Spice, Herb, or Vegetable Beer Andes Mint Chocolate Stout

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I just bottled this about 15 minutes ago and I thought I'd share my notes and opinions on the peppermint flavor. I steeped 4 Celestial Seasonings Peppermint tea bags in 1 quart of water for about 5 minutes. While that was cooling I went ahead and bottled the first half (about 1.5 gallons) of the regular beer and set aside a hydro sample. I added the peppermint tea slowly to the remaining 1.5 gallons and this is what I came up with.

At 1/2 quart (2 cups) of tea there was a slight after-taste and a slight smell added to the beer.

At 3/4 quart (3 cups) the taste was only slightly mintier but it gained a sort of minty hoppy smell.

Finally, at the full quart there is a very nice minty taste and a slight minty tingle the first few sips you get of it. The smell maintains that minty, hoppy smell as stated before.

If I were to do it again I'd probably do the quart of tea but up it to 5 or maybe 6 tea bags and add the full quart. Oh yeah, and when I went back to the hydro sample I was very surprised at the amount of chocolate that came through. It's not like these are two different beers but the mint does make a huge difference. All in all this is a delicious beer and I can't wait to have these fully carbed. Thanks for the recipe! Cheers!!
 
Time for my promised review. I brewed this on 1/26/2013 and kegged it a week or ten days later. It's been pretty heavy on the mint and on the edge of undrinkable for me until yesterday.
The nose is moderately mint with a roast undertone.
Mouthfeel is thick, just as it should be. It literally chews. Initial flavor is identical to your average stout. Rich, roasty grains and a little chocolate in the background. As the beer warms on the tongue the mint becomes more evident, though not overpowering. Aftertaste is very much a chocolate mint candy. Semi-bitter chocolate comes up first followed by a smooth mint. The blend is very pleasant, though there is a slight alcohol burn to finish off the profile.

While this beer took quite a while to clean up and mellow, it was worth the wait. Kyle
 
Brewing the chocolate stout this morning. No mint this time - I will probably rebrew this for the winter and add the mint.

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I brewed this yesterday. My digital thermometer was WAY out of wack. I don't have a clue what my mash temp was. The rest if the brew was uneventful. My OG was 1.052.
It has been in the fermenter for ~24 hours and its looking great. The krausen looks like toxic swamp sludge, but the beer looks very chocolatey.
I used only 4.5 oz cocoa powder and 10 celestial seasoning peppermint tea bags. The bitter cocoa flavor was prominent and the minty tingle was noticable.
I have high hopes for this beer.

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This beer is my goal. I have just started brewing this year but am optimistic about sharing this brew with the family at the holidays.
 
After four weeks in the bottle, mine had a carbonation issue. Very little carbonation on this beer. I wonder if my mint extract had some sort of artificial preservative in it that killed the yeast. I used S04 on it so i'll upgrade the yeast on the next batch. Feedback was positive and I even have a friend that want's a case, so i'm brewing it up in two weeks for him.

Positives: Great thick mouth feel, strong mint & strong chocolate flavor. Mellow and smooth with no hints of tannin due to the 48 hour roasted grain tea method.

Negatives: Lacking carbonation, no head, residual powdered chocolate in bottles, super strong mint & chocolate flavor, hops completely overpowered.

Fix for version 2.0 (to be brewed weekend after next): Switch to celestial seasonings mint tea bags for tea addition, dial back the powdered cocoa by 1/2, strain through coffee filter to remove cocoa powder, use Irish or Scottish ale yeast.
 
I too am seeing the issues with carbonation in bottles. My batch has been in bottles for 2 weeks today and the beer gets pretty much no head and only slightly laces the glass. I was hoping it would get better but after your post I'm not holding out much hope. At first I was thinking it was because of the cocoa nibs solution in the extended secondary period that was causing my issue but it seems to be more widespread; maybe it's the cocoa powder?

I don't want to sound like this makes the beer bad because this is probably the best beer I've ever brewed! For those brewing it next I would try other methods to achieve carbonation like kegging. The chocolate smell is absolutely amazing thanks to the cocoa nibs. I'd say a fair tradeoff :)
 
I can't speak to the carbonation issues you guys are having with bottling, only because I have never bottled this beer. I keg all of my beers and when I need bottles I just use my beer gun.

I do wonder if the cocoa powder is suppressing the yeast or assisting in forcing too much of the yeast out of suspension? Coffee filter on the cocoa powder sounds like a neat idea.
 
Well I've always read that oils from fats may cause a no-head issue. Does anyone know how much fat it takes to ruin head in a beer? I used 1/2 the container of Hershey's Cocoa powder so that probably added about 2.5g of fat according to the Hershey's website. Although, I did have an extraordinary amount of trub/cocoa powder sediment when moving to the secondary so I wouldn't be surprised if powder acted sort of as a clearing agent when the yeast were done.
 
I was planning to carb this beer to ~2.0 - 2.1 vols, but I might bump it up based on what I'm reading here. For those of who bottled this beer what was your Target carbonation volume?
 
