Spruce/Pine Ale help

Ok, this is the first recipe that I have attempted to make on my own (with the help of the free software Q-Brew). Anyway, I am going for a spruce or pine flavored ale for Christmas time. I believe that Chinook hops with impart a pine type aroma and flavor perhaps.

Could some of the more experienced brewers here critique this recipe and maybe offer some suggestions on how to add to this to make it 1) a little darker and 2) more pine or spruce flavored?

Boil Volume 5.25 gallon
SG: 1.045 – 1.060
IBU: 30 – 45
Color: 5 – 14

Fermentables:
0.5 lbs CaraPils (steeped)
1.0 lbs Crystal 60L (steeped)
6 lbs Light DME

Hops:
1.0 oz Chinook (11.5%) @ 60min
0.5 oz Fuggles (4.0%) @ 20min
0.5 oz Fuggles (4.0%) @ 0min

Yeast:
Safale-05

Estimated OG 1.056
Estimated FG 1.014
Estimated IBU 47
Estimated Color 12
Estimated Alcohol by Weight 4.3%

I apologize for the formatting as I do not have any of the software yet to use.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Simcoe hops have a very piney flavor to them, Chinook can be a harsh hop if overdone.

There are spruce extracts available, but use them very sparingly.

I don't know much about Chinook hops, but since you have it as your 60 minute addition, you're not going to get much flavor or aroma (pine or otherwise) from it. If you want Chinook flavor, add it somewhere around 20 minutes; if you want Chinook aroma, add it somewhere under 8 minutes (or even at flame out and/or dry hopped).

As for making it darker - you could add an ounce or two of darker malt (e.g. chocolate malt) or roasted barley.

david_42 said:

There are spruce extracts available, but use them very sparingly.

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I second this. I brewed the spruce beer from The Compete Joy of Homebrewing and used the specified amount of spruce extract. What the book did not tell me, was that it would take 4 months before the beer was drinkable. At the one month mark it tasted like Pinesol. I still get crap about that beer from family members at Christmas.

For Pine, look no further than Simcoe hops! IMHO, do away with your Fuggle additions and sub in 1 ounce (instead of .5 oz) of Simcoe. My favorite hop!

Ok, no fuggles. Instead substitute some Simcoe for them. I can understand that. Now should I use 1oz of Simcoe at 20mins or 0.5 at 20mins and 0.5 at flame out?

Spruce extract is CRAZY strong. I've been aging 10 gallons of beer made with 1/4 the recommended amount for two years, and it's still undrinkable. Use it VERY sparingly.

Chugger said:

Ok, no fuggles. Instead substitute some Simcoe for them. I can understand that. Now should I use 1oz of Simcoe at 20mins or 0.5 at 20mins and 0.5 at flame out?

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I would do this...
1oz Chinook at 60
1/2oz Simcoe at 10
1/2oz Chinook at 5
1/2oz Simcoe at 0

:rockin:

I've got an IPA on tap that has a nice pine note to it. Most of the Boil hops were either neutral flavored, or of the citrusy type. However I dry hopped with 1 oz each of Simcoe and Chinook. It took about 1 month of aging in the keg for the pine to really come out over the citrusy boil hops.

I'm thinking this years Holiday ale for me will be based off my Scottish Ale to which I'll and some spices, and then dry hop as above.

Chugger said:

Ok, no fuggles. Instead substitute some Simcoe for them. I can understand that. Now should I use 1oz of Simcoe at 20mins or 0.5 at 20mins and 0.5 at flame out?

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It depends on how "Piney" you want it. I would use 1 ounce at 10 minutes, then .5 at 5 minutes and .5 at flameout.

Why not use real Spruce?

I came across a small Pine tree while up in the UP this summer and it had the most wonderful citrus/pine aroma. So far have not positively ID'ed the exact tree, but I have found none of them near my home so far. I may go back up and grab a few of the young shoots. I was going to get some at that time, but was on protected land, and didn't want to disturb the environment. It looked like there were plenty more on the way home, but I was pushing the ferry as it was.

Homercidal said:

Why not use real Spruce?

I came across a small Pine tree while up in the UP this summer and it had the most wonderful citrus/pine aroma. So far have not positively ID'ed the exact tree, but I have found none of them near my home so far. I may go back up and grab a few of the young shoots. I was going to get some at that time, but was on protected land, and didn't want to disturb the environment. It looked like there were plenty more on the way home, but I was pushing the ferry as it was.

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I made a Barleywine in the Spring with Spruce tips from a tree in my yard. It's still bulk conditioning, but from the samples I tasted, the spruce flavor isn't quite piney like you would think - it's hard to explain - maybe more fruity? Anyways, from what I've read, you only want to use new growth, which means harvesting/using it in the Spring. At this time of year (unless you're in the Southern Hemisphere) you're not going to find new growth.

JLem said:

I made a Barleywine in the Spring with Spruce tips from a tree in my yard. It's still bulk conditioning, but from the samples I tasted, the spruce flavor isn't quite piney like you would think - it's hard to explain - maybe more fruity? Anyways, from what I've read, you only want to use new growth, which means harvesting/using it in the Spring. At this time of year (unless you're in the Southern Hemisphere) you're not going to find new growth.

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Oh, yeah, it's too late now (although that other pine tree I was looking at had plenty of young growth on and that was not that long ago.) I'm just pointing out that it's a possibility.

the Alaskan Winter Ale uses Sitka spruce tips. Wonder if anyone has a recipe for this beer?

JLem said:

I made a Barleywine in the Spring with Spruce tips from a tree in my yard. It's still bulk conditioning, but from the samples I tasted, the spruce flavor isn't quite piney like you would think - it's hard to explain - maybe more fruity? Anyways, from what I've read, you only want to use new growth, which means harvesting/using it in the Spring. At this time of year (unless you're in the Southern Hemisphere) you're not going to find new growth.

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Why only the new growth and tips?

jgln said:

Why only the new growth and tips?

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New growth has more citrus flavors and old growth is more resiny and more apt to taste like turpentine from what I hear.

But lots of people make pine tea form many different trees and get good vitamins and such, and they say it ain't that bad tastin.

Ever hear of someone making an Italian beer? You know, oragano and basil?

Yuri_Rage said:

Spruce extract is CRAZY strong. I've been aging 10 gallons of beer made with 1/4 the recommended amount for two years, and it's still undrinkable. Use it VERY sparingly.

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Where could I find some spruce extract?

jgln said:

Why only the new growth and tips?

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Fresher, more vibrant flavor, not really piney or "sappy". You want to get them when their still soft and light green - if you taste some raw, you'll get a nice idea of the flavor - I can definitely understand the citrus comparison.

Just made a beer with torrey pine resin, 1/2 oz in 5 gal. It is turning out quite interesting. It adds a full, warming quality, and the flavor is hard to place, but nice.

I did a hoppy pale ale with centennials for all additions. And it tastes fine, but it is a bit like biting into a piece of pine wood. I always think of baseball bats when I have one. I do like it though. I would replace spruce tips with a centennial first wort hopping or flavor addition any day.