Q about pumpkin flavor

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TheMan

TheMan

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I resisted creating this topic...but I cannot for the life of me find the answer after days, and hours, of searching. Most topics are on Pumpkin "spice" beer.

I want beer with very strong pumpkin flavor, less spices. Would adding more pumpkin do this? Or is there really very little flavor added from the pumpkin? I want to just use canned pumpkin. Most recipes call for 3-4 pounds. I'm thinking of using 5-6 pounds, spread on baking sheet and baked to carmelize. I will put very little spice, maybe half what is used in most recipes. The base for my recipe is the Thunderstruck Pumpkin Ale. I plan to strain the pumpkin out to minimize trub in primary. Does this take away pumpkin flavor?

Is this worth it? Or am I just not going to notice the flavor much?

As I said, I've been searching and can't find these exact answers. If you can point me to a thread that has them I would be just as happy. Thanks!
 
There is very little flavor from pumpkin alone. That's why the spices are added. Take a pumpkin, slice it open, roast it, then cool it and taste. It'll be pretty bland. Add the spices and, there ya go! In fact, I don't add any real pumpkin to my pumpkin ale - just the spices. That's what you taste and, more importantly, smell when you have a slice of pumpkin pie or anything with pumpkin added.
 
hmm...but if you added enough pumpkin would that help the pumpkin flavor? I've been trying various pumpkin beers lately and I like the ones with less spice and more of what I percieve to be the pumpkin flavor. Say I went WAY overkill on canned pumpkin?
 
Maybe I am doing exactly as you say Bobby, maybe what I think is the pumpkin is the pumpkin pie spices. Guess I'll try a few more and decide. I like zucchini and eggplant, but feel pumpkin has more flavor than both. Even though yes, a more bland flavor.
 
I want to post this in case others need the information, hopefully they find it. I bought a can of pumpkin to taste test. I tried it raw, raw+pumpkin pie spice, baked, and baked + pumpkin pie spice.

Raw vs. Raw w/ spice: Raw it tastes like a bit more flavorful zucchini, as stated by Bobby. Pretty bland. With the spice it adds a little and it does lend the "pumpkin pie" taste.

Baked vs. Baked w/spice: Baking it brings out more flavor in the pumpkin. You can tell a difference vs. raw. And with the spice it has more "pumpkin pie" flavor.

So basically the spice adds pumpkin pie flavor. While alone it just has a pumpkin taste, maybe not strong enough to get much flavor out of it in a beer.

I also tasted the spice by itself. I don't see how just using the spice can give you a pumpkin beer. It tastes like it would just give a pumpkin spice beer...which is what others have wanted. Combining it with the pumpkin seems the way to go, especially if you want the pumpkin pie taste.

All of this is before actually making a beer with it. But the flavors should remain similar when used in the beer.

Myself, i decided that I will use a larger amount of pumpkin than normal and put spice on the pumpkin while baking it. I have never read this done, so I'd like to know how it does. I'll update you guys if anyone cares haha. I did eat an entire can of pumpkin to test this...mmmm....I like pumpkin.
 
I too seem to enjoy the pumpkin beers with less spices. Seems like some of the pumpkin beers have a lot of clove in them. I looked at my pumpkin pie recipe and there is no clove in there, so I brew my pumpkin beers without clove. I also roast 2 pie pumpkins (about 5-5.5 lbs after removed from shell) at 375 for about 90 minutes, scoop it out of the shell, and put it in the mash. I add my spices with 1 or 2 minutes left in the boil.
 
From the many different variations of pumpkin ales I've tasted over the years, I think that the best flavors will come from canned pumpkin. I also agree with the above posts, in that, most of the flavors come from the spices ... pumpkin is a very bland flavor and if you use raw pumpkin, will impart a vegatal flavor to the beer if used too much.

I'd use canned pumpkin and just a bit of spice, as the spices can be quickly be overpowering, be careful.

