Bottles Over Carbonated - Please Help!

I have an over carbonation issue with a recent batch and I can't figure out why. I open a bottle (12oz), wait a moment, then foam comes flowing out of the bottle. When foaming finally stops, I have about 1/3 of a beer left. FG was steady at 1.022 for over a week before racking to secondary, then spent over 3 weeks in the secondary before bottling (6 weeks total). Used 3oz of priming sugar for a 5gal batch.

Batch details:
PM with 9lbs grain + 4lbs DME
OG = 1.085
FG = 1.022
ABV = 8.4%
Bottled on 1/22
when in secondary, added cold pressed coffee and cocoa powder (100% cocoa, no sugar)

I've used (http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html) to calculate proper amount (after the fact), and that results in 2.6oz. I can't believe 0.4oz too much is causing the amount of over carbonation we are seeing.

Any thoughts to what my issue is?

Meant to add, that we may have racked too much yeast into the bottling bucket (did a form of cold crash for 1.5 days prior). This is our leading option thus far.

I'm probably not the best person to judge this but 1.022 seems pretty high for a FG.

Though if the gravity didn't change for a week...?
What was the fermentation temperature? and then the temp where the bottles were stored?

mutedog said:

I'm probably not the best person to judge this but 1.022 seems pretty high for a FG.

Though if the gravity didn't change for a week...?
What was the fermentation temperature? and then the temp where the bottles were stored?

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Ferm temp = 62F-65F
Bottle temp = 68F

Estimated FG was 1.024 (via hopville), mashed @ 152F/153F
It is a stout containing 1.5lbs chocolate malt, 0.5lbs roasted barley, 0.5lbs dark crystal

It's possible that the (albeit slight) increase in temp caused the yeast to kick back into gear and shave off a few more gravity points. Which, when coupled with the sugar you added, would cause the overcarbing.

Any lactose in the stout? The crystal would contribute some unfermentable sugar. Post the whole recipe. Also, after it foams out, how does it taste? A wild yeast and/or bacterial infection can cause gushers. Are you opening them cold and if so, how long have they been in the fridge?

1) How long has it been since you bottled?
2) What has the 'procedure' been since bottling? (Ie, 3 weeks at room temp followed by 2 days in the fridge, etc)
3) What temperature are the bottles at when they are being opened?
4) How does the beer taste?

3 ounces of priming sugar is NOT a lot. I've used quite a bit more than that for a 5 gallon batch (though, admittedly, I don't know what your fermentation temp was, so I don't know how much residual CO2 you had before bottling) and not had gushers.

I bought my wife a 6 pack of ESB, and some of the bottles in there gushed when I opened them, but it was when they hadn't been in the fridge for very long. I put the last 3 bottles in the fridge, and didn't open one until it had been in overnight, and no more gushers...

wiescins said:

Any thoughts to what my issue is?

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Are you chilling your bottles before opening them?

when you primed, did you prime the whole batch or individual bottles?

i had the same issue as you once where the bottle, when opened, flipped out and barfed everywhere. my problem was i forgot to add the priming sugar at the beginning of racking into the bottling bucket and instead added at the end and had to stir the beer ever so slightly to mix in the priming sugar. well, guess what didnt get mixed all that well...

Kaz said:

Any lactose in the stout? The crystal would contribute some unfermentable sugar. Post the whole recipe. Also, after it foams out, how does it taste? A wild yeast and/or bacterial infection can cause gushers. Are you opening them cold and if so, how long have they been in the fridge?

Click to expand...

No lactose.

5lbs 2-row
1.5lbs chocolate malt
1lb flaked oats
0.5lb golden naked oats
0.5lb dark crystal
0.5lb roasted barley
4lbs light DME

poured into glass and tasted yeasty, left in fridge for 20min and a pretty large layer of yeast forming on bottom, then in tastes really good.

LVBen said:

Are you chilling your bottles before opening them?

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yes, in fridge at least over night.

Try chilling one down for 4+ days in the fridge before pouring a glass of it... I usually chill mine down for at least 5 days before opening one. If I open one in less than 2-3 days, I get the result you mentioned. Those few extra days can really help.

...

dorklord said:

1) How long has it been since you bottled?
2) What has the 'procedure' been since bottling? (Ie, 3 weeks at room temp followed by 2 days in the fridge, etc)
3) What temperature are the bottles at when they are being opened?
4) How does the beer taste?

