What Sanitisers and Cleaners are used.

SSBrew - 728
Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Hey everyone,

I have been brewing for 3 years now and had the occasional contamination but in the past 6 months I have had nearly 1/2 of all beers contaminated by a band-aid flavor that makes you gag (literally like you will throw up). Sometimes it is very intense and sometimes it is very subtle. It seems to favor lighter beers but some I have made seem fine and others are ruined. I have tried all kinds of remedies.

First I brew on a home made RIMS system. The hot wert goes from the kettle through a CFC, through a thrumometer, then into my primary (usually a bucket). I shake the bucket for airation and then add my yeast. I always dunk everything in starsan. and if it is gunky I clean with oxyclean.

I have tried to isolate the source but still dont have any definated leads. I have tried brewing in carboys. Still there. Tried oxycleaning and PBW, and starsan the inside of my pipes and CFC, still there. I am down to assuming it is the air or water I use but if that were the case then everyone would be bad right? I know it is happening in the primary because the taste is there as soon as I go to rack to the secondary.


I have tried to figure this one out and everytime I think I have it licked another one bites th edust. Any help would be greatly appreciated because I am at wits end. If it were every beer I could find it better but it is only every other beer or so. I usulaly brew 2 batches per session. I have tried buckets, kegs, and carboys as fermenters and the contamination seems to be independent of switching. I have tried leaving starsan foam in the primary and rinsing it out with my well water but neither seems to effect the occurance of contamination either. Do you tthink it could be bio film? Airborne contamination? Well water contamination? Thanks again and cheers!
 
EDW,

First thing I'd do is make a batch with bottled water and see if the problem persists. Many gorcery stores around here have self-fill stations for RO water that runs $0.30 per gallon, so it's a cheap experiment. Well water doesn't usually cause band-aid flavors since it's not chlorinated, but you never know.
 
just a food for thought:
I was listening to a BN podcast on cleaning/sanitizing and they said cleaning was more important. They mentioned that a base cleaner (high pH) takes care of inorganics while acidic (low pH) takes care of the organics.
(i may have them swapped)

Since You state: "I always dunk everything in starsan. and if it is gunky I clean with oxyclean" you may want to always clean.

And you rinse out the starsan foam? just leave it in the fermenter, doesn't effect anything.
 
Good idea on the water. the only problem is that I have rinsed out buckets before the wert goes in with my well water and not had a problem with any of those beers. Wouldnt the contamination be in every beer I rinsed the buckets for if it was the water?
 
Cleaning & sanitizing are clear different things; it's never a matter of either/or. IF the surface isn't clean, a sanitizer cannot penetrate it.......and a cleaner cannot sanitize, no matter how clean the surface, because clean is not sanitary.

I use plain old Dawn dishwashing liquid for most of my cleaning; for the insides of carboys, it's PBW* all the way.

For sanitizing, I used bleach for the first half-dozen batches. Then I switched to Star San and never looked back.

*Note: No lectures, please, about how much less Oxi-Clean costs, and how it does just as good a job. Not with our water......our well water is full of dissolved minerals, and Oxi-Clean will leave a white film on the glass that must be removed with an acid wash (i.e., white vinegar in solution). Rather than go through this, I use PBW, which has chelators that enable it to work in hard water.
 
Good to know. I always noticed that after using oxyclean or PBW there is a slimy residue on equipment and that starsan takes it right off.
 
Hi everyone. This is my first post, but I have been lurking for a few weeks now. My first batch is fermenting away as I type, and it's very exciting. It's an Amber Ale that smells wonderful, and the samples have been delicious.

For the last few weeks I've been saving up bottles and last night I decided to soak them in OxiClean (the scentless variety) to remove the labels and any gunk that may have accumulated at the bottom (some of them have been sitting around for a long time). After a 12 hour soak (which I'm guessing was probably overkill) I rinsed very thoroughly with hot water before soaking in hot water for 4 hours or so. Some of the bottles have a faint "chemicaly" smell to them. Should I be concerned? What should I do?

Next time I will soak for maybe an hour or two max.

Thanks again, this seems like a great community and I plan to start posting regularly.
 
The soak in Oxi-Clean is fine, and as long as they're rinsed thoroughly, there's no need for a further soak in water. Nothing penetrates the glass, and the chemical smell is probably just some odors hanging around from whatever you were doing.

Apply some Star San (my favorite method is to use a vinator, available from fine homebrew outlets everywhere), and you're good to go.
 
