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newtstampede

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Some of you may have seen this come up in my other thread. I want to leave that reserved for my E-HERMS build so I will continue the ongoing Auber/FedEx issues here.

To start out I ordered the bulk of my control panel parts from Auber. They had it sent FedEx and it arrived in a timely manner. The only issue is that the FedEx driver left the package in a shared stairwell and someone who lives in the building is a thieving bastard. Filed a complaint with FedEx, they investigated and marked it off as lost/stolen. Now here is where my problems with FedEx end. They did their part and will reimburse for the cost of the goods and shipping, but only to the original sender. Auber has to be the one to file the claim. After talking to them this is the email I get back.

Hi Michael,

After talking to the manager, here is our proposal: we can reship you everything at cost of $73 in total (this includes our share of the loss and cost of the items without any profit from the original order). I just sent you an invoice, which you can pay directly online with credit card or paypal account. Please let me know if this works for you.

Also, we were wondering if you have a different shipping address or require signature for the second shipment.

If the first package showed up later, please notify us so we can arrange to get it back and refund you.


Thanks,
Suyi Liu
Auber Instruments
www.auberins.com
Click to expand...

So.....wait, let me get this straight. You have been reimbursed by FedEx for the price of the goods and STILL want me to pay $70 to reship it?

I called them yesterday and they told me the same thing, that they will reship it for $70. I told them there is no way that I will pay again after I have paid the first time and FedEx is paying them as well. I am still waiting on a response from them but overall I will never deal with them as a company ever again.
 
Wow, that is surprising. They have always been pleasant to deal with for me. I'd say that maybe there was miscommunication with who was getting paid by FedEx but if you talked to them on the phone that should have came across loud and clear.
 
UPS is no better at handling lost packages. The sender has to file the claim. I believe it will work our, it will just take time because FedEx will have to investigate again before they will pay Auber.
 
I've had a package stolen out of a shared hallway and it indeed sucks. Whoever took that package is so bummed, they likely have no idea what to do with their stolen loot. Check your dumpster.
 
newtstampede said:
Some of you may have seen this come up in my other thread. I want to leave that reserved for my E-HERMS build so I will continue the ongoing Auber/FedEx issues here.

To start out I ordered the bulk of my control panel parts from Auber. They had it sent FedEx and it arrived in a timely manner. The only issue is that the FedEx driver left the package in a shared stairwell and someone who lives in the building is a thieving bastard. Filed a complaint with FedEx, they investigated and marked it off as lost/stolen. Now here is where my problems with FedEx end. They did their part and will reimburse for the cost of the goods and shipping, but only to the original sender. Auber has to be the one to file the claim. After talking to them this is the email I get back.



So.....wait, let me get this straight. You have been reimbursed by FedEx for the price of the goods and STILL want me to pay $70 to reship it?

I called them yesterday and they told me the same thing, that they will reship it for $70. I told them there is no way that I will pay again after I have paid the first time and FedEx is paying them as well. I am still waiting on a response from them but overall I will never deal with them as a company ever again.
Click to expand...

I used to ship with FedEx but I don't now for this very reason.

When a shipper file a claim with FedEx they are only interested in paying the wholesale cost of what was shipped. And if the shipper demand retail they will just refuse fo pay, explaining that they are only required to reimburse his cost. What this means from the shipper's point of view is if he sold you a $100 item and his cost was $40, so he only gets $40 from FedEx.​

But where Auber is wrong is they want a profit at the end. You need to demand a full refund from Auber, then re-place the order with them requesting signature delivery when the order is placed.
 
The attitude from Auber at this point seems "we have your money already so piss off". I spoke with USAA and let them know about the situation. They will be calling Auber on my behalf tomorrow and we will give Auber until close of business tomorrow to correct this situation or else they will reverse the original charges. After all this I do not want to have any dealings with Auber in the future and will do my best to warn others about them as well. I might be looking at a BCS system instead in the near future.
 
Thank You for the Heads-Up. I will be watching to see if you get reimbursed or not.
 
i just ordered from them yesterday, will keep an eye on things...
 