3 ounces of priming sugar is NOT a lot. I've used quite a bit more than that for a 5 gallon batch (though, admittedly, I don't know what your fermentation temp was, so I don't know how much residual CO2 you had before bottling) and not had gushers.

I bought my wife a 6 pack of ESB, and some of the bottles in there gushed when I opened them, but it was when they hadn't been in the fridge for very long. I put the last 3 bottles in the fridge, and didn't open one until it had been in overnight, and no more gushers...

Click to expand...

1) bottled on 1/22
2) left on 2nd bedroom prior to moving into fridge (~68F), in fridge 1-5 days prior to opening
3) just out of fridge (going to guess ~38F)
4) very good once yeast settles

pwndabear said:

when you primed, did you prime the whole batch or individual bottles?

i had the same issue as you once where the bottle, when opened, flipped out and barfed everywhere. my problem was i forgot to add the priming sugar at the beginning of racking into the bottling bucket and instead added at the end and had to stir the beer ever so slightly to mix in the priming sugar. well, guess what didnt get mixed all that well...

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boiled 2 cups of water with 3oz priming sugar. Added sugar solution to bottling bucket. Racked onto sugar solution so that beer swirled and mixed with sugar solution.

wiescins said:

1) bottled on 1/22
2) left on 2nd bedroom prior to moving into fridge (~68F), in fridge 1-5 days prior to opening
3) just out of fridge (going to guess ~38F)
4) very good once yeast settles

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I notice your comments about the yeast settling.

If the yeast hasn't settled yet, and is floating around in the beer all wimbly-bimbly like, it may be providing nucleation points for the CO2 to come out of solution. (Actually, just as fun trick, take a bottle of beer and toss a pinch of sugar in it...it's almost as good as mentos and cola...)

I just can't believe that a beer bottled over a month ago, the yeast hasn't settled out yet (and doesn't settle out after being in the fridge for a few days).

Leave some in the fridge for over a week... I've yet to have a batch that didn't become properly carbonated if given enough time at room temp, and then enough time in the fridge. Just 3oz of priming sugar for 5 gallons won't push it into 'over carbonated' CO2 volumes.

dorklord said:

I notice your comments about the yeast settling.

If the yeast hasn't settled yet, and is floating around in the beer all wimbly-bimbly like, it may be providing nucleation points for the CO2 to come out of solution. (Actually, just as fun trick, take a bottle of beer and toss a pinch of sugar in it...it's almost as good as mentos and cola...)

I just can't believe that a beer bottled over a month ago, the yeast hasn't settled out yet (and doesn't settle out after being in the fridge for a few days).

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I believe the yeast has settled, but the eruption brings it back into solution.

wiescins said:

...
when in secondary, added cold pressed coffee and cocoa powder (100% cocoa, no sugar)

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Is that sanitary?

Also, take a gravity reading from a bottle. De-carbonate the sample first.

I have commercial craft brews gush if the temp in my refrigerator is too low. If I open a gusher I just turn my frig control a notch or two warmer, and the problem goes away.

Hex said:

Is that sanitary?

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Tools used were sanitzed with iodaphor. No way to sanitze the coffee and cocoa. Also, was put into an 8.4% beer.

Thus far the collective opinion seems to be that I didn't add too much priming sugar. I don't think it is infection, because there are not serious off flavors.

There are 2 somewhat contradictory ideas, (1) keep in fridge longer, and (2) turn the fridge temp up. I have a bottle that was put in the fridge last Saturday, so i'll open that tomorrow (full week) and will also open a bottle that is still at room temp and how those go.

Ok, how's this one? Did you stir the beer after adding priming sugar?

Hex said:

Ok, how's this one? Did you stir the beer after adding priming sugar?

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yes, a very slight stir so that no bubbles were produced, just enough to assure even distribution of priming sugar solution.

Rockape66 said:

I have commercial craft brews gush if the temp in my refrigerator is too low. If I open a gusher I just turn my frig control a notch or two warmer, and the problem goes away.

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Just a question, and not that I'm trying to be a jerk, but are you sure that you were RAISING the temperature in your fridge?