~r~
 
A lot of people cant taste the pumpkin in beer or pie for that matter.Personaly I can and enjoy a lot of pumpkin flavor.That said I like the spices too.So yeah throw in a bunch of pumpkin in the mash or if your doing extract in the last 10 mins of the boil and see if you like it.
 
Why the last ten minutes vs. the entire boil? And what is a "bunch" of pumpkin to you? I really enjoy the pumpkin flavor as well, more so than the spices.
 
TheMan said:
Why the last ten minutes vs. the entire boil? And what is a "bunch" of pumpkin to you? I really enjoy the pumpkin flavor as well, more so than the spices.
Click to expand...

You will loose less flavor with less boil time.As for the amount that is up to youI just made one with 2 lbs. in the mash(mostly for color) and 2 lbs. at the end of the boil.It's still conditioning,but it is very pumpkiny:cross:
 
I'm a big fan of pumpkin pie, but not a fan of any of the spices that make up pumpkin pie spice, which is kind of strange. If a pie has too much of any of them, I'm not a fan, and I think that the pumpkin pie spice beers I've had are too much spice. I will have to agree that pumpkin has little flavor on it's own.

That being said, I think that the pumpkin is going to add some mouth feel to the beer, and give it some real body, which I don't think it would get with just the spice.

I did the extract version of Thundersrtuck's pumpkin beer, and I'm really anxious to try it. I think I said on the 23rd that it'll be ready, but I don't actually remember why. I may try one this weekend.

I did hear one tip about doing a all grain pumpkin beer, the LHBS guy said to add it on top of the mash, and don't let it get to the bottom of the mash, which will speed up sparging. I may give that a try next year.
 
wonder what would happen in you made pie filling and added it, or even baked the filling first since this is the flavor you are looking for
 
didn't see all that many pumpkin beers at the GABF this year. Found a bunch last year. And my favorite didn't have any pumpkin in it at all. Just the spices.

most squash is pretty bland without the spice. Focus on your spice mixture.
 
TheMan said:
I want to post this in case others need the information, hopefully they find it. I bought a can of pumpkin to taste test. I tried it raw, raw+pumpkin pie spice, baked, and baked + pumpkin pie spice.

Raw vs. Raw w/ spice: Raw it tastes like a bit more flavorful zucchini, as stated by Bobby. Pretty bland. With the spice it adds a little and it does lend the "pumpkin pie" taste.

Baked vs. Baked w/spice: Baking it brings out more flavor in the pumpkin. You can tell a difference vs. raw. And with the spice it has more "pumpkin pie" flavor.

So basically the spice adds pumpkin pie flavor. While alone it just has a pumpkin taste, maybe not strong enough to get much flavor out of it in a beer.

I also tasted the spice by itself. I don't see how just using the spice can give you a pumpkin beer. It tastes like it would just give a pumpkin spice beer...which is what others have wanted. Combining it with the pumpkin seems the way to go, especially if you want the pumpkin pie taste.

All of this is before actually making a beer with it. But the flavors should remain similar when used in the beer.

Myself, i decided that I will use a larger amount of pumpkin than normal and put spice on the pumpkin while baking it. I have never read this done, so I'd like to know how it does. I'll update you guys if anyone cares haha. I did eat an entire can of pumpkin to test this...mmmm....I like pumpkin.
Click to expand...


Hmmm. You know you will use pumpkin, regardless. You asked, and everyone told you that pumpkin was unnecessary. You tested, and you confirmed. You can't add more pumpkin to get more pumpkin flavor because, as you know, based on your own great testing, pumpkin doesn't taste good alone! So, after all that, you decide to add more pumpkin to get that "great pumpkin flavor". Wow.

