New Guy Looking For Suggestions

Well, this is my first post here. I've been reading off this forum for at least a few hours an evening for the past 2-3 weeks and figured it's about time I start asking questions!

I've wanted to try my hand at home brewing for a couple years now and I think I'm at the point I'm ready to spend some money and give it a try, but before I pull the trigger and risk spending money on the wrong equipment, I'm here to ask of your advise and suggestions.

So, my beers of choice are, Imperial Stouts, Porters and my cheap and light go to beer has always been a Hefeweizen, so those are my brews of interest.

I'm wanting to do a full all grain brew setup. I'm trying to keep equipment costs to a minimum since I'm new to this and I've got a baby on the way. Kinda figured, since I'm not drinking (since the wife can't drink) I'd brew instead!

Here's my equipment list, if anyone has suggestions this is where I need the help and/or advice, as well.

30qt Turkey Fryer setup for step mash
Fermtech 1/2" auto siphon
spring loaded bottle filler
3 piece airlock+carboy bung x2
triple scale hydrometer w/ 10" glass test "jar"
12" stainless thermometer
bottles
bottle capper+caps
8oz star-san

That totals up to $130 shipped.
I've got two plastic 5g water jugs in the style of carboys at my disposal.

I'll need a few odds and ends, need to build a sparge manifold or false bottom, need all the necessary tubing, copper tubing for a chiller and a fly sparge setup

I was planning on going with 5 gallon HDPE buckets from Home Depot or similar, spigot on one to use for Sparge water source and fly sparge. Using a 5 gallon bucket for primary fermentation or the plastic 5g carboys, however it plays out and maybe a smaller bucket for secondary fermentation, if need be?

I know typical is 6.5 buckets for 5 gallons, so I'll have to downsize my brew and ingredients, which is fine, smaller batches mean I can brew more frequently, giving me more of a tinkering/learning curve and also should enable me to brew multiple styles of brew, at least I hope.

So, thoughts? Suggestions? What am I missing?

I would go ahead and get a 10 gallon boiler. I've gone through 3 of them getting up to the 10 not thinking I needed one that big.

You plan on fly sparging but I don't see mention of a mash tun. If you want to keep costs down maybe consider BIAB, although I'd go with a bigger pot in that case.

BWE said:

I would go ahead and get a 10 gallon boiler. I've gone through 3 of them getting up to the 10 not thinking I needed one that big.

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Jumping up that big in size is gonna kill the wallet, the 30qt should be enough for my small batch brews to start out though, no?

chickypad said:

You plan on fly sparging but I don't see mention of a mash tun. If you want to keep costs down maybe consider BIAB, although I'd go with a bigger pot in that case.

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I was planning on using the turkey fryer to step mash, then pour into a 5g bucket with spigot, to a fly sparge setup over another 5g bucket.

So there will be a false bottom in your pot, you will drain everything to buckets, dump the grain and clean the pot, then pour the cooling wort back in for the boil? I have to say that sounds like a PITA and would extend your brew day. If you're doing smaller batches I think you could BIAB a 4 gal batch in that pot. I do 3 gal in my 5 gal pot and can't quite fit a full volume mash so I think you would be fine. I get about the same efficiency BIAB or fly sparging.

Edit: How are you heating the sparge water? If your HLT is a bucket that's not going to hold heat very long and you've only got the one pot.

While a larger kettle will make things easier you can do a BIAB with a 30 quart kettle. My buddy Don gets by using a 5 gallon kettle using that method. Seeing as how you have a baby on the way and need to control costs that would be your best method. You will just be making smaller batches.
If you have a 2nd kettle (say an old pressure cooker) you can sparge by dunking the bag in that 2nd kettle and soaking out some sugars. In this way you can get to 5 gallon batches. Your boil will not be terribly vigorous, but it works for Don. Just up your bittering hops. I am not sure if the home depot buckets are food safe; a better idea might be to scrounge some buckets from a restaurant (be sure to get the lid). If you can afford the plastic bucket from your LBHS (brewers best or whatever) those work very well. I presume that you are saving up though for the forthcoming offspring. The BIAB method does require a bag that will run you around $20 dollars. You might also try 2nd hand stores for large pots, pressure cookers etc… Another possibility is something like United Cash And Carry and a 40 quart Aluminium pot. Those run around $55 here in WA. If you go with Aluminium, read up on the oxidation layer you will need to protect your beer.

