clone. Another important thing I should mention is that the last time I tried green line about a month or two ago it didn't seem to taste the way I remembered it the first few times I tried it. Maybe it was just me I don't know.
 
I think that I came kind of close by using only 10 pounds of Gambrinus Pale Ale Malt. I really enjoyed the clone that I made of this beer. While not 100% spot on to Green Line I would say that I got 90% of the way there. Its by far my favorite beer that I have made so far.
 
I brewed the recipe below yesterday. I'll let you know how it turned out in about 5 weeks after it's carbed up. I just read something about Amarillo and Simcoe being the two aroma hops, so next time I might put them in at 10min or flame out and push the Columbus back to 15 minutes. I want to try a little dry hop, but I will probably leave it as is this time to get a base and tweak from.

10 lb 2 Row - Briess
.5 lb Biscuit
.25 lb Carapils

.5 oz Hallertau (45 min) - I didn't have Liberty on hand
1 oz Simcoe (15 min)
.5 oz Columbus (10 min)
1 oz Amarillo (10 min)

wlp001
 
I want to resurrect this thread as I plan on trying to clone Green Line with my next batch. Bourgeoisbee, how did yours turn out? Same to you Sean0301, I want to know your exact recipe to see if I can try to get it even closer to that 100% clone we are all always shooting for!

Unfortunately I am still doing extract batches. I do believe that Goose Island is only using the Pale Ale Malt because with their other beers it lists any specialty malts as well, the Green Line only lists the Pale Malt. I am going to take into consideration Bourgeoisbee's note that they are using the Amarillo and Simcoe as the two aroma hops. As for the Columbus, I read in a Hop Guide that these are excellent for dry hopping so that is all I am going to use them for. As for the Liberty, I am going to use it as the bittering hop because of the low Alpha Acid %. I have a pretty crazy hop schedule but that's just me trying to get as close as I can to the IBU count while trying to make sure that the Amarillo stands out most (I always noticed the flowery aroma first when drinking Green Line, and this was the only hop where I saw that in the description.) Let me know what you guys think.

Est Original Gravity: 1.050 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.012 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.0 %
Bitterness: 30.3 IBUs
Est Color: 7.0 SRM

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
4.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 3.7 %
2 lbs Light Dry Extract [Boil for 60 min](8.0 Dry Extract 2 29.6 %
0.50 oz Liberty [4.30 %] - Boil 45.0 min Hop 3 4.8 IBUs
4 lbs 8.0 oz Pale Liquid Extract [Boil for 15 min](8. Extract 4 66.7 %
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 5 4.7 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 3.9 IBUs
0.75 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 7 4.7 IBUs
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 8 2.1 IBUs
1.0 pkg American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [124.21 Yeast 9 -
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Primary 3.0 days) Other 10 -
0.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Dry Hop Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
 
My version turned out great, but wasn't cloned. I was the most off on it needing more biscuit flavor and aroma. I think using Pale Malt instead of 2 Row would help, but I'd steep some biscuit too. I didn't dry hop since I was concerned about not masking the malt and kettle hops to try to see if on attempt one I cloned the base of the recipe, but my version would have been closer if I had dry hopped. Your recipe looks like a step in the right direction from my attempt. I might dry hop with a little Simcoe too, but be sure it's not a batch that has the cat piss aroma to it - you can smell it in the hop pellets. I'm curious to hear about your results; it looks great.
 
Great, thanks for the info. I've never used the biscuit malt before, how much would you recommend? 4oz, 8oz, full 1lb.? I appreciate it.
 
has anyone asked them? tell them you are a homebrewer, give them your best shot at their recipe. i've done it twice, with Yard's in Philly and Brooklyn Brewery. They were both extremely helpful. Unless you just like figuring it out on your own.
 
Akimbo, I may just go and do that this weekend if I am able to stop by. I have thought about it but part of the fun is trying to do it on your own, just like you said. Makes you feel damn good if you nail it!! :mug:
 
Any updates on this? Just had Green Line at PJ Clarke's last night - I'm hooked, it was delicous. I'd love to brew something similar - my family would love it.
 
I just saw your question about how much Biscuit Malt to use. I would try 8oz. That wasn't enough when I used 2 Row as my base malt, but I think would be a good start if you're going to use Pale Malt/Extract.
 
Yeah unfortunately my LHBS didn't have the necessary ingredients for me to try my cloning recipe. So I am going to make EdWort's Bee Cave Haus Pale Ale with my next batch. I thought that would help me get an idea of some of the hops and schedules being that this is my first ever Pale Ale batch. Then I plan to make any adjustments and try the Green Line clone. Perhaps early January I will try it and I will definitely make sure to post the recipe I use and the results.