Me, I skipped the pumpkin and concentrated on making a beer big enough, with some malty backbone, to support the the pie spices. It is nearly done fermenting and (if I say so myself) is so far awesome. And I have critically tasted a fair selection of pumpkin beers to know what I like.
 
passedpawn said:
Hmmm. You know you will use pumpkin, regardless. You asked, and everyone told you that pumpkin was unnecessary. You tested, and you confirmed. You can't add more pumpkin to get more pumpkin flavor because, as you know, based on your own great testing, pumpkin doesn't taste good alone! So, after all that, you decide to add more pumpkin to get that "great pumpkin flavor". Wow.
Click to expand...

Jeez, I almost slipped in that sarcasm. :cross:

Anyway, that's not particularly nice or accurate. TheMan said:
i decided that I will use a larger amount of pumpkin than normal and put spice on the pumpkin while baking it
Click to expand...

So he's going with a larger amount of pumpkin and spice, not just adding more pumpkin. Myself, I don't particularly care for pumpkin spice beer, and I do think the pumpkin adds something to it.

I will give you credit though, a bigger beer with pumpkin spice may be a good path to take. I would be curious to see how that comes out.
 
MikeScott said:
I will give you credit though, a bigger beer with pumpkin spice may be a good path to take. I would be curious to see how that comes out.
Click to expand...
Me too. I am not usually impressed with what comes out of the hydrometer, but this was good.

I drank every pumpkin beer I could find just before I made mine. I thought a lot about the ones I liked (i.e., Weyerbacher) and the the ones that I didn't (i.e., Buffaflo Bill). Then I crafted a beer I thought would make it good for me. We'll see; I will bottle in a week.

I did not use pumpkin. I had originally intended to, but there was too much evidence that it was not necessary. But, meh, I've been wrong before!
 
Thanks for helping keep my point in tact MikeScott.

Passedpawn - I never said pumpkin didn't taste good...I wouldn't have eaten the entire can if it wasn't good to me. It does have a taste to me, however bland. And as stated, I am not a fan of highly spiced beers. I tried the spice by itself and it doesn't taste right. Try the two seperately, then try them together...it's a whole different taste than either alone. Even if you think pumpkin has no flavor you can't deny that the taste of the two in combination isn't different than the two alone. It does need the pumpkin to give it the right flavor, and by this I suppose I mean the right flavor for me.

Then I crafted a beer I thought would make it good for me.
Click to expand...
This is exactly what I'm trying to do with mine. I just wanted a little input before finalizing my recipe. And I got some good answers.

If my beer doesn't come out as planned, then perhaps I will give your idea a try. The bigger beer with just spices might work as well. I'd be interested in hearing how yours came out.
 
One thing I forgot, the local brewery makes a pumpkin ale, and although I haven't tried it yet, they grill pumpkins for their beer. I thought that might lend a great flavor. Once they release the beer, I'll have to sample it, and report back here.
 
Wow, that sounds cool. I will be brewing this on Monday, so I'll keep you updated.
 
I'm relatively new to homebrewing, but I've decided to brew a pumpkin beer in time for fall. It's in the primary right now. What I did was add 73oz(about 4.5 lbs, 2x 29oz cans plus 1x 15oz can) of canned pumpkin to a True Brew brown ale kit. I used the thunderstruck recipe as a guide, adding the pumpkin at the beginning of the boil. I tasted it before pitching the yeast and it definitely had a distinct squash-y pumpkin flavor, plus hops and unfermented DME sugars. I am optimistic as to how it will turn out but it definitely needs the spices to give it that classic fall pumpkin ale flavor. What is the best way to add the spices to the beer? The Thunderstruck recipe advocates making a "tea" and adding that during secondary fermentation. Does this mean filtering the solid spice particles out of the tea and simply adding the liquids, or does the tea extract enough flavor and aroma to simply dump the whole thing in there and let the solids settle out?

Thanks!
 
I made the tea, and dumped the whole thing in there, and figured it would just settle out. I haven't opened any yet, but at bottling it looked like everything had settled. Of course, take that with a grain of salt :)
 
Just added gelatin to mine, so (of course) had a taste. Really lovely. It is going to be a winner. Should I have added pumpkin (grilled, sautéed, par boiled, baked): dunno.

I don't call it a pumpkin beer anymore... it's a holiday cheer beer. 8% and hiding it... not detectable at all. No hotness there. Happy about this one.
 
This has been an intresting thread. I made a Pumpkin Abbey and it was a big hit but I used a fair amount of spices along with five pounds of pumpkin in the mash.

Something I didn't see as well the pumpkin adds a nice "pumpkin" color to the beer.

Also I believe the clove flavor is not cloves but corriander. A lot of pumpkin recipes call for corriander.
 
rwinzing said:
This has been an intresting thread. I made a Pumpkin Abbey and it was a big hit but I used a fair amount of spices along with five pounds of pumpkin in the mash.

Something I didn't see as well the pumpkin adds a nice "pumpkin" color to the beer.

Also I believe the clove flavor is not cloves but corriander. A lot of pumpkin recipes call for corriander.
Click to expand...

Happen to have a link to the recipe for the Pumkin Abbey by chance?

I tried my Thunderstruck pumkin Ale last night. It's still a few weeks early, and I think I'll reserve judgement. It does have a nice color though!
 
So here is an update, with a humorous twist. I brewed my pumpkin ale yesterday...I had decided on 5 pounds of canned pumpkin and 2 tsp pumpkin pie spice. I must have had a dumb moment, because while at the store I bought 5 LARGE cans of it, when I looked at the label I saw 1 lb. and did not see that it was indeed 1 lb 13 oz. haha. So I had baked 9 pounds of pumpkin before my friend said, "I thought you were just doing 5 pounds? These cans are almost 2 pounds each." I didn't want to waste it, so it ALL went in. So I put a third in at 30 minutes left in the boil, then another third at 20 minutes, then another third at 10 minutes. One of the sheets of pumpkin was spiced with 1/2 tsp pumpkin pie spice. Then at the 10 min. mark I put in 1 1/2 tsp of spice.

I knew beforehand that the cans were 29 oz. but just had a brain fart or something...oh well, it was funny and could turn out awesome. So this is an unintentionally SUPER pumpkin ale. It tasted amazing, and was VERY orange. The smell was awesome too! I'm sure some of you will want to know how this turns out, so i'll be sure to update you. It tasted very pumpkiny like I wanted.
 
Yeah, I have not seen any recipes with that much pumpkin either. It was an accident, so I can't say it was a bright idea. I ended up with 7 1/2 gallons, lower gravity than intended, but still acceptable. If it tastes good I will modify to get more gravity next time.
 
I've heard the yams work as well. I may try them out in the future. This brew was a lot of fun, so perhaps I will do it sooner than later...I'm also thinking of experimenting with pecans after having the Abita Harvest Ale...maybe thinking pecan pumpkin/sweet potato.
 
I know this is kind of a blast from the past now, but how did everyone's beer turn out? If the verdict is a thumbs up, can I get the recipes / a link to the recipe?

The Thunderstruck pumpkin that I made just isn't very good. It's drinkable, if you've had a few already. It's improved over time, so I'm still nursing them along to see if they get better. I'm not much of a beer judge, so I can't be real specific, I just didn't particularly like it. After the 2nd month of bottle conditioning, it started getting some cinnamon flavor coming through, so I'm hoping it gets better with time.

I have been having a issue with a common taste, house flavor if you prefer, in all of my beers. I was trying to eliminate it, and I think it comes down to the peroxide based sanitizer I was using, IO Star. I've since switched to Star San, and that flavor has gone away. Unfortunately, I brewed this pumpkin ale before I switched sanitizers.

Anyway, hope to hear back from you guys.
 