EDW505: just make one batch at another person's home with their water and environment, using your equipment, and leave the carboy there after racking until bottling. There's a few things like contamination of your well water by farming or inudustrial use or contamination of the pipes and faucet in your home you should rule out. I am having a contamination problem also, and figure its the new bottling want attachment or scratched in my old plastic buckets I can't reach with sanitizer.
 
hjd: don't soak them completely immersed in solution. Wash the outside and lip well with hot water, but only do the solution soak inside the bottles while standing on a table or whatnot. Youd don't want the label, glue and oils on the outside of the bottle to travel inside.
 
Everyone on this forum seems to swear by Oxyclean for cleaning, but it doesn't seem to be available here in little old New Zealand.

Wikipedia tells me that the active ingredient of Oxyclean is sodium percarbonate. Should I simply get any old cleaner from my supermarket which is made of this? (There are plenty in the laundry section.) Would this be as good?

Currently I'm using a powder from my local brewing store consisting of chlorine and cleaning soda. Am I right in guessing that this is slightly sub-par?

Any other recommendations? The less scrubbing required, the better - I'm using a glass carboy that's a bit hard to get into with a brush.

Thanks :)
 
Pretty much. But gotta read. No perfumes etc. And if I remember right, sodium percarbonate is cleaning soda.

Check out this podcast:
http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/shows/Brew-Strong/Brew-Strong-11-10-08-Cleaning

They go into a section about acidic vs alkaline cleaners and how one works on some uglies and visa verse.

They also had one a few weeks later on sanitizing.

brewhan said:
Everyone on this forum seems to swear by Oxyclean for cleaning, but it doesn't seem to be available here in little old New Zealand.

Wikipedia tells me that the active ingredient of Oxyclean is sodium percarbonate. Should I simply get any old cleaner from my supermarket which is made of this? (There are plenty in the laundry section.) Would this be as good?

Currently I'm using a powder from my local brewing store consisting of chlorine and cleaning soda. Am I right in guessing that this is slightly sub-par?

Any other recommendations? The less scrubbing required, the better - I'm using a glass carboy that's a bit hard to get into with a brush.

Thanks :)
Click to expand...
 
I am new to this and would like to know how I can clean coors lite bottles for use with my home brew?
Sorry if this posted somewhere else I couldn't find it.
 
I clean with PBW, sanitize with Star San. These products are from 5 Star Chemical in CO, available from fine homebrew suppliers everywhere.
 
I do the same thing. Clean with PBW or Oxy (If real dirty and grungy I'd soak them for a spell) then rinse them in water and sanitize them with Starsan right before bottling.

I use swing tops these days and rinse them after use so I rarely wash bottles any longer. Rinse them again and use Starsan prior to bottling and I'm good to go.

I make up a 5 gal bucket with Starsan along with a 2 qt. container and a spray bottle. I keep them covered and they're good for several batches. I use the 5 gal. for the big stuff, the 2 qt. for airlocks and small parts, and the spray bottle for everything else.
 
I just got a beautiful beer server from a friend who was using it at his bar. Unfortunately, cleaniness was not one of his strong points.

My friend gave me a contraption to clean the beer lines, but could anyone offer me suggestions as to what would be a good cleanser / cleansing method for cleaning out the tap?
 
I'd use PBW; what I use on all my other equipment. 'Course, I don't have a tap or lines, just put it up in bottles.
 
What do you think about Bar Keepers Friend for cleaning? I have a three keg system and im thinking of using this for cleaning my keggles and carboys with a good rinsing. Anyone know of any issues i could have? if so What would be a good cleaner to use on my keggles, plastic, and glass?
 
DIPAfool said:
What do you think about Bar Keepers Friend for cleaning? I have a three keg system and im thinking of using this for cleaning my keggles and carboys with a good rinsing. Anyone know of any issues i could have? if so What would be a good cleaner to use on my keggles, plastic, and glass?
Click to expand...


I use Bar keepers Friend on my SS pots. Works great and keeps them like new. Just be sure to give them a very good rinsing afterwords. As for the carboys I use unscented oxiclean (I use store brand and just be sure it's not scented). Leave them to soak over night give a good rinse a few times and call it done.
 
I received some Easy Cleaner sanitizer in my beer kit. Says 1 tbsp per gallon but not how long to soak? Any ideas what duration I should leave it on for?
 