Cheers

You will always need a solid boil kettle. It's a pretty solid investment. Just make sure you don't go too small- you might end up upgrading later

Go BIAB, especially for smaller batches until you can afford a proper 3-vessel system. Then again, you may never switch from BIAB.
Buy a bigger pot now than you think you need. It will be cheaper than buying it twice. Which is what WILL happen if you go 5 gallon. Go at least 8 gallon. Check out Concord pots on ebay for a decent pot at a reasonable price.
5 gallon paint strainer bags from Lowes or Home Depot make adequate grain bags for BIAB and they are cheap! Less than $5 for a couple of them.

chickypad said:

So there will be a false bottom in your pot, you will drain everything to buckets, dump the grain and clean the pot, then pour the cooling wort back in for the boil? I have to say that sounds like a PITA and would extend your brew day. If you're doing smaller batches I think you could BIAB a 4 gal batch in that pot. I do 3 gal in my 5 gal pot and can't quite fit a full volume mash so I think you would be fine. I get about the same efficiency BIAB or fly sparging.

Edit: How are you heating the sparge water? If your HLT is a bucket that's not going to hold heat very long and you've only got the one pot.

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I watched the basic brewing-stepping into all grain dvd. From what I gathered, I could use a turkey fryer, boil my grains, closely monitor temps and apply heat as needed for step mashing. Once finished, pour into bucket with a spigot on it and internal filter/false bottom, verlauf and sparge from that into primary fermenter either 5g bucket or 5g plastic carboy I have?

Aonghus said:

While a larger kettle will make things easier you can do a BIAB with a 30 quart kettle. My buddy Don gets by using a 5 gallon kettle using that method. Seeing as how you have a baby on the way and need to control costs that would be your best method. You will just be making smaller batches.
If you have a 2nd kettle (say an old pressure cooker) you can sparge by dunking the bag in that 2nd kettle and soaking out some sugars. In this way you can get to 5 gallon batches. Your boil will not be terribly vigorous, but it works for Don. Just up your bittering hops. I am not sure if the home depot buckets are food safe; a better idea might be to scrounge some buckets from a restaurant (be sure to get the lid). If you can afford the plastic bucket from your LBHS (brewers best or whatever) those work very well. I presume that you are saving up though for the forthcoming offspring. The BIAB method does require a bag that will run you around $20 dollars. You might also try 2nd hand stores for large pots, pressure cookers etc… Another possibility is something like United Cash And Carry and a 40 quart Aluminium pot. Those run around $55 here in WA. If you go with Aluminium, read up on the oxidation layer you will need to protect your beer.

Cheers

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I checked cash and carry, kinda leary of aluminum, and I read online that Home depot buckets were HDPE, not sure, I'll have to shop and see in person, I did think of checking local restaurants too.

Nihil said:

I watched the basic brewing-stepping into all grain dvd. From what I gathered, I could use a turkey fryer, boil my grains, closely monitor temps and apply heat as needed for step mashing. Once finished, pour into bucket with a spigot on it and internal filter/false bottom, verlauf and sparge from that into primary fermenter either 5g bucket or 5g plastic carboy I have?

Click to expand...