Mikescott,
Mine turned out decent...after a LONG time in the bottle. I think it was slightly infected. But it is mellowing out as time goes by. I try it every few weeks and it does get better and better. I'm by no means pleased with it. However, a review, it does have a pumpkin scent...and the pumpkin does come through a bit as I would expect with 9 pounds of pumpkin lol.

My friend I brew with also did a spice beer that turned out similar tasting and nothing special. I decided since then to step back and leave the spices to the commercial brewers for the moment. I'll revisit those types in time though.

I also switched to all-grain recently so I don't doubt the results would be better now.
 
TheMan said:
Mikescott,
Mine turned out decent...after a LONG time in the bottle. I think it was slightly infected. But it is mellowing out as time goes by. I try it every few weeks and it does get better and better. I'm by no means pleased with it. However, a review, it does have a pumpkin scent...and the pumpkin does come through a bit as I would expect with 9 pounds of pumpkin lol.

My friend I brew with also did a spice beer that turned out similar tasting and nothing special. I decided since then to step back and leave the spices to the commercial brewers for the moment. I'll revisit those types in time though.

I also switched to all-grain recently so I don't doubt the results would be better now.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply! I hope the beer continues to improve. Mine as well as yours.

My pumpkin was extract, and I heard that it's kind of hard to brew all grain with pumpkin. My wife bought me a recipe book that has a all grain pumpkin recipe in it, one where you use an actual pumpkin. There's also a pumpkin pie recipe that uses the pumpkin from the mash. I would like to give it a try.

Even though I brew all grain now, I'm still planning on brewing some more extract batches. You just can't beat the time savings.
 
I made the following beer and was VERY happy with it. Chewy, malty, and spicy. I gave one to my BIL who was down for Christmas, and his first comment was "Pumkin Pie!". There is no pumpkin in it. The spices are very prominent. My plan is to make this again in the summer. I will cut the spices down 25%.

PA270014.JPG


Joie De Vivre
Spice / Holiday Beer

Type: All Grain Date: 9/26/2009
Batch Size: 6.00 gal
Boil Size: 7.80 gal
Boil Time: 90 min


Ingredients
Amount Item Type % or IBU
0.40 lb Rice Hulls - 50# (1.8 SRM) Adjunct 2.06 %
8.00 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Malteurop (1.7 SRM) Grain 41.24 %
4.00 lb White Wheat Malt (2.5 SRM) Grain 20.62 %
3.00 lb Munich Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 15.46 %
2.00 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 10.31 %
1.00 lb Melanoiden Malt (28.0 SRM) Grain 5.15 %
1.00 lb Victory Malt (28.0 SRM) Grain 5.15 %
0.50 oz Tradition [5.00 %] (90 min) Hops 6.2 IBU
1.00 oz Tradition [5.00 %] (30 min) Hops 8.9 IBU
2.00 oz Clove Spice (powder) (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
2.00 oz Nutmeg (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
4.00 oz Cinnamon Spice (powder) (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs Scottish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1728) [Starter 2000 ml] Yeast-Ale


Beer Profile
Measured Original Gravity: 1.090 SG
Measured Final Gravity: 1.029 SG
Actual Alcohol by Vol: 8.00 %
Bitterness: 15.0 IBU Calories: 423 cal/pint
Est Color: 16.0 SRM
 
passedpawn said:
I made the following beer and was VERY happy with it. Chewy, malty, and spicy. I gave one to my BIL who was down for Christmas, and his first comment was "Pumkin Pie!". There is no pumpkin in it. The spices are very prominent. My plan is to make this again in the summer. I will cut the spices down 25%.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the recipe and tasting report passedpawn! I'll have to give it a whirl.
 
Mine came out sort of "meh". Not great, but not terrible either. The mouthfeel was conspicuously thin, and the spices had somewhat of a bitter edge to them. I'm blaming this on the brown ale kit that the beer was based on. Next time I'll figure out my own malt bill and probably cut back on the spices a tad. Anyone know some good tips for improving the body of a beer?
 

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