Im new to all of this so please be kind, but i have came across alot of conflicting data on the proper use of oxyclean for cleaning and Potassium Metabisulphate for sanitizing, how much of each chemical do i use and what concentration of P.M. do i need in a spray bottle to instantly sanitize. I just want to make sure that my first batch doest sour this home brew bug i got. Thank you in advance!
 
The kegs I purchased online and local stores come fairly clean with a sweet smelling solution still in them. I was told that is an acid based cleaner.

I rinsed those and cleaned them with PBW and they turned out great. I just purchased two pepsi kegs from a haul it away guy for $20 each and the kegs are in better shape than the ones I bought online dent wise. Except they are really dirty and musty moldy. Beer (might even be soda) in them for years it looks like.
My question is. What is the acid based stuff these retailers are using? Should I do that first then finish up with PBW?

I also have Bar Keepers Friend. I read the sticky and search a little but no much mention of the sweet smelling acid based cleaner. Just curious what it is.

Thanks for any advice.
 
I'm geussing parasidic acid. A lot of kegging company's and brew houses use the stuff. It has a sweet smell to it. Its basiclly the same stuff as hydrogen peroxide.
 
I just bought oxi clean free at target, but the only kind they had was the liquid solution, not the powdered. Is this ok or can I only use the powder?
 
I use Scrubfree for toilets & hard stains, Vim for everything else, Vinegar for floors - though I might buy Fantastic again for some of them. Vinegar or window cleaner for the glass, and for soap scum on the bottom of the shower I use Vinegar & baking soda & a scrub brush - it's miraculous. :) I also use Pledge for dusting. My cupboards are alot more organized since I stopped collecting all the latest gimmicks
 
Regarding the use of PBW and Starsan, since this stuff is expensive and you use so much water, is it possible to re-use both solutions after a typical brew day. What I would like to do is rinse everything with water first and then use PBW so that the solution doesn’t get a lot of build up in it. After I’m done using it, store it away for the next brew day. For starsan, everything should be clean already so nothing will build up in which is why I don’t think it would be a problem for storing and re-using it.

I’m a newer brewer so I don’t know the chemicals that well.

For storing these chemicals, can I use 5 gallon soda kegs? I worry that either solution will damage the seals or create off flavors if I go to use the same keg for beer that was used for storing these solutions.

Is there away to test starsan to make sure it will still do the job if it’s been stored for a while?

Say you have a 5 gallon carboy and 5 gallon soda keg, how do you guys go about cleaning and sanitizing them? Do you fill them up completely with 5 gallons of PBW and then Starsan or do you just get enough in there and shank it up or do whatever it is you do?
 
I am sure its already in here but, i bought a keg and cleaned it now i need to sanitize it. I have B-T-F Iodophor sanitizer. The home brew guy said to mix it in water and soak for 2 minutes then let air dry. problem is I can't remember the ration to mix it. bottle only says if u do this much it = this many PPM. Any help?
 
I use starsan so I can't help, but I would recommend visiting their website or calling them. It's that simple.
 
BrewBoy19 said:
I am sure its already in here but, i bought a keg and cleaned it now i need to sanitize it. I have B-T-F Iodophor sanitizer. The home brew guy said to mix it in water and soak for 2 minutes then let air dry. problem is I can't remember the ration to mix it. bottle only says if u do this much it = this many PPM. Any help?
Click to expand...

I use 1 Tablespoon for 5 gallons of Cold water. I would soak longer than 2 minutes. Unless you plan on using using Star San.
I have switched to star san now because it last so much longer and you can get thru a few brews before changing. And even then I am just changing it for peace of mind.

I do like using Iodophor for the glass Carboys because it doesn't foam like star san. That really bothered me at first because I started out using Iodophor. But the convenience of star san in a spray bottle out weighs the foaming issue for me now.
 
pola0502ds said:
Regarding the use of PBW and Starsan, since this stuff is expensive and you use so much water, is it possible to re-use both solutions after a typical brew day. What I would like to do is rinse everything with water first and then use PBW so that the solution doesn’t get a lot of build up in it. After I’m done using it, store it away for the next brew day. For starsan, everything should be clean already so nothing will build up in which is why I don’t think it would be a problem for storing and re-using it.

I’m a newer brewer so I don’t know the chemicals that well.

For storing these chemicals, can I use 5 gallon soda kegs? I worry that either solution will damage the seals or create off flavors if I go to use the same keg for beer that was used for storing these solutions.

Is there away to test starsan to make sure it will still do the job if it’s been stored for a while?