So you've collected your wort in the bucket or carboy, then you have to clean out your kettle with all the grain before you pour the wort back in to boil (you don't boil the grain, BTW, you're holding it at mash temps). That's the part that sounds like a PITA. With a bag, you can just lift the grains out and start your boil straight away.
In addition, if you were going to sparge from a bucket you would need to heat up that water so it's ready at the end of the mash. Typically you would heat that up in your kettle while your mash was being conducted, but you won't have the kettle available. If you try to heat the water up before the mash and store it in the bucket it's going to cool off by the end of the mash I would think.

chickypad said:

So you've collected your wort in the bucket or carboy, then you have to clean out your kettle with all the grain before you pour the wort back in to boil (you don't boil the grain, BTW, you're holding it at mash temps). That's the part that sounds like a PITA. With a bag, you can just lift the grains out and start your boil straight away.
In addition, if you were going to sparge from a bucket you would need to heat up that water so it's ready at the end of the mash. Typically you would heat that up in your kettle while your mash was being conducted, but you won't have the kettle available. If you try to heat the water up before the mash and store it in the bucket it's going to cool off by the end of the mash I would think.

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Ohhh I seeee...See, I'm still trying to make sense of everything that I've been reading and watching. The bits and pieces I've watched, aren't complete start to finish and there's so much to read and so much info to research and learn from.

I could swear in that dvd, they go through their process, they reach their strike temp, mash in, step mash, talk about mashing out, then it cuts to them with the mash tun poured into a lauter bucket, from there they sparge and it ends. I believe they use a hefeweizen brew for the demonstration, don't know if that matters, wouldn't think so?

1. What is your initial budget?
2. What is your initial budget?
3. What is your initial budget?

That looks like a reasonable list.
Include a valve on the pot, allow another $30, maybe a tiny bit less.

I do 5 gallon batches, BIAB with a 32qt Al pot on an electric stove. The 5 gallons strains the limits of the equipment. Personal preference that I do not want to use propane.

If I switched to propane, I would definitely consider a larger brewpot for either BIAB or traditional 3-vessel. The larger pot will not necessarily kill your wallet if you stick with aluminum. My cheap 32qt tamale steamer was $30. A 40qt Al stock pot will run about $60-$80, less worries about boil-over and you can do full BIAB.

From what I gathered, I could use a turkey fryer, .. blah blah more steps .... Once finished, .. even more steps ...?

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Or, try BIAB and screw all those steps. Try it just once. It's $3 for a 5 gallon paint strainer bag. Mash, drain, boil, into the fermenter. Done.

You can go with all the other equipment next batch, I promise. This is your first AG. Take it easy on yourself

Nihil said:

I could swear in that dvd, they go through their process, they reach their strike temp, mash in, step mash, talk about mashing out, then it cuts to them with the mash tun poured into a lauter bucket, from there they sparge and it ends. I believe they use a hefeweizen brew for the demonstration, don't know if that matters, wouldn't think so?

Click to expand...

Sounds like they are just showing you the production of the wort which is unique to all grain, then they expect you to know the rest from the boil to chilling to going into the fermenter. As Epimetheus said, if you try BIAB and don't like the technique all you are out is about 2$ for the paint strainer bag. If you like it you've saved the money on all that other stuff as well as shortened your brew day (I love brewing but it's also nice to cut down wasted time). I still use several methods depending on batch size, but I gotta say IMO BIAB is the way to go for smaller batches.

The only other thing I would note is for the great majority of beers with the well modified malts available you don't need stepped mashes, a single infusion step is fine. I would highly recommend that at least until you get your process down, then you can learn about steps and figure out for yourself when you would want to use them.

Epimetheus said:

1. What is your initial budget?
2. What is your initial budget?
3. What is your initial budget?

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I'd like to stay under $200. From what I've see with the various kits online, they can exceed that and not have much more than my list, so I figure I'm ahead of the game with my small savings.

Epimetheus said:

That looks like a reasonable list.
Include a valve on the pot, allow another $30, maybe a tiny bit less.

I do 5 gallon batches, BIAB with a 32qt Al pot on an electric stove. The 5 gallons strains the limits of the equipment. Personal preference that I do not want to use propane.

If I switched to propane, I would definitely consider a larger brewpot for either BIAB or traditional 3-vessel. The larger pot will not necessarily kill your wallet if you stick with aluminum. My cheap 32qt tamale steamer was $30. A 40qt Al stock pot will run about $60-$80, less worries about boil-over and you can do full BIAB.


