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Cheesefood

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I never watch this show, but Bill Cosby is on and surprisingly it's more interesting than playing video games right now. He's speaking on the whole "Black people need to quit 'acting black'" campaign. I completely agree with a lot of his views on this stuff and in many ways it makes me feel guilty for listening to rap. He's joined by Alvin Poussaint, Prof. of Psych at Harvard. They're talking about everything from the language black people use ('N-word', 'Acting White', etc) and the crisis that's facing the black community as a result of the breakdown in values / personal accountability in the majority of the black culture.

Having grown up in a fully mixed area and having gone to schools that were ~50% black, I've personally seen and experienced a lot of these negative stereotypes and known kids my age who got fitted for a coffin before graduating high school.

I'm very glad that someone with the street cred of Cosby is saying this stuff. Even though The Cosby Kids had many of these stereotypes, I think he's doing great work.
 
I've watched his conversations on this. Couldn't agree more with him.
 
Cheesefood said:
and in many ways it makes me feel guilty for listening to rap.

And well it should. As a penance, you have to start listening to music now. Country, pop, rock, jazz, whatever, as long as it has a tune you can hum. Oh, and there should be the occassional chord change too.
 
Cosby is cool, no doubt. I love his old Jello ads. What disheartens me about him is his hatred of white folks. I saw an interview with him years ago where his feelings on this topic were made very clear.

I respect the man for what he's done in his career, but I can't abide a racist.
 
I'm reminded of a comment by an African ambassador, who was asked (at Cornell U. in 1973), "Why don't you talk like a black man?" His response, "I do talk like a black man. An educated black man."

Thomas Sowell has many interesting thoughts on the subject. "Ethnic American" is a good read.
 
I watched it and pretty much agreed with what he had to say but he kept refering to "systematic racism" (or some similar term) and kept saying that it needed to be fixed. But he never once gave an example of it or what needed to be changed. Maybe its where I live, maybe its just my viewpoint, but how, where, is there any negative systematic treatment of blacks?
 
mykayel said:
I watched it and pretty much agreed with what he had to say but he kept refering to "systematic racism" (or some similar term) and kept saying that it needed to be fixed. But he never once gave an example of it or what needed to be changed. Maybe its where I live, maybe its just my viewpoint, but how, where, is there any negative systematic treatment of blacks?

They mentioned how more whites do cocaine than crack, and how similar amounts of cocaine and crack are viewed different legally: crack has much stronger consequences.

Whatever the case, Cos seemed to say "Until we fix it, be aware of it and respect it."

The problem with black america needs to be fixed.
 
This is one tough problem to solve. I tend to agree with most everything stated so far. In fact, I think we perpetuate racism in America by focusing so hard on equal opportunity and anti-racism. We have organizations dedicated to the "advancement" of people based on their race. Despite the best intentions, aren't these establishments racist in and of themselves? However, to oppose them is to be labeled racist as well.

Regardless of the moral debate over the mere existence of equal opportunity programs, many (if not all) of them have failed miserably. There seems to be a growing culture of people who expect different treatment based on their race - people who feel that they are "owed" opportunities, jobs, and money on a "something-for-nothing" basis.

How do we reverse this disturbing trend?
 
i agree with Cosby. i think we've all seen people who have had good chances in life but instead became a stereotype. and unfortunately like most trends i think the only way to stop it is for people to realize that it is stupid and move on.
i also agree with Yuri_Rage most of these organizations just perpetuate racism. i for one have faith in most people and therefore believe that in modern time racism is almost a non issue in most peoples lives. not to say that it doesn't exist altogether but that it doesn't exist in very large segments of the population.
 
I can recall sitting with a group of friends close to graduation. One of our group was black and one was female. I'm in a predominately male dominated field. We were discussing job opportunities and both the black fellow and the woman expressed their concerns along with the rest of us about job opportunites. They were somewhat taken aback when I told them that they would be first to get jobs based on gender/race. Of course they wanted to be considered on merit like the rest of us, but in many cases that isn't necessarily something they have a choice about. They were in fact quite indignant about it but I know that my employer's 'equal opportunity' program means that women and visible minorities are snapped up BECAUSE they are women and visible minorities.

So on one side you can say that we need to have proper representation of under represented segments of the population but at the same time you degrade their abilities and talents by making their physical appearance or gender more important than their ability to do the job. I'm not saying that they CAN'T do the job as well as others, simply that it isn't considered as highly as it would for a white male and that is very degrading.

I honestly don't know what the answer is here. We do need to eliminate systemic barriers but we have to be careful that we don't erect others. I've heard that there is now a problem in some police forces because they've hired too many women officers and when brute force is required to handle some situations they don't have enough large and powerful people to do the job. One problem is solved and another is created.
 
IMO, people need to look for ways to include people and not disenfranchise or set themselves or others apart. That's just my opinion and it's nothing I choose to further discuss on this forum.

What I will say that's relevant to this forum is that race, gender, age (majority), religon, ethnicity, economic status, country of origin, political affiliation, gender preference are things that aren't supposed to matter on a beer brewing forum. For the most part they do not surface in our day-to-day here.

But sometimes they do. While I have seen only one instance of outright racism on this board, I do see some immigration rhetoric and gay jokes that only serve to divide people.

We do have gay paying members here.
We have paying members who do not really know if their parents or grandparents are documented (including Non-Hispanic). We may have some undocumented members, I don't know.

I can point to instances of my own behavior. I put myself on notice. I'd ask everyone to take a breather before they post something that serves to belittle or piss off an entire group of people.
 
I might be jinxing this thread, but I gotta say...what a great bunch of guys we have here!!! A topic like this could really get ugly in a hurry, but the comments thus far have been quite thought provoking without provoking arguments or resentment.

Kudos to the members of HBT!
 
Yuri_Rage said:
I might be jinxing this thread, but I gotta say...what a great bunch of guys we have here!!! A topic like this could really get ugly in a hurry, but the comments thus far have been quite thought provoking without provoking arguments or resentment.

Kudos to the members of HBT!


Agreed 100%.

I honestly don't know what the answer is. I've worked with many different races and creeds, and in the end the only thing that mattered to me is what kind of job they did and how they treated their co-workers. I've worked with some excellent people of all races, and I've worked with some really lousy people of all races.

In the end I boil it down to what kind of human being are you?

Ize
 
Agreed 100%.



In the end I boil it down to what kind of human being are you?

Ize

end of story....black white or blue every man or woman straight or gay is capable of evil and ignorance...im not for politics or any superficial restrictions we live by in todays society, i am for the survival and flourishment of the human race though
 
I'm not sure why you'd feel guilty for listening to rap. I guess if you listen to what's popular these days, you could feel guilty. It's a lot like the "gangsta rap" that was the rage in the early to mid nineties. I personally love hip-hop. I am old-school though. I listen to De La Soul and A Tribe Called Quest on a daily basis, and have done so for almost 20 years. I love Mos Def and Talib Kweli. Check out Madvillian and MF Doom. How about the Roots? All these artists are bit more cerebral and socially conscious ie. they don't rap about gettin' money and 'hos and sweet rims for their Escalades.:ban:

Mos and Talib co-own a bookstore in Brooklyn. Talib's parents are college professors. I would love to have a beer with those guys and soak up some of their wisdom. Anyway...just my 2 cents.
 
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