Say you have a 5 gallon carboy and 5 gallon soda keg, how do you guys go about cleaning and sanitizing them? Do you fill them up completely with 5 gallons of PBW and then Starsan or do you just get enough in there and shank it up or do whatever it is you do?
Click to expand...

Just my opinion but I would not store any of your chemical solutions in the soda kegs for long periods of time.
I personally don't reuse my PBW because after cleaning my carboys and kettle on a brew day it is pretty nasty. I only make up 2 gal at a time. If I manage it right I can get by with just the 2 gallons on brew day. Sometimes I need 4. Cleaning chemicals are cheap if you look at the big picture. If you have a bad batch of beer because it is not cleaned enough or right. You have now wasted dollars in ingredients and your 4 or 5 hours it takes to brew it. $1 worth of chemicals are cheap insurance to me.
Starsan last a very long time if you mix it with distilled water. I store it in a spare Carboy with a sealed bung in the top. If I don't have a spare one I use a spare 5 gallon plastic water cooler jug until a glass carboy is free.
I only mix up a gallon of starsan at a time. and it lasts over a few brews and keggings. If starsan is mixed right using distilled water and it is not hazy. you are good to go.
I clean my carboys with a brush. I clean my kegs with a gallon of pbw and a keg brush and then I stick my arm in with a rag and scrub it top to bottom. Inspect it with a flash light and a mechanics mirror to make sure I got everything.
 
Orfy said:
Brewers are an ingenious lot.

This is a list of some of the products uses for cleaning and sanitising.

Cleaners

1. Oxyclean (an industrial version)
2. PBW (Powdered Brewery Wash) - Caked on deposits, similar to oxiclean usage.
3. Bleach Soak (~1c/5gal) When visibly clean, but I want a good single cleaning/sanitizing step
4. Hot water no detergent
5. If it's stainless, BKF.
6. Dish soap.
7. TSP (tri-sodium phosphate solution)
8. dishwasher detergent.Calgonite brand
10. Anti-bacterial dish soap
11.Antiformin S (it's like bleach but with more caustic). It's rapid! A 20% bleach solution makes an excellent cleaner too.
12. BLC for the hoses/connectors/faucets.
13. an unbranded powdered beer line cleaner (not BLC) I get from the LHBS for cleaning my keg lines
14. Straight-A (percarbonate cleaner)


Sanitisers

1. Idophor (a medical version -- Betadine 10% aqueous)
I pay £3 for 500ml and need 1.25ml per litre to make a no rinse solution
Description: If you keep your equipment clean between brews, Iodophor is a great sanitizer. (Your equipment will not be clean if you simply rinse after use. You must use a cleaner, such as TSP.) Iodophor is excellent for stainless steel- which Diversol will corrode- and all other beermaking equipment. Mixed properly and used in a spray bottle, Iodophor is almost magical in its convenience: there's no waiting and no rinsing. Cleaning Iodophor does not clean. Use a cleanser such as TSP before sanitizing with Iodophor. Sanitizing Mix 1 ml per litre of cold water. You must use a syringe for accurate measurement. Use a spray bottle to coat equipment with solution. Shake off excess or allow equipment to drain. Do not rinse. Use the equipment. It's that easy! Cautions When in solution, Iodophor rapidly breaks down. Every time you use it, you must make a fresh solution. Not effective unless mixed accurately. Use a syringe. Will not clean dirty or stained equipment. Hazardous for those with iodine allergies. Concentrated solution stains skin and fabric.

2) Bleach (15mL/gal) + HOT water rinse (Sodium Hypochlorite)

Description: Unscented household bleach can be used as a sanitizer and cleaner. For sanitizing, it is just as effective as Diversol. For cleaning, however, either Diversol or TSP would be preferable. Cleaning Mix 2.5 ml per litre of cold water (1 tbsp. per gal.) and follow the cleaning instructions for Diversol . When rinsing, remove all traces of chlorine smell. Sanitizing Using a solution of 5 ml per litre of cold water (1 tbsp. per gal.) follow the cleaning instructions for Diversol Cautions See above. Don't use scented bleach. Those 'spring fresh' and 'lemony' perfumes will sink into equipment permanently. All subsequent batches will smell and taste like perfume.