2.5 because I tend to overshoot my priming sugar. I'll probably use 5 oz. of dextrose simple syrup to prime with next time.

A friend of mine loved it so much during hunahpu weekend, that i'm brewing him up a case of it. He agreed to cover the cost of the grain bill and bottles so why not. I'm making the next 5 gallon batch of this stout tomorrow. I have my roasted grains doing a cold grain soak because it works so well to produce a mellow, smooth, no tannin no bitterness stout. I will definitely be filtering out the cocoa powder after the boil and i'm switching to the mint tea in the boil instead of extract.

The only other difference is using actual WLP004 irish ale yeast instead of S05.
 
2.5 because I tend to overshoot my priming sugar. I'll probably use 5 oz. of dextrose simple syrup to prime with next time.

A friend of mine loved it so much during hunahpu weekend, that i'm brewing him up a case of it. He agreed to cover the cost of the grain bill and bottles so why not. I'm making the next 5 gallon batch of this stout tomorrow. I have my roasted grains doing a cold grain soak because it works so well to produce a mellow, smooth, no tannin no bitterness stout. I will definitely be filtering out the cocoa powder after the boil and i'm switching to the mint tea in the boil instead of extract.

The only other difference is using actual WLP004 irish ale yeast instead of S05.

I'm really interested to hear about how you filter out the cocoa powder. I'd imagine running it through a paint strainer should work. Let me know how that turns out and enjoy the brew day!
 
So you just tossed the liquid yeast in when the wort was cooled? Im just getting into using liquid yeast and all the talk I see about starters have me feeling anxious
 
It's never a bad idea to do a starter with liquid yeast, but my personal experience has been that I have never had a stuck fermentation only pitching the vial. I've done hefeweizens and multiple batches of this recipe with no starter and using liquid yeast. But regardless, starters are simple! If you're nervous, just make one!
 
Made a 2.5 gallon batch of this over the weekend. Trying out my new 3 gallon better bottle as well as BIAB for the first time. Excited to see how it turns out. Everything seemed to go great I hit 1.058 OG.
 
Bought the ingredients for this brew today. It sounds super delicious, I couldn't resist. Just setting up a 1Liter starter for some harvested WLP004 right now. Probably brew it on Friday. I'll let ya know how it turns out! Went with Fuggles hops instead of EKG.
 
Good news! I was able to fix my carbonation for the remainder of this batch. I had to carefully pop the caps off (so I could reuse them), add about 1/2 tsp of corn sugar and recapped. Then I carefully swirled and mixed up the beer to get the yeast moving in the solution. Waited about a week and BAM! Delicious beer is now carbonated. Here's a pic of the delicious brew:
oE05Iw9.jpg
 
So I brewed this up yesterday and pitched the yeast around 9PM, woke up this morning and it was going like wildfire. Currently fermenting at a steady 63F in the ferm chamber. What i didn't account for was the cocoa poweder taking up so much extra space in the fermenter. ended up running out of a little space! Next time ill brew a 2.5G gallon batch for my 3G fermenter.

Hit all my numbers exactly and ended up with 1.060 OG. 86% effeciency. I shoot for 85%.
 
I have no patience for bottle conditioning. This spent 13 days in my closet after 2 weeks fermenting.

It very green, but I think it will be brilliant in 2-3 months. There's no head retention, but great lacing.

The mint tingle makes a cameo appearance and the cocoa flavor is the star and slightly bitter. I am please with thus brew.

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Good news! I was able to fix my carbonation for the remainder of this batch. I had to carefully pop the caps off (so I could reuse them), add about 1/2 tsp of corn sugar and recapped. Then I carefully swirled and mixed up the beer to get the yeast moving in the solution. Waited about a week and BAM! Delicious beer is now carbonated. Here's a pic of the delicious brew:
oE05Iw9.jpg

Glad to see there is hope for bottle conditioning after all! :rockin:
 
Gonna be bottling this in a few days and im thinking at bottling time i will either brew up some more mint tea bags to go with the sugar and give it more mint kick, OR im gonna make a vodka infusion and add it. Any suggestions? Which do you think would pull more flavor from the peppermint?
 
I think that the Vodka infusion might be the better bet. You'll probably be able to pull more peppermint flavor. If you're going to do an infusion, try to get some fresh peppermint leaves rather than the tea bags.
 
I've re-worked this stout recipe and it came out much better in version 2.0. I have a few more tweaks due to an upgrade in equipment and will brew version 3.0 in 2014. The second version sat in the primary much longer than my usual beers (Four months) but still had cocoa powder issues. It still leaves cocoa streaks in the bottom of a serving glass and has virtually no head whatsoever. What this thread has taught me:

Mint flavor fades fast: Using the natural mint found in mint tea bags fades fast. In the first batch, I used extract at bottling and that did well, but it tasted a little bit more like a mint candy than a natural mint flavor. This second batch used natural mint from mint tea and tasted fine on brew day, but the flavor faded very quickly as was barely discernible at bottling. I had to bump it up again, with a very careful extract addition.