Mmmm.... Green Line. I need to head out somewhere this weekend and have me a few of those! :tank:
 
I emailed Goose Island; they confirmed a few things:

  • 100% Briess Pale Ale Malt (NOT 2-row, there is a difference Briess Malt & Ingredients Co.: Base Malts) ...and no biscuit/carapils
  • Bittering w/Liberty at 30mins
  • Amarillo armoa addition right before knockout

So, based on their input and the recipes above, they said the recipe below should be a "reasonable facsimilie of Greenline"

10.5# Briess Pale Ale Malt
0.5oz Liberty (30min, 6 IBU)
0.5oz Simcoe (15min, 12 IBU)
0.5oz Columbus (10min, 9 IBU)
1.0oz Amarillo (0min, 1 IBU)
5.0% ABV w/75% effciency & attenuation
~30 IBU

I hope to brew it in the next few weeks and will let you know if its any good.

Cheers.
 
Great! If they bitter at 30 minutes, that makes me think they do a significant whirlpool. I'd guess 30 minutes or so, which is common on a commercial system. I still think they dry hop it based on my attempt, but I'm really curious on how this recipe turns out. The simplest recipes can be the toughest to clone sometimes.
 
Thanks for getting that info from Goose Island. The recipe looks really good. Let us know how it turns out and if you would make any further changes for the next batch. I'm brewing EdWort's Pale Ale tomorrow so I will probably hold off until March or so to do the Green Line clone.

Can't wait to hear the results!
 
10.5# Briess Pale Ale Malt
0.5oz Liberty (30min, 6 IBU)
0.5oz Simcoe (15min, 12 IBU)
0.5oz Columbus (10min, 9 IBU)
1.0oz Amarillo (0min, 1 IBU)
5.0% ABV w/75% effciency & attenuation
~30 IBU

I hope to brew it in the next few weeks and will let you know if its any good.

Alright guys, I took a crack at this, sort of. I had a ton of Briess 2-row around and no Pale Ale Malt, so I went with the cost-effective option and used what I already had. The Pale Ale malt is what makes this beer, so I realize I made something totally different by subbing it, but the price was right. I compensated somewhat by adding a 1/2# biscuit and 1/2# caravienne. I followed the same hop schedule.

Primaried for 2 weeks in low 60s using washed WLP008 (again, this is what I had around, the price was right). Primed to 2.5vol CO2 and bottled on Thursday. 1.058 OG, 1.012 FG and ~25 IBU.

Hydro samples tasted awesome. Definitely miss the pale ale base malt, but still delicious malt backbone. Remember the yellow/orange crayon? About that color. And the hops - wow. Loaded with hop flavor & aroma - much more than the actual greenline, but very tasty nonetheless. Just enough bitterness to keep it from being too sweet. Very excited to try this conditioned in a few weeks. Good recipe. Next time I'll definitely use the pale ale malt though.
 
Will be brewing this on Sunday. Got all the ingredients though it was tough to locate some Simcoe hops. But found some leaf at LHBS.
 
Toastman said:
Will be brewing this on Sunday. Got all the ingredients though it was tough to locate some Simcoe hops. But found some leaf at LHBS.

I just stocked up on some simcoe from northern brewer. 1oz bags but still, they had some. Bought enough to keep me in good shape until harvest...I hope. I am anxious to hear how this recipe turns out, please keep us posted.
 
Will be brewing this on Sunday. Got all the ingredients though it was tough to locate some Simcoe hops. But found some leaf at LHBS.

Awesome! Which LHBS do you go to? I've been to a few around the area and they've been hit or miss

Brewer's Coop (@Two Brothers Brewery) is by far the cheapest, but very poorly & sporadically stocked. But they sell "expired" white labs yeast for $3 each.

Chicagoland Winemakers in Elmhurst is OK, but pricey for equipment and ok selection for basic malts & hops.

HomeBrewShop in St. Charles is they most well-stocked by far, with decent prices for grain & equipment. $2/oz for hops and $8.50 for yeast though.

Haven't been to the Fox Valley one yet...it's pretty far from Wheaton.
Same with the various Brew & Grows, but I've heard great things about them.
 
TyTanium said:
Same with the various Brew & Grows, but I've heard great things about them.

The one in Roselle is excellent. Their grain turnover could be better, but they've got a good hardware selection, and their yeast are always within the expiration date (and if not they'll give it to you for free. They gave me a free pacmam because it was old.)
 
Nice! Thanks...I'll have to check that one out. Turns out its actually the closest one to me, but looks the furtherst on the map which I why I haven't been there yet, go figure.
 
So I just cracked open my first bottle of this. Recipe changed to fit what I had:

9 lbs 2 Row
1 lb 2 row baked on cooking sheet @ 325 for 30 minutes (biscuit malt?)
1 lb corn sugar
1 oz Cascade @ 30 minutes
.5 oz Amarillo @ 15 min
.5 oz Amarillo @ 10 min
Dry Hopped 1 oz Amarillo in Primary

My hop schedule doesn't fit Goose island's website, but the IBU's match and the aroma is pretty close as are the IBU's. I remembered a little more hop flavor in a fresh green line than this one had.

This was the first time using my new mashtun so I missed my numbers by a lot and ended up having to add the pound of corn sugar to hit 1.050.