Man, that surprises me about them. Good companies replace the items right away no questions ask and deal with the shipper on their end. That is just bad business. I will never do business with them now, which is shame because they are local to me. That email is just bad customer support. They should follow these forums more :)
 
thargrav said:
When a shipper file a claim with FedEx they are only interested in paying the wholesale cost of what was shipped. And if the shipper demand retail they will just refuse fo pay, explaining that they are only required to reimburse his cost. What this means from the shipper's point of view is if he sold you a $100 item and his cost was $40, so he only gets $40 from FedEx.​

But where Auber is wrong is they want a profit at the end. You need to demand a full refund from Auber, then re-place the order with them requesting signature delivery when the order is placed.
Click to expand...

They already have their profit, don't they? In your example, the customer paid $100, and if you subtract the cost of the goods, that leaves Auber grossing $60 (before their other expenses come out of that). Now FedEx reimburses them the $40 for the equipment, so now they have $100 again, just like after the customer paid them but before they shipped anything, which means they're still making the same amount of money (less the cost of labor and materials for packing).

I'd be steamed, too. They're not just trying to make a profit; they're double-dipping.
 
latium said:
They already have their profit, don't they? In your example, the customer paid $100, and if you subtract the cost of the goods, that leaves Auber grossing $60 (before their other expenses come out of that). Now FedEx reimburses them the $40 for the equipment, so now they have $100 again, just like after the customer paid them but before they shipped anything, which means they're still making the same amount of money (less the cost of labor and materials for packing).

I'd be steamed, too. They're not just trying to make a profit; they're double-dipping.
Click to expand...

Actually, no, they are not. In a real business if I sell a item for $100 that I paid $40 for wholesale, my profit is not $60. It's more like $5 - $10 after all of my other business expenses come out. This is why I do not ship with FedEx.

But you are correct about Auber - they should just ship the replacement and be done with it. Their loss in this transaction would just be another cost of doing business. So, instead of taking a small loss by shipping out the replacement parts they will take a $50 - $55 loss by refunding the customer's money. Not smart.
 
thargrav said:
Actually, no, they are not. In a real business if I sell a item for $100 that I paid $40 for wholesale, my profit is not $60. It's more like $5 - $10 after all of my other business expenses come out. This is why I do not ship with FedEx.

But you are correct about Auber - they should just ship the replacement and be done with it. Their loss in this transaction would just be another cost of doing business. So, instead of taking a small loss by shipping out the replacement parts they will take a $50 - $55 loss by refunding the customer's money. Not smart.
Click to expand...

That is a smart business man right there!

I look at it this way- How often does this happen to them? I'd venture to say infrequently at the most (though I will admit that is a variable here, but I digress...) Assuming this is a rare situation, then a good business would eat the $50-55 loss as a customer service expense.

Instead someone gets mad and vocal (see: Talk, Homebrew) and they get lots of bad pub, that has already resulted in 2 people, by my count, saying they will not be using auber because of said situation.

I think the biggest point here is to treat every customer as if he/she had a platform to showcase shortcomings in customer support.

Hope this all works out for you!
 
thargrav said:
Actually, no, they are not. In a real business if I sell a item for $100 that I paid $40 for wholesale, my profit is not $60. It's more like $5 - $10 after all of my other business expenses come out. This is why I do not ship with FedEx.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I tried to be clear that I wasn't referring to the $60 as their profit, just as the difference between retail and Cost of Goods Sold ("that leaves Auber grossing $60 (before their other expenses come out of that)"). I didn't mean to get into fixed expenses and the like, just that if FedEx reimburses them for the COGS, they have to pay again for materials and labor for packing, but their fixed expenses haven't changed. My apologies if I wasn't clear enough.
 
No offense taken, I was just explaining what FedEx does and does not pay. Also, most people not in business do not understand the real cost of business.
 
Good luck with USAA they are pretty awesome and I have never had any issues getting them to refund money when a business won't. I'm also surprised at auber's ridiculousness, but some people dot think about the consequences of their actions before they do them. As was mentioned, people here may be less likely to shop and I take it since you have USAA that you are in the military, and screwing over someone in the service is never a good idea because they have a huge group that they can influence
 
Did you pay with a credit card or Paypal? Contact them and they will reverse the charges.
 
1331415511153.jpg


subbed. Will refer back to see how this turned out, before starting to piece together an electric setup.
 
Newest update....

Hello Mike,

FedEx has not responded yet. Normally, it will take several days. Our previous experience is that there is only 50% chance they will pay the claim. If they deny the claim, we will file an appeal and ask our local FedEx account manager to help. If the account manage feel we are a valuable customer, they will reconsider it. In any cases, the maximum we will get from FedEx is $100. We will ship another one as soon as we get the notification from them. However, this process can take weeks.

If you need the item in hurry, Here is what we suggest you can do.

1) Make a proposal to us that you think is fair to both you and Auber. If you insist that Auber is 100% liable for the lost of package, please explain why (e. g. there are other company has such policy). If it is convincing, we will consider it.
Here is what I feel is fair. Our gross margin on these order is about 33% or less. So, we can split the loss. Each party pays 1/3 of the loss. If FedEx will honor the claim later, The fund will be used compensate the buyer's loss first.
2) If the above solution is not acceptable, you can ask your bank to initiate the charge back. Let the banks to decide what is a fair solution. We will accept what ever the bank's decision is.

As a suggestion for you future FedEx shipment: For apartment complex address, if FedEx has no access to the mail box, and you are not at home most of time, you should let the package delivered to your work address. Otherwise, leave a note on the order: asking the FedEx to call you cell phone if no one is at home. It is how many customers from apartment complex of large metropolitan areas (such as New York) did. Although Junction City is not a large city, you should do that if the area is not safe. Paypal policy is the buyer is responsible to provide an address and select a shipping method that is secure for the package delivery.

P.S., Two previous Auber Customers have notified us that you are posting the problem on the HBT forum. This email has been BCC to them.

Sincerely,
Suyi Liu
Auber Instruments
www.auberins.com
770-569-8420
 
newtstampede said:
Newest update....

Hello Mike,

FedEx has not responded yet. Normally, it will take several days. Our previous experience is that there is only 50% chance they will pay the claim. If they deny the claim, we will file an appeal and ask our local FedEx account manager to help. If the account manage feel we are a valuable customer, they will reconsider it. In any cases, the maximum we will get from FedEx is $100. We will ship another one as soon as we get the notification from them. However, this process can take weeks.

If you need the item in hurry, Here is what we suggest you can do.

1) Make a proposal to us that you think is fair to both you and Auber. If you insist that Auber is 100% liable for the lost of package, please explain why (e. g. there are other company has such policy). If it is convincing, we will consider it.
Here is what I feel is fair. Our gross margin on these order is about 33% or less. So, we can split the loss. Each party pays 1/3 of the loss. If FedEx will honor the claim later, The fund will be used compensate the buyer's loss first.
2) If the above solution is not acceptable, you can ask your bank to initiate the charge back. Let the banks to decide what is a fair solution. We will accept what ever the bank's decision is.

As a suggestion for you future FedEx shipment: For apartment complex address, if FedEx has no access to the mail box, and you are not at home most of time, you should let the package delivered to your work address. Otherwise, leave a note on the order: asking the FedEx to call you cell phone if no one is at home. It is how many customers from apartment complex of large metropolitan areas (such as New York) did. Although Junction City is not a large city, you should do that if the area is not safe. Paypal policy is the buyer is responsible to provide an address and select a shipping method that is secure for the package delivery.

P.S., Two previous Auber Customers have notified us that you are posting the problem on the HBT forum. This email has been BCC to them.

Sincerely,
Suyi Liu
Auber Instruments
www.auberins.com
770-569-8420
Click to expand...

What would the dollar amount be if you were to split the cost of the loss? How would you be able to know if FedEx ever did refund them 100%? At this point is it unreasonable for one to assume that such information could easily get 'lost in the shuffle' if it did happen?

Maybe this is just me, but that PS line really irks me.

My brain defaults to the 'trust no one' side of things when issues like this pop up, so this may actually be completely satisfactory and that last line benign. Now I am just rambling... don't mind me.
 
For the record, I am one of the 2 that notified Auberins of this thread. I had a great experience with them with the 2 orders I placed, and they were very helpful to me and had quick responses to questions I had regarding stuff I had bought from them.

It's very easy for people to come onto HBT and bash a company, but I thought that Auberins should have a chance to respond or at least be aware that they are being bashed and maybe try to make things right. I think they are a respectable company and I'd recommend anyone to use them. They may not have handled this issue perfectly, but I don't think they deserve to be burned at the stake for an issue that may have been avoided in the first place -if the OP knew his apartment was not safe for receiving packages, why did he have it sent there? Sounds like mistakes were made on both sides.

I have no stake in this fight, so don't bother attacking me because I don't care. I felt that the playing field needed to be leveled out by informing Auberins they were being attacked in a forum where a lot of their customers roam. Hopefully both parties can come to a satisfactory agreement.
 
Most of this stems from Fedex policies of seller reinbursment. Good for the seller not the purchaser. (been there) UPS uses buyer reinbursment. Any problems, they pay you. You paid for the item your money should be refunded to you. I avoid using Fedex unless I'm the seller.
 
I also do not have a dog in this particular fight but it can sway who I deal with in the future. Auberins should strike this one as a loss to keep good PR. I, like a lot of others value the opinions voiced here on HBT. I deal with vendors on a daily basis at work that sell similar items. Being an electrical engineer my job depends on availabilty of parts and services. With the internet there is not a single item I purchase that I can not buy somewhere else. The reason I use certain companies is because of service. If they do not want to be a part of the solution, screw em. There are a hundred more in line that will gladly take my money. Just my 2¢.
 
After that email I would take option 2 if possible, take my business somewhere else and let them eat the loss. That email would have pissed me off to no end.
 
There is a lot of anger and supposition going on in this thread. It seems to me that Auber is being quite upfront about the whole situation, and as far as I can tell aren't doing anything that would be considered poor business practice.

The facts are:
1. OP's box was stolen. (Fault lies solely with the OP)
2. No reimbursement has been awarded to Auber.
3. They have no obligation to award compensation of any kind.
4. They are trying to come up with a solution.

It's an unfortunate situation for the OP, but placing blame on Auber for something out of their control, and of which they have no responsibility towards, is a bit shortsighted.

Anyway, I hope it works out, as I'm sure it will.
 
I've ordered from Auber before and I've been happy with the customer service. They pre-programmed the PID and had everything in stock so things shipped quickly. I think they would gain a lot more business if they ate 100% of the cost and showed everyone on HBT they are willing to bend over backwards for us, but at the end of the day Auber may feel it's no fault of their own that the package got lost between Fedex and the buyer. Seems like Fedex has the bad customer service.

Auber sells a good product that a lot of us use and for every stolen package there are probably 99 happy customers.

I hope this get's resolved to your liking newtstampede.
 
johnsnownw said:
There is a lot of anger and supposition going on in this thread. It seems to me that Auber is being quite upfront about the whole situation, and as far as I can tell aren't doing anything that would be considered poor business practice.

The facts are:
1. OP's box was stolen. (Fault lies solely with the OP)
2. No reimbursement has been awarded to Auber.
3. They have no obligation to award compensation of any kind.
4. They are trying to come up with a solution.

It's an unfortunate situation for the OP, but placing blame on Auber for something out of their control, and of which they have no responsibility towards, is a bit shortsighted.

Anyway, I hope it works out, as I'm sure it will.
Click to expand...

I largely agree.

Provide a safe/secure delivery location and there would be no issue in the first place. Doesn't have to be Fort Knox, maybe there is someone in the building who's home during normal delivery hours that would accept packages for you. Or hold at the local hub, deliver to work, or ??.
 
My issue is with the way Auber is handling this on their end. I have contacted FedEx numerous times, started the investigation into a lost or mishandled package, and have followed up with FedEx on their case to which they said "we will reimburse the seller for the item and shipping expenses, you will have to work this out with Auber". FedEx will not pay to the seller. I sent all the case info to Auber informed them that FedEx will only pay them to which they responded that they will reship for $70. I called FedEx about this and they told me the same thing, that they will only reimburse the shipper and that what Auber is saying sounds kind of shady and recommended I call my bank on this matter.

bigljd- I don't mind that you informed them about this thread. That company does get quite a bit of business and recommendations from this board which is why I posted here. I had never heard of Auber before and I was going on their word of mouth reputation by others on this board.

As far as providing a safe place to deliver to...there is a safe place. Its called the apartment office. Which is open from 830-5 daily. The FedEx driver instead just left it at the door. This is why FedEx is taking responsibility for the missing package and paying Auber. I just got off the phone with FedEx, the claim was processed on the 25th and I was told that I should followup with the shipper again.
 
johnsnownw said:
There is a lot of anger and supposition going on in this thread. It seems to me that Auber is being quite upfront about the whole situation, and as far as I can tell aren't doing anything that would be considered poor business practice.

The facts are:
1. OP's box was stolen. (Fault lies solely with the OP)
2. No reimbursement has been awarded to Auber.
3. They have no obligation to award compensation of any kind.
4. They are trying to come up with a solution.

It's an unfortunate situation for the OP, but placing blame on Auber for something out of their control, and of which they have no responsibility towards, is a bit shortsighted.

