Where do you weigh in- Topic of almost 0 importance

As the title of the thread implies, this matter is almost completely unimportant. My annoyance registers somewhere around a 2, meaning it is over almost as quickly as it started. No waiter or pretty little heads were harmed in the making of this thread. I just wonder if anyone else feels the same way about this admittedly unimportant topic.

Whenever I have ordered certain dishes, most notedly brisket of beef noodle soup in Chinatowns throughout the country (this has happened, with the same soup, in several New York restaurants, once in Boston, and once in San Francisco) the waiter takes it upon himself or herself to let me know why I might not like it.

When ordering spicy pig kidney last year, for example, the waitress asked me if I knew what kidneys were. I did. She took it one step farther in bringing out the restaurant owner who spoke fluent English, just in case she hadnt gotten her point across. About 10 minutes into the meal the owner came back out to make sure I didnt want him to take the dish away.

There are two ways to look at these behaviors, I think. You can either see it as vague racism, asssuming that a very obviously caucasian english-speaker would have certain expectations when eating food, precluding certain flavors and foods, or you could just see it as good service. I suppose there is a guy out there who might order the kidney by accident, not knowing what it is.

My question is this, should the waiter caution diners that what they are ordering might be out of the usual realm of what they most likely have consumed, or should they mind their own business and stay silent on the matter?

For the record, I never snark regarding this, and tips are not at all affected. Just a little eye rolling when the waiter leaves.

For the record, I enjoy your "thoughts of the day."

My first question is what prompted the waiter/owner to feel like he needs to disclose...it would seem to imply he's received complaints about this dish in the past and/or had upset customers. So, in an effort to prevent that from happening again, he/she feels its necessary to disclose. Just a guess.

I'd say, "Thanks for letting me know, and yes I still want it."

Thanks, I was getting worried that I was annoying some folks.

Every time I have ordered the brisket soup (its fabulous by the way) they always warn me that there is fat. Apparently some people really dislike fat on a cut of meat that is inherantly fatty... lol.

Brisket soup seems like a stretch, but with kidney dishes I can see them making sure you knew what you were getting into. I've seen a few mexican restaurants give me weird looks for ordering beef tongue or cheek tacos.

I've had this happen many times. I attribute it like Ty said, to previous diners ordering the dish and not liking it or complaining. Restaurants don't want you to have a bad experience. After 20 people order the brisket and complain, they just want to warn you in case you are one that would have complained.

Too many people are idiots these days (I.E. McDonalds, "the coffee was hot?") and expect the restaurant or whatever provider to make up for it. So unfortunately those of us that are up to snuff get treated as the lowest common denominator dictates.

I never take it as white guy racism, just them offering a friendly warning.

CreamyGoodness said:

As the title of the thread implies, this matter is almost completely unimportant.

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We're accustomed to that.

I would guess it's mostly due to previous customer complaints as others have mentioned. Restaurants obviously don't want unhappy customers, but they also don't want the lost revenue of someone sending a dish back because they weren't properly warned about the contents, heat, etc of a dish. I doubt it's a race issue. My guess is that they warn everyone that they don't recognize as a regular customer.

My guess is that they didn't want to have to throw it out.

Yep, suck it up. They have had too many idiots order it, assuring the staff that they can "handle any level of spicy!" only to send it back as inedible and then not only waste the restaraunts money, but probably to talk badly about the restaraunt for what was clearly their fault.

Just show your adeptness with chopsticks, tell them next time you would like it hotter, and next time they will remember you.

Thats really a good point cheezy, I hadnt thought of that. Btw, the place I mentioned with the pig kidney is in Flushing (which everyone knows is a superior Chinatown to Canal St. ;-), back me up on this Airbourneguy...) I forget the name but it had a lot of off-the-beaten-path dishes on the menu, which is why my friend and I went. After the mild hubbub with the pig kidney I continued ordering, and got a plate of ducks feet in scallion sauce for the table. The waitress literally sighed. I got a chuckle out of that.