3) Autoclave (glassware only) (18psi @ 250˚F for 20min)

4. Starsan- no rinse and I love the foam

5. Diversol (Sani-Brew) Description: As well as being a sanitizer, Diversol has the added benefit of being an extremely effective cleaner. Available under a variety of trade names, you'll recognize Diversol because it is a chlorinated pink powder. Cleaning Dissolve 3.5 g per litre of cold water (5 tsp. per gal). Soak stained equipment up to 48 hours. Rinse thoroughly with hot water. Sanitizing Fill primary fermenter with Diversol solution (3.5 g per litre of cold water [5 tsp. per gal.]). Fully immerse all equipment: hoses, spoons, bungs, hydrometers, thermometers, airlocks, and primary lid. Soak equipment for at least 20 min. Remove lid, rinse carefully (but thoroughly) with hot water and turn it upside-down on the counter. Rinse equipment, placing items inside sanitized lid. To sanitize a carboy: With bung in carboy, slosh 9 litres (2 gal.) Diversol solution all around inside. Repeat twice, with 5 minutes between repetitions. Rinse after 20 min. Cautions Corrodes stainless steel. Can bleach clothing. Do not mix with acids, amines, or ammonia. Such a mixture produces dangerous gases.

6. One Step since it came with my kit. I have not noticed any discernible effects of the two. I use star-san because it can be re-used and I can buy it in larger quantities.

7. 70% Isopropyl Alcohol for little parts

8. Potassium Metabisulphate (Campden tablets) Potassium metabisulfite is sometimes used in the brewing industry to inhibit the growth of wild yeasts, bacteria, and fungi. This is called 'stabilizing'. It is used both by homebrewers and commercial brewers alike. It is not used as much for brewing beer, because the wort is almost always boiled, which kills most microorganisms anyway.
Click to expand...

I have a bad smell in my fermenter. I have cleaned with bleach and still have like a funky smell that effects taste. I’ve brewed a few batches and it all tastes the same regardless of the recepe and the taste is like the smell.
I think its caused by, well, I don’t know what, maybe not good cleaning?
It's kind of hoppy, the smell, yet not good and I'm an IPA guy. I'd use hops as air freshener, so its not that hops are bad, but this is a bad hop-like smell. It’s just off. It's not a chemical smell. I've used just water to clean or One Step. Recently I used straight bleach. I sanitize with Idophor.
What is it and how do I get rid of it?
 
What kind of fermentor are you using? If it's glass or stainless I don't know why you would still have this issue. You just have to make sure you clean them really well. If it's plastic, i wouldn't try anything else, i would pitch it and buy a new one. It's not worth the effort and stress of worrying "did I clean it good enough and did I fix the problem". So 2-3 months after you think you fixed it and after your $60 10 gallon batch of beer is done fermenting, you find out it's still screwed up.
 
pola0502ds said:
What kind of fermentor are you using? If it's glass or stainless I don't know why you would still have this issue. You just have to make sure you clean them really well. If it's plastic, i wouldn't try anything else, i would pitch it and buy a new one. It's not worth the effort and stress of worrying "did I clean it good enough and did I fix the problem". So 2-3 months after you think you fixed it and after your $60 10 gallon batch of beer is done fermenting, you find out it's still screwed up.
Click to expand...

its plastic
 
For the sake of clarity, and for non US brewers, could you tell us what these products are?

Oxyclean - is this the laundry product, ?

Would that be the same as something like this? Vanish

One Step - is this a bleach?

Starsan isnt available here either, we have something called Perasan : Peracetic acid based oxidising disinfectant which is free rinsing, low foaming and non-selective. Exhibits a broad spectrum kill at ambient temperature. Should be used at ambient temperature, at concentrations of 0.15 to 0.5% (1.5 - 5ml / L of water). Solution must remain in contact with surface for minimum of 5 mins. Hot water should not be used as this causes corrosion.
 

Similar threads

R
Question regarding cleaning tap and beer lines
Replies
14
Views
2K
alex pablate
alex pablate
micraftbeer
Using pH Meter Continually While Adding Alkaline Cleaner
Replies
0
Views
330
micraftbeer
micraftbeer
R
For Sale Los Angeles/Pasadena, CA Area - Wine Tabletop/Floor Corker, Bottle Tree, and 144 Bottle Wine Rack
Replies
0
Views
230
rtogio
R
CallMeKiupid
Kiupid's Mead Guide for Beginners (like me)
Replies
3
Views
1K
Barzahl
B
R
Home brew kits
Replies
0
Views
289
Rotzfresser
R
Brewer's Friend 300

Latest posts

Back
Top