Fats are the enemy of head retention: Using cocoa powder introduces a lot more to the beer than just chocolate flavoring. There's a lot of oil and fat in it as well, and it just murders the head. Version 3.0 will use cacao nibs or more chocolate malt instead of cocoa powder.

Cocoa powder is impossible to rack off: No matter how long it sits in the primary, you can't get rid of all of the cocoa powder residue without filtering this beer. I let version 2.0 sit in the primary for FOUR MONTHS and still had plenty of suspended cocoa in the beer.
 
Great observations thanks. One thing to keep in mind is that chocolate malt doesn't really give a chocolate flavor, more coffee than chocolate. I think they just call it chocolate malt because if the color. I would go with cocoa nibs for chocolate flavor.
 
I've re-worked this stout recipe and it came out much better in version 2.0. I have a few more tweaks due to an upgrade in equipment and will brew version 3.0 in 2014. The second version sat in the primary much longer than my usual beers (Four months) but still had cocoa powder issues. It still leaves cocoa streaks in the bottom of a serving glass and has virtually no head whatsoever. What this thread has taught me:

Mint flavor fades fast: Using the natural mint found in mint tea bags fades fast. In the first batch, I used extract at bottling and that did well, but it tasted a little bit more like a mint candy than a natural mint flavor. This second batch used natural mint from mint tea and tasted fine on brew day, but the flavor faded very quickly as was barely discernible at bottling. I had to bump it up again, with a very careful extract addition.

Fats are the enemy of head retention: Using cocoa powder introduces a lot more to the beer than just chocolate flavoring. There's a lot of oil and fat in it as well, and it just murders the head. Version 3.0 will use cacao nibs or more chocolate malt instead of cocoa powder.

Cocoa powder is impossible to rack off: No matter how long it sits in the primary, you can't get rid of all of the cocoa powder residue without filtering this beer. I let version 2.0 sit in the primary for FOUR MONTHS and still had plenty of suspended cocoa in the beer.

A few things regarding your notes that I find curious - as for the mint flavor from tea, I can agree partially. However, I have not found the mint flavor to fade too much - a bit, yes, but not to the degree that you describe.

Head retention - my personal experience over multiple brews of this recipe disagrees with your experience - I have had zero problems with head retention in this brew.

Cocoa in suspension - I have seen a small amount of cocoa remain in suspension, but barely a noticeable amount, certainly not after a four month primary. Even with a month in primary, I barely had any cocoa left in suspension.

In short - I think your notes are valid, but I also don't think they speak to the recipe in general. My personal experience over many brews has not been the same as yours, so I don't think they are universal, although they are definitely things to keep in mind.
 
question - when using the mint tea bags in the boil, do you drop the tea bags in intact or cut them open and dump the contents into the boiling wort?

Also, I'm looking at the celestial seasonings mint tea, do you use peppermint or spearmint?

TIA
 
question - when using the mint tea bags in the boil, do you drop the tea bags in intact or cut them open and dump the contents into the boiling wort?

Also, I'm looking at the celestial seasonings mint tea, do you use peppermint or spearmint?

TIA

I keep them whole, and I use peppermint.
 
Andy,
This thread is awesome your brew sounds and looks amazing. I've only brewed two beers so far an Irish red and a honey blonde both extracts. O am starting with extracts and one day move to all grain. I guess what I'm getting at is, is there a way to make this with extracts?
Thanks
Josh
 
Never been a stout guy, but this one sounded interesting. Brewed it back at the beginning of August, bottled around labor day weekend, and just started drinking them this week.

This beer is amazing. No issues with head retention or carbing. Nice blend of the chocolate and mint. Good creamy mouth feel. My batch carb-test plastic bottle was tight after about 5 days, so carbonation was super fast.
 
Never been a stout guy, but this one sounded interesting. Brewed it back at the beginning of August, bottled around labor day weekend, and just started drinking them this week.

This beer is amazing. No issues with head retention or carbing. Nice blend of the chocolate and mint. Good creamy mouth feel. My batch carb-test plastic bottle was tight after about 5 days, so carbonation was super fast.

What yeast did you end up using?
 
What yeast did you end up using?

I didn't have any WLP004 Irish Ale at the time, and my supplier was a bit behind, so I ended up using a 2nd generation US-05 that I washed from an Oaked Honey Wheat Ale I made in July. I will be rebrewing this stout recipe this weekend, minus the mint, with lactose added to make it into a sweet milk chocolate stout.

I will be using the WLP004 for this weekend's batch so we'll see if that affects ferm times at all. My supplier gets direct from WL though based on order requirements (i.e. he doesn't keep a stock, just orders as requested) so our yeasts are usually superfresh. My Irish Ale has an Aug 13 date stamp, so it should be good and strong.
 
Excellent. With multiple carb issues mentioned with the recipe, the more "what went right" stories the the better. Good ol US-05; the backup plan for all!
 
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