If you are wondering, the dan-dan noodles were a 5 alarm fire (delicious too), the spicy kidney wasnt all that spicy but had lots of great flavor, and ducks feet are now officially not my favorite thing in the world to eat. Bland and hard to eat.

Unless I know the bartender already, nearly every time I order a sour beer, I get asked whether I know it's sour and if I really want it.

Sometimes I cut off the questions in advance. For example, I might mention how much I enjoy sour beers to the bartender or waitress before I make my selection.

weirdboy said:

Unless I know the bartender already, nearly every time I order a sour beer, I get asked whether I know it's sour and if I really want it.

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I have had this a few times as well. I always figured not everyone is a fan of sours and they want to be sure your happy.

CreamyGoodness said:

Thats really a good point cheezy, I hadnt thought of that. Btw, the place I mentioned with the pig kidney is in Flushing (which everyone knows is a superior Chinatown to Canal St. ;-), back me up on this Airbourneguy...) I forget the name but it had a lot of off-the-beaten-path dishes on the menu, which is why my friend and I went. After the mild hubbub with the pig kidney I continued ordering, and got a plate of ducks feet in scallion sauce for the table. The waitress literally sighed. I got a chuckle out of that.

If you are wondering, the dan-dan noodles were a 5 alarm fire (delicious too), the spicy kidney wasnt all that spicy but had lots of great flavor, and ducks feet are now officially not my favorite thing in the world to eat. Bland and hard to eat.

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I thought I was adventurous! Uni is the most exotic thingh I've eaten......or blood sausage for some people is adventurous.

Kidney?

Uh uh.

Lol.

Being a conniseur of spicy, I have seen people say " I can handle anything" only to eat a tiny piece of habanero or a sauce based on it, and start spraying spittle and foam and crying and proclaiming that NO ONE could eat that and that the restaraunt is irresponsible to serve it.


Your average american wants it bland, predictable, and unexciting, so the restaraunts have to cater to that.

Habenero's are nothing. Ghost peppers...yikes!

cheezydemon3 said:

Being a conniseur of spicy, I have seen people say " I can handle anything" only to eat a tiny piece of habanero or a sauce based on it, and start spraying spittle and foam and crying and proclaiming that NO ONE could eat that and that the restaraunt is irresponsible to serve it.


Your average american wants it bland, predictable, and unexciting, so the restaraunts have to cater to that.

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It would be nice also if restaurants could be consistent in their spice level or had a reasonable scale to describe what you want. I don't mind spicy, but I've had dishes made so hot I couldn't actually taste anything. One local place I go to I ordered a chicken dish spicy and it was WAY to much. Sure, if you were all about heat it was great, but it pretty much fried your taste buds and there was no flavor. I'd had what they considered the medium before and it was a good level of spice and could have been more. That's why I went with the spicy on my second order. I went back to the medium on my next visit and it seemed like they forgot to put in anything. It was flavorless for completely the opposite reason. I've pretty much given up on ordering that dish until they can figure out how to have some consistency with their product.

cheezydemon3 said:

Being a conniseur of spicy, I have seen people say " I can handle anything" only to eat a tiny piece of habanero or a sauce based on it, and start spraying spittle and foam and crying and proclaiming that NO ONE could eat that and that the restaraunt is irresponsible to serve it.


Your average american wants it bland, predictable, and unexciting, so the restaraunts have to cater to that.

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Ha! If you think Americans like their food bland, you should spend some time in Japan. Their definition of "spicy" tastes like ketchup to me.

Personally I can only use about a half of a scotch bonnet in a whole pot of beans without bleeding from my eyes. Basically, when I start getting hiccups I know its all over.

Basically the only thing I cant get my head around trying once is bugs. I've tried most organ meats and actually love a few of them. Menudo anyone? :rockin:

*Leaves door wide open for 1980s boy band references*

CreamyGoodness said:

Thanks, I was getting worried that I was annoying some folks.

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My annoyance registers somewhere around a 2, meaning it is over almost as quickly as it started.

I just audibly laughed.

CreamyGoodness said:

Basically the only thing I cant get my head around trying once is bugs.

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Now, I HAVE tried those, ant tea, waxworm moth larva, bee pupae, crickets, meal worms. Now that was a meal!!!

Oh, NKOTB Forever!!!!

I'd eat anything once, bugs too. I've not had any of the previously mentioned bugs, but I've eaten a scorpion lollipop...

I think anything out of the ordinary for certain cultures should be cautioned to the difference and what to expect if that makes sense? I think its a quality waiter or waitress to inform the customer what it may taste like and they are just letting you know to also cover themselves. The last thing they want if for you to order it, say its terrible than demand something else. I see your point but I don't think its racism, when I was around Europe many restaurants did the same thing to make sure I understood what it tasted like and what was in the food. On a related note, I think eating weird food is pretty awesome.

I was kind of mad at myself for not being able to try those crickets in Mexico (though, to be fair to myself, I might have hazarded a sample but would have been forced to buy a whole plate).

I think I might be bringing one experience with restaurants into my other experiences inappropriately. One time at a Korean restaurant I asked what the dish was written in Korean with no English translation (I have many good qualities, linguist is not one of them). "Oh, you wouldnt like that." "Oh? Why not?" "Its very Korean." That actually happened folks! To be fair to the waitress however, I took her advice and did not get it, so maybe I proved her point...

But seriously, very Korean? Next thing you know there will be menus offering "Ridiculously Italian" and "Vaguely German"

CreamyGoodness said:

Personally I can only use about a half of a scotch bonnet in a whole pot of beans without bleeding from my eyes. Basically, when I start getting hiccups I know its all over.

Basically the only thing I cant get my head around trying once is bugs. I've tried most organ meats and actually love a few of them. Menudo anyone? :rockin:

*Leaves door wide open for 1980s boy band references*

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I love the stuff and get the same awkward "You sure you want it? You sure?" questions.

The soup, not the CD's, I buy those online to spare embarrassment.

While I agree that "very Korean" is a horrible explanation (I love KimCheee and Bulgogi) what I find most annoying when visiting ethinic restaurants is the seemingly impossible task of explaining what "Hot" or "Spicey" means.

For example, I can order something "Hot! Scale of..." and I get this crappy thing that, I think, they cooked near the peppers.

However, my asian wife can order the same "Hot! Scale of..." from the same place and it's near inedible.

So, the scale changes.

Under an assumed name I would imagine . One thing I made recently when SWMBO was out of town on business (some men cheat on their women when they are out of town... I secretly cook things that would make her gag) was liver mush to see if I was missing anything. I can honestly say that I dont believe I was missing anything. I didnt care for it at all. NEXT! :fro:

The first time I ordered the stuff from my favorite Columbian restaurant (they do a variation on it, its not straight up menudo) I got asked the same question. I asked "why do you ask? do you like it?" (not in a confrontational way) and the guy, who happens to be the owner of the restaurant replied "actually I can't stand the stuff, but I'm told mine is still the best." Try arguing with that!

TxBrew said:

I love the stuff and get the same awkward "You sure you want it? You sure?" questions.


The soup, not the CD's, I buy those online to spare embarrassment.

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I'd be offended that they kept bothering me while I was eating and enjoying the dish- once it's out on the table, it's either to my liking or it's not, it's already cooked.

Asking before the fact, however, if I've not already done something to make them believe I know what the hell I'm ordering, is just good service.

I love sushi, and I try to be adventurous with it (which isn't that hard, once you wrap your mind and palette around raw fish).. but I cannot bring myself to eat any true live sushi (that sounds horrid), or things like urchin (which looks like death), or certainly urchin roe (which isn't). If I have too much trouble getting my boundaries across the the chef, I'll stick with my tuna, yellowtail, red snapper and mackerel.

You won't find me eating land bugs (crustaceans are just fine), raw freshwater fish (unclean!) or much organ meat. I do have a soft spot for liverwurst, however.

I guess I'm an idiot because I've ordered octopus before thinking it was chicken (the text was in foreign language, I went by very small pictures)... so I lean on the side of the staff being helpful.

GilaMinumBeer said:

While I agree that "very Korean" is a horrible explanation (I love KimCheee and Bulgogi) what I find most annoying when visiting ethinic restaurants is the seemingly impossible task of explaining what "Hot" or "Spicey" means.

For example, I can order something "Hot! Scale of..." and I get this crappy thing that, I think, they cooked near the peppers.

However, my asian wife can order the same "Hot! Scale of..." from the same place and it's near inedible.

So, the scale changes.

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That sucks. Period.

Unfortunately it isn't their fault though, it is the million stupid americans who came in before you that proves the restaraunts right.

They can't know that you are.........THE ONE.

I have to go with "good service" combined with their experiences with other caucasian patrons. We went through this just a couple of weeks ago, in a sushi place. As the lovely owner was being helpful, she explained that sashimi is "raw fish" and maybe we'd like something else? I think in her years of business, she's seen other white folks our age order something and go "EEEEK!" at it, and they've had to trash this wonderful food.

In South Texas, we had great sushi in the best Japanese restaurant I've ever been in, and the best Thai and Vietnamese food in another place! I said I liked spicy at the Thai place- "Thai spicy"- to the male owner. About 5 minutes later, the female owner came out to double check if I REALLY liked spicy. And if so, how spicy? And she gave me some examples. It was really great, actually, since she didn't have to guess and I didn't have to be disappointed.

The restaurant owners want to avoid throwing out good food ordered by people who just don't know what they really ordered. And of course "spicy" means different things to different people. I have a friend that can't tolerate salad dressing with vinegar- too "spicy" for her! And I can eat a habanero with a side of pickled garlic.

I think my blue eyes and lily white skin makes people think otherwise, at least the first time they meet me!

Yooper said:

I have to go with "good service" combined with their experiences with other caucasian patrons. We went through this just a couple of weeks ago, in a sushi place. As the lovely owner was being helpful, she explained that sashimi is "raw fish" and maybe we'd like something else?

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I don't know though, I think at some point maybe the lovely owner should pull the cattle prod out from under the counter and stick it too the morons who didn't realize they might get raw fish at the sushi restaurant.

Your story about spice reminds me of my friend and I going to a shawarma joint in the NYU area just after college. "Hot sauce?" "Yes please" "How hot you like it?"... that's when my idiot friend said it "make it like you like it." After a long night of club and barhopping I'm sure we had been more than a little loud and obnoxious. The young guy behind the counter turned to the owner, a small mustachioed Syrian man whom everyone calls "Papa." Papa grinner slightly and nodded.

I have never been in so much pain from food in my life. Had I kissed someone that night I would have melted her lips off. I stopped hearing properly and begun hearing what sounded to me like church bells. I tried to cry out for help or sympathy but I had no voice, and I didnt have tears, though I was sobbing.

Ok it wasnt quite THAT bad but it was incredibly unbelievably spicy, and I like a goodly amount of spice. Next time I went back I said "ya got me." Papa just grinned. "Less spicy this time?" "yes, thank you"... THAT one was perfect

Yooper said:

I have to go with "good service" combined with their experiences with other caucasian patrons. We went through this just a couple of weeks ago, in a sushi place. As the lovely owner was being helpful, she explained that sashimi is "raw fish" and maybe we'd like something else? I think in her years of business, she's seen other white folks our age order something and go "EEEEK!" at it, and they've had to trash this wonderful food.

In South Texas, we had great sushi in the best Japanese restaurant I've ever been in, and the best Thai and Vietnamese food in another place! I said I liked spicy at the Thai place- "Thai spicy"- to the male owner. About 5 minutes later, the female owner came out to double check if I REALLY liked spicy. And if so, how spicy? And she gave me some examples. It was really great, actually, since she didn't have to guess and I didn't have to be disappointed.

The restaurant owners want to avoid throwing out good food ordered by people who just don't know what they really ordered. And of course "spicy" means different things to different people. I have a friend that can't tolerate salad dressing with vinegar- too "spicy" for her! And I can eat a habanero with a side of pickled garlic.

I think my blue eyes and lily white skin makes people think otherwise, at least the first time they meet me!