Anyway, I hope it works out, as I'm sure it will.
Click to expand...


1. Ok so I live in an apartment and I order things that need to be delivered. I also work, which is why there is an office with someone who can sign for packages on my behalf since I cannot control the actions of the people in the other 11 units in my building.
2. FedEx told me on the phone today that Auber's claim was processed on the 25th.
3. No they don't.
4. Charging another $70 on top of the original $230 is a solution. Just not an acceptable one to me since FedEx has processed their claim.
 
newtstampede said:
1. Ok so I live in an apartment and I order things that need to be delivered. I also work, which is why there is an office with someone who can sign for packages on my behalf since I cannot control the actions of the people in the other 11 units in my building.
2. FedEx told me on the phone today that Auber's claim was processed on the 25th.
3. No they don't.
4. Charging another $70 on top of the original $230 is a solution. Just not an acceptable one to me since FedEx has processed their claim.
Click to expand...

1. I don't recall reading that the office is where your packages are normally sent. If FedEx had instructions to take the package to this office if you aren't home, then fault definitely lies solely on them. If I missed that somewhere in this thread, apologies.

2. Processing the claim internally does not mean that Auber has been reimbursed, or is aware of FedEx's decision.

My comment was more aimed at the pitchfork and torch mob that had amassed prematurely.
 
I don't have a dog in this fight, but the bottom line is this:

If a customer orders from me, and I choose carrier XYZ, then carrier XYZ is acting as my agent. Until the customer takes ownership of the item, it is my responsibility.

The carrier in this case has admitted their mistake; they are paying Auber. The fact is, FedEx is Auber's agent; Auber should eat the loss above what Fedex reimburses. The customer paid for an item that he has not received. There is no reasonable way to interpret this that casts blame on him.

Asking the customer to pay $70 for a mistake made by the merchant's agent is patently ridiculous. No one should do business this way.
 
homebrewdad said:
There is no reasonable way to interpret this that casts blame on him.
Click to expand...

You're right, in a way. The thief is really the problem here, but if the package was delivered to the specified address without any stipulations of signature required then it would seem to me the package was delivered according to the contract.

If the business wants to be nice about it, fabulous, but I'd be really surprised if by law they're obligated. And, I don't think it should be an expectation either...unless the package wasn't delivered according to the contract.
 
whoaru99 said:
You're right, in a way. The thief is really the problem here, but if the package was delivered to the specified address without any stipulations of signature required then it would seem to me the package was delivered according to the contract.

If the business wants to be nice about it, fabulous, but I'd be really surprised if by law they're obligated. And, I don't think it should be an expectation either...unless the package wasn't delivered according to the contract.
Click to expand...

The thief *is* the party to blame, but the fact is, the carrier has indicated their responsibility. Since the merchant assigned the product to the carrier, and the item was lost/stolen before the customer took ownership, the burden rests on the merchant.

This really isn't even slightly complicated. when you ship something, you assume the risk. If you want to mitigate that risk, you purchase insurance, or you only do signature deliveries (and you still should purchase insurance). If you don't, you realize that this will happen from time to time, and you deal with it when that arises.

The customer prepays for an item he doesn't receive. Merchant must replace it or give a full refund. That's all there is to it.
 
homebrewdad said:
The thief *is* the party to blame, but the fact is, the carrier has indicated their responsibility. Since the merchant assigned the product to the carrier, and the item was lost/stolen before the customer took ownership, the burden rests on the merchant.

This really isn't even slightly complicated. when you ship something, you assume the risk. If you want to mitigate that risk, you purchase insurance, or you only do signature deliveries (and you still should purchase insurance). If you don't, you realize that this will happen from time to time, and you deal with it when that arises.

The customer prepays for an item he doesn't receive. Merchant must replace it or give a full refund. That's all there is to it.
Click to expand...

Before going too far out on a limb I suggest you look up the term FOB (Free An Board). If the order shipped FOB then the shipment & it's loss are the customer's responsibility. I'm not saying this order shipped FOB, I'm just bringing up the fact that it's not always the merchant's fault or responsibility.
 
Your next email to auber should include a link to this thread along with an estimation of how many users there are on HBT.
 
Effingbeer said:
Your next email to auber should include a link to this thread along with an estimation of how many users there are on HBT.
Click to expand...

Then, for the record, I'll be ordering from Auber again in the event I need another control.
 
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