I'm asking simply because:

1) Fridges are dumb. My fridge, there's 2 knobs, the one for the fridge is labelled with numbers, with 9 being the coldest and 1 being the warmest. The other knob is for the freezer, and is labeled with letters. Look at another fridge, you'll probably find that 1 is coldest and 9 is highest.

2) Increasing the temperature to prevent gushers doesn't make sense. The only thing I can think of that makes this make sense would be if your beer was just on the edge of freezing (as I know that beer that ice crystals in beer can cause gushing).

wiescins said:

yes, a very slight stir so that no bubbles were produced, just enough to assure even distribution of priming sugar solution.

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Well, if you find only some bottles over-carbed, this will probably be the culprit. I've had this once, and now stir the beer/primer quite well, a good swirl in the bottling bucket, to the point of creating a small whirlpool.

wiescins said:

I have a bottle that was put in the fridge last Saturday, so i'll open that tomorrow (full week) and will also open a bottle that is still at room temp and how those go.

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Take a gravity reading of the next one you open.

Update for anyone following.

Yesteday I opened 2 bottles, 1 had been in the fridge for 2 weeks, the other was at room temp (~68F). Both erupted equally, no difference.

I have about a 1/2 of beer sitting out (cold crashed in fridge and dumped into another glass to leave yeast behind). As soon as I stop being lazy i'll take a gravity reading.

At this point I still have no idea whats causing the over carbonation.

Finally got around to taking a gravity reading, still 1.022. I officially have no idea why this is happening.

wiescins said:

Meant to add, that we may have racked too much yeast into the bottling bucket (did a form of cold crash for 1.5 days prior). This is our leading option thus far.

Click to expand...

Any thoughts around racking too much yeast into the bottling bucket? Could this be the culprit?

I can't imagine that too much yeast would be a problem.

Random thought, how full are you filling your bottles? Less airspace in the bottle would cause more gas to be absorbed. My bottles are all filled about 1.75 inches below the top of the cap.

IceFisherChris said:

Random thought, how full are you filling your bottles? Less airspace in the bottle would cause more gas to be absorbed. My bottles are all filled about 1.75 inches below the top of the cap.

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Filled to mid/upper neck area. This one has me baffled.

The simplest answer is often the correct one. Perhaps you simply erred and added more priming sugar than you should have. I had one batch that failed to fully carbonate, and the only logical conclusion I've been able to draw is that I used less priming sugar than I calculated, and wrote down that I used.

dorklord said:

The simplest answer is often the correct one. Perhaps you simply erred and added more priming sugar than you should have. I had one batch that failed to fully carbonate, and the only logical conclusion I've been able to draw is that I used less priming sugar than I calculated, and wrote down that I used.

Click to expand...

Indeed. That is what im going to have to call it, at least for now. It's definitely not satisfying.

How long have these beers been bottle conditioning? Your OG was 1.085? That's what I think of as a high gravity beer. It's been my (limited) experience that all of my high grav beers do this when I open them too soon. I've been on a high gravity brewing kick lately (last 5 batches) and all of them had this problem until I decided to let them bottle condition longer. Some of them have been aging 8 weeks. Now when I refrigerate them I have time to get them into a glass without the foam geyser that cost me 2/3 of my pour although they still taste a bit young.

maybe letting this batch condition longer will help solve this problem. I know it helped with mine.

Could you have a sanitary continimate in your bottles? I know that if soap or something is left behind it could create a surface for the CO2 to adhere to and force it out of solution. Without knowing specific yeast strain and looking over your receipe, the OG and FG rations seem reasonable - if you look you will see a lot of ~75% attenuation not exact because of all the factors, but a good guide for a first order look.

Flavor isn't off so a 2ndary bacteria seems unlikely. I've not made a big beer yet so I bow to the wisdom of others that longer aging might help...

When you drink the 1/3 of the beer thats left does it taste overcarbonated? I have heard that people will have gushers before the beer is ready simply because it hasn't been able to reabsorb into solution yet. Although leaving in the fridge for a week should cover that?

Seems like a weird thing going on. I add more than 3 oz to ~5gallon batches and haven't had problems.

I added 2.5 oz table sugar to a dunkel,been 4 weeks no blow.Thinkin bout cellaring(just in case-soon though) ha. Oh 2.5 for 1.7 gal wich would be 7.5 oz table sugar/5 gal, should i be nervous? Hmm. this was not even the high end of the brew calc for a dunkle.