I went to the bar immediately after tasting this and tried a pint of Green Line and damn were they close. My BMC drinking friends love this beer
 
I emailed Goose Island; they confirmed a few things:

  • 100% Briess Pale Ale Malt (NOT 2-row, there is a difference Briess Malt & Ingredients Co.: Base Malts) ...and no biscuit/carapils
  • Bittering w/Liberty at 30mins
  • Amarillo armoa addition right before knockout

So, based on their input and the recipes above, they said the recipe below should be a "reasonable facsimilie of Greenline"

10.5# Briess Pale Ale Malt
0.5oz Liberty (30min, 6 IBU)
0.5oz Simcoe (15min, 12 IBU)
0.5oz Columbus (10min, 9 IBU)
1.0oz Amarillo (0min, 1 IBU)
5.0% ABV w/75% effciency & attenuation
~30 IBU

I hope to brew it in the next few weeks and will let you know if its any good.

Cheers.

I brewed this exact recipie at the end of December and as of this weekend I would say that this is about as close as you can get. The minute I added the last hops addition that green line smell was evident, and the first one off of the tap didn't disappoint. The only difference in mine from the receipie above is that I used Rahr Pale Ale Malt but i dont think it made a difference. If you love green line I would go forward with this one in a minute. I will try to post a picture when I get a chance.
 
Dude! That's awesome! Glad to hear good results.

The Pale Ale malt is what makes it...I used 2 row (b/c that's what I had) with biscuit and caravienna and it gets lost in the hops. Looking forward to your pics.
 
Glad to hear people are getting close! I'll be attempting a clone this weekend with extract, will update as I progress through it.

LHBS in Fox Valley/Aurora was not huge but seemed to have all the basics, it's where I got my basic kit. Two Brother's didn't have much and I hear their homebrew section is getting worse and worse. Going to Bolingbrook Brew &Rec Grow this week and will comment on their selection, they're the closest for me (actually live in Bolingbrook).
 
The Brew and Grow will do much nicer for you. Lots of grain selection, not sure on the extract. You know what they say...phone first.
 
The Brew and Grow will do much nicer for you. Lots of grain selection, not sure on the extract. You know what they say...phone first.

Funny story about extract at Brew and Grow. I was there a few weekends ago; a guy goes up to the counter with 20# of DME and 10# of corn sugar and asks "which yeast gives me the highest ABV?" The look on the guy behind the counter was priceless. /facepalm

And +1 for selection at Brew & Grow. Well-stocked, competitive prices.
 
Just got back from Brew and Grow. They had a bunch of grain and plenty of equipment. Their extract selection was ok, not a huge variety of LME, but all flavors of Muntons DME and a couple of Briess. Hop selection and yeast selection seemed good. It was inventory day so can't speak on normal inventory, shelves were empty but they had everything I asked for in the back.

Definitely good place to pick stuff up but as a new brewer I didn't get a super warm and fuzzy feeling. Bob behind the counter was AWESOME, gave me a beer tasting and talked about my recipe and helped me tinker, wish I had talked to him first. Said that if it wasn't inventory day he'd have more time but that "they" would get mad about him not doing his job if he spent too much time with me. The manager was the first to approach me when I asked for help..he showed me where everything was but emphasized three times that they were a "self service" brew shop and really gave me the idea that I was on my own.

Not a huge deal, it WAS inventory day so I understand being busy, but IMO the biggest advantage a brick and mortar has over online is personal interaction. If Bob hadn't been there I probably wouldn't be going back unless I was pressed for time and really needed something, he saved it for me though. Hope he's there the next time I'm looking to talk to someone.
 
Just got back from Brew and Grow. They had a bunch of grain and plenty of equipment. Their extract selection was ok, not a huge variety of LME, but all flavors of Muntons DME and a couple of Briess. Hop selection and yeast selection seemed good. It was inventory day so can't speak on normal inventory, shelves were empty but they had everything I asked for in the back.

Definitely good place to pick stuff up but as a new brewer I didn't get a super warm and fuzzy feeling. Bob behind the counter was AWESOME, gave me a beer tasting and talked about my recipe and helped me tinker, wish I had talked to him first. Said that if it wasn't inventory day he'd have more time but that "they" would get mad about him not doing his job if he spent too much time with me. The manager was the first to approach me when I asked for help..he showed me where everything was but emphasized three times that they were a "self service" brew shop and really gave me the idea that I was on my own.

Not a huge deal, it WAS inventory day so I understand being busy, but IMO the biggest advantage a brick and mortar has over online is personal interaction. If Bob hadn't been there I probably wouldn't be going back unless I was pressed for time and really needed something, he saved it for me though. Hope he's there the next time I'm looking to talk to someone.

I know we're off topic here but which one did you go to? I like the newer one on Morgan much, much more than the Kedzie location. A lot more parking and the guys/gals there are much more helpful or at least try to be much more helpful than the bunch on Kedzie. $0.02
 
bmason1623 said:
I know we're off topic here but which one did you go to? I like the newer one on Morgan much, much more than the Kedzie location. A lot more parking and the guys/gals there are much more helpful or at least try to be much more helpful than the bunch on Kedzie. $0.02

Ah, I live out in the burbs. Went to the one in Bolingbrook, haven't checked out any in the city yet.
 
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