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*Notice I stole your patented "reverse inverted quote structure*

There is a difference between "what you can take" and "what tastes good"

I can handle a tiny sliver of Naga (ghost) or 7 pot pepper on my tongue, chew and swallow. would I want this at every meal? Would I wish this on my worst enemy? NO

Sometimes spicy as F&$K can be fun for you or I, but the average american would be puking and crying. restaraunts don't want that in the dining room.

CreamyGoodness said:

Your story about spice reminds me of my friend and I going to a shawarma joint in the NYU area just after college. "Hot sauce?" "Yes please" "How hot you like it?"... that's when my idiot friend said it "make it like you like it." After a long night of club and barhopping I'm sure we had been more than a little loud and obnoxious. The young guy behind the counter turned to the owner, a small mustachioed Syrian man whom everyone calls "Papa." Papa grinner slightly and nodded.

I have never been in so much pain from food in my life. Had I kissed someone that night I would have melted her lips off. I stopped hearing properly and begun hearing what sounded to me like church bells. I tried to cry out for help or sympathy but I had no voice, and I didnt have tears, though I was sobbing.

Ok it wasnt quite THAT bad but it was incredibly unbelievably spicy, and I like a goodly amount of spice. Next time I went back I said "ya got me." Papa just grinned. "Less spicy this time?" "yes, thank you"... THAT one was perfect

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Last night at the Kabab Cafe:

Lamb's brains in lemon. Goat's testicles in spices with onions and garlic. Veal Cheeks with a poached egg served with cumin and madagascar cinnamon, and finally, Goat's heart with onions, garlic, and spring squashes. Only thing the meal needed was a nice IPA (alas, Ali serves wine only).

Do you need me to stamp your man card or validate your parking or shine your shoes or anything?

Or should I just bow down with my face flush to the floor?

Why is it so hard for me?

Don't get me wrong, I can eat Uni. Uni would have 97% of americans running for the bathroom with puke spraying between their fingers, but compared to you that is less than NOTHING.

Thank you thank you, when you are slightly built man with a receding hairline who gets pedicures to alleviate foot pain you need to get your man points wherever they come. I will say this, if I didnt tell you you were eating the brains you would have thought you were eating gnocchi or sweetbreads. Very very mild flavor, and super creamy/firm but soft texture. Like eating a cloud. I think you would have been able to eat the cheeks too, no problem.

Going back to the original point, Ali is pretty masterful when it comes to telling who can handle what. Place is so small you can talk to him while he is cooking, and watch the master at work. He doesnt ask "have you had brains before" he will ask "have you had brains HERE before" :-D

CreamyGoodness said:

Thank you thank you, when you are slightly built man with a receding hairline who gets pedicures to alleviate foot pain you need to get your man points wherever they come. I will say this, if I didnt tell you you were eating the brains you would have thought you were eating gnocchi or sweetbreads. Very very mild flavor, and super creamy/firm but soft texture. Like eating a cloud. I think you would have been able to eat the cheeks too, no problem.

Going back to the original point, Ali is pretty masterful when it comes to telling who can handle what. Place is so small you can talk to him while he is cooking, and watch the master at work. He doesnt ask "have you had brains before" he will ask "have you had brains HERE before" :-D

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Maybe that is the right question, He Man.

"Have you had our spicy?"

"Have you eaten bugs here?"

"Have you eaten our testicles?"............wait......

I run into this issue when I order Thai food and even some Chinese places when I order Kung Pao Chicken. With the Kung Pao they usually ask "Spicy, OK?". The funny thing is it's usually not that spicy. With Thai food they usually treat me like I'll get injured by spicy food. There's a local place that goes by mild, medium, hot and Thai hot. I ordered Thai hot from them and it wasn't even close to hot enough. The next time I ordered double Thai hot and they looked at me like I didn't know what I was doing. Double Thai hot could have even been a little higher on the Scoville scale.

It happens, you just have to deal with it for what it is... A minor annoyance.

TheMan said:

Habenero's are nothing. Ghost peppers...yikes!

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I've eaten a whole one. Granted it was dried, but it wasn't that bad. It lit me up for about 5 minutes.