Brewing with clover honey?

I just bought a honey amber ale recipe kit and was wondering if anybody has suggestions as to when I should add the honey. The recipe says add 2lbs of clover honey 30 min into the boil for a mild honey flavor. Or add clover honey with only 10 min left of the boil for a strong aroma honey flavor. Any suggestions? Has anybody brewed with clover honey before? I read that honey is fully fermentable, which will increase ABV but not add too much flavor.

P.S. I wasn't sure if this should've been posted in the recipe forum. Advice is much appreciated

If you want maximal honey aroma/flavor, the best time to add it is when the rest of the beer has already finished fermenting (be it in the primary, or in a secondary), unheated.

I've struggled with this question myself. I'll give you a summary of what I've learned.

1. The later you add it to the boil, the more honey aroma/flavor will persist in the beer.

2. The whitehouse honey ale recipe puts the honey in at 5 mins left on the boil. If the secret service are okay with the POTUS drinking that, its probably ok for the rest of us too.

3. You can pasteurize it and add it after fermentation has taken off. Pasteurizing honey is not trivial, but you can search to find methods for doing so.

4. Whatever you do, don't simply add it after the boil and cooling. I made the mistake of misapplying advice from a mead forum where it seems to be fairly well accepted that you don't need to boil honey for making mead - well, that may work for making mead, but if you do that when only 10% of your fermentables are honey, all the critters lurking in that honey will join the party. Yes, honey is naturally bacteriostatic, but that has everything to do with how extremely concentrated it is, once you dilute it with lots of extra water, that protection is basically gone.

Maybe I'll split the two recommendations in the recipe in half, and add the honey with 15 min left in the boil lol.

Clover is one of the weakest honey in terms of flavor but many use it. I prefer orange blossom. And the later you add it the better in terms of retaining any flavor. I vote for post fermentation: either add it when the krausen drops or to a secondary.

You can bottle with it as well

BansheeRider said:

I read that honey is fully fermentable, which will increase ABV but not add too much flavor. :

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Also note that this is not true. Honey is only 90% - 95% fermentable (different sources give different amounts, and I suppose it also depends on the honey itself) That means that even after fermentation, you're left with a fair amount of honey flavor.

Honey flavor is lost in the boil mostly by the loss of aromatics that escape during the boil. As many have noted, this means that the longer you boil a beer, the less honey flavor it will have.

Thanks for the replies! I actually cancelled my order and went with the Octane IPA :rockin: I may do honey flavored beers in the future.

You could also consider Honey Malt.

I've been trying to get the honey flavor in my wheat beer much like the Blue Moon version. I've asked a lot of questions and tried everything I've been told to do, yet am still not getting that strong honey flavor.

I was told to steep honey malt, but less than a pound. I was told to make a mini mash with some 2 row. I was told to put the honey at flameout. I've been told to add it to the fermentor after fermentation has died down. None of this has had the effect I was looking for. And with all of them I have used 1/2 lb of honey malt along with honey (~2 lbs). I've even used honey for priming.

This last time I added 3 3/4 lbs of honey a week after fermentation and it sorta has a honey flavor, but it really thinned the beer out too much.

I was recently advised to use 2 lbs of honey malt. That's what I'll try next go around.

Rodwha, have you considered using honey as your priming sugar? Not sure how much flavor that would add ... but it would go straight into the bottle. Palmer has a great nomograph you can use to determine how much honey should be used for equivalent vols of CO2.

I have once. I'm not sure it added anything measurable to the flavor as it wasn't much.

Thinking about trying a honey wheat and adding 1lb (by weight) 10 minutes prior to end of boil. I'd like to add another .5 lbs when the fermentation is nearing completion. My question is how would I calculate ABV since I would be taking a measurement before I pitch yeast and again when I'm done. If adding ingredients DURING fermentation, how do I calculate as my FG reading would be affected by the new ingredients?

4JBrew said:

Thinking about trying a honey wheat and adding 1lb (by weight) 10 minutes prior to end of boil. I'd like to add another .5 lbs when the fermentation is nearing completion. My question is how would I calculate ABV since I would be taking a measurement before I pitch yeast and again when I'm done. If adding ingredients DURING fermentation, how do I calculate as my FG reading would be affected by the new ingredients?

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Per Palmer, honey has about 38ppg. So half a pound in 5 gallons would contribute about 3.8 points. So increase your OG by .0038. So if your hydrometer read 1.050, use 1.0538 as your starting gravity for %Alc calculations.

Masterfool101,


Thanks!!

rodwha said:

I've been trying to get the honey flavor in my wheat beer much like the Blue Moon version. I've asked a lot of questions and tried everything I've been told to do, yet am still not getting that strong honey flavor.

I was told to steep honey malt, but less than a pound. I was told to make a mini mash with some 2 row. I was told to put the honey at flameout. I've been told to add it to the fermentor after fermentation has died down. None of this has had the effect I was looking for. And with all of them I have used 1/2 lb of honey malt along with honey (~2 lbs). I've even used honey for priming.

This last time I added 3 3/4 lbs of honey a week after fermentation and it sorta has a honey flavor, but it really thinned the beer out too much.

I was recently advised to use 2 lbs of honey malt. That's what I'll try next go around.

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What kind of honey are you using?

Cheap honey. I assume it's wild flower.
Some of from the local grocer under their brand, and some have come in 5 lb bottles with a handle from WalMart (I think).
I've saved those bottles in case I buy LME locally, who would sell it in clear plastic bags.

Very useful info from the National Honey Board:

http://www.honey.com/images/uploads/general/home_brew.pdf

I used clover honey for my White House Honey Ale AG clone, added 1.5 lb at 5 minutes out, and it's terrific. The honey flavor and especially aroma is present but not overpowering. It also doesn't add much to the final sweetness (mine finished at 1.015, about what the beer would have finished at all by itself), and I think it reduces the beer's body slightly, giving it a clean, easy drinking finish. I'd highly recommend it. Haven't tried other honeys so it's hard to compare.

rodwha said:

Cheap honey. I assume it's wild flower.
Some of from the local grocer under their brand, and some have come in 5 lb bottles with a handle from WalMart (I think).
I've saved those bottles in case I buy LME locally, who would sell it in clear plastic bags.

Click to expand...

Yeah, grocery store honey is usually very mild and generally blended, so it won't add a ton of character. That's why you're getting disappointing results. You should find a honey supplier or some place that specializes in quality honey. Most of the honey I use is organic wildflower honey I buy in bulk from a supplier - about 30 lbs for $85. It really makes a difference... there's a ton of floral character in it. In fact, the quality is such that I refuse to buy grocery store honey at all anymore.

I'm from Canada so I probably can't help much finding great sources for you, but perhaps others will be able to point you in the direction of a quality supplier. Try asking in the mead section, or on a different mead site.

As for how to use it, you'll retain the most character by adding it, unheated, after the initial fermentation. I know you said you've done that, but doing this with a high quality honey will make all the difference.

Thanks for that bit of info!
I had no idea that wild yeasts could be in the honey.
I wash my yeast, and could have something else in there. I don't notice anything off, but that doesn't mean there isn't something in there that can grow more numerous next time, or the following. I'll need to keep that in mind when I brew a wheat again.

The co-op that SWMBO gets fruits and vegetables from has mentioned trying to get bulk honey, but nothing has materialized yet.
I've been interested in making mead.