Or, try BIAB and screw all those steps. Try it just once. It's $3 for a 5 gallon paint strainer bag. Mash, drain, boil, into the fermenter. Done.

You can go with all the other equipment next batch, I promise. This is your first AG. Take it easy on yourself

Click to expand...

True, I guess I'm just trying to think ahead here by getting as much equipment as I'll need for a while, until I want to make larger batches. Basically enable myself to be able to brew whatever, however, just on a smaller scale until I have everything down perfectly. I was surprised at how cheap the aluminum pots were at cash&carry.

chickypad said:

Sounds like they are just showing you the production of the wort which is unique to all grain, then they expect you to know the rest from the boil to chilling to going into the fermenter. As Epimetheus said, if you try BIAB and don't like the technique all you are out is about 2$ for the paint strainer bag. If you like it you've saved the money on all that other stuff as well as shortened your brew day (I love brewing but it's also nice to cut down wasted time). I still use several methods depending on batch size, but I gotta say IMO BIAB is the way to go for smaller batches.

The only other thing I would note is for the great majority of beers with the well modified malts available you don't need stepped mashes, a single infusion step is fine. I would highly recommend that at least until you get your process down, then you can learn about steps and figure out for yourself when you would want to use them.

Click to expand...

Are there any step by step guides? I do feel like I'm missing pieces to the puzzle, most of the info I come up with on the internet is more specific to improving a single step in the process.

I've got another video I came across online, seems like a home made one. They boil their water in the mash tun, BIAB, once that's done, they remove it, add their extract, bring back to a boil, add hops at their required stages, remove from heat, cool and pour into a glass carboy for primary then go to secondary a week or two later, then bottle once done.

Nihil said:

I've got another video I came across online, seems like a home made one. They boil their water in the mash tun, BIAB, once that's done, they remove it, add their extract, bring back to a boil, add hops at their required stages, remove from heat, cool and pour into a glass carboy for primary then go to secondary a week or two later, then bottle once done.

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Sounds like a partial mash brew, but it's the same basic procedure just without needing any extract as all your sugars will come from your mash. They aren't boiling the mash, the bag is removed after the mash before the boil (don't boil the grains!).

Try reading through this sticky in the BIAB forum. You don't need the the metal basket and can just use the bag, and for smaller batches likely won't need a pulley system, but it's a nice write up for the basic process.

How to Brew is another good resource. The online version is free but outdated, I recommend the newer print version.

chickypad said:

Sounds like a partial mash brew, but it's the same basic procedure just without needing any extract as all your sugars will come from your mash. They aren't boiling the mash, the bag is removed after the mash before the boil (don't boil the grains!).

Try reading through this sticky in the BIAB forum. You don't need the the metal basket and can just use the bag, and for smaller batches likely won't need a pulley system, but it's a nice write up for the basic process.

How to Brew is another good resource. The online version is free but outdated, I recommend the newer print version.

Click to expand...

Alright, so I've spent some time reading the BIAB stuff and also the single vessel all grain brew as well. Now I'm thinkin' that'd be an easier way to go.

As far as equipment, what I have listed, is essential, either way? I can add some bigger stock pots later on for the full all grain setup?

Go to smart n final or some local grocery chain and get a 40 qt aluminum tamale pot. Mine was $19.99 on sale at smart n final. I can regularly get one for $30ish at my local ethnic market.

Get a voile curtain from Walmart, Lowes, Ikea, etc. (2 panels from Ikea for under $5... FWIW I now use a bag from wilserbrewer here on HBT) to do BIAB.
Read the BIAB stickies. It's easy.

Go to a bakery, Chinese restaurant, etc. and ask for their cast off buckets. I get mine from a soap making shop. Food grade. 5-7 gallons. Free.

Pot, bag, bucket. That's all you need.

Then bottles, capper, bottling wand. Get more than one bucket. At least one fermeter, one bottling bucket. Drill a hole and install a spigot ~$2 in one bucket.


So were looking at $20-30 for the pot...$5 voile curtain, free buckets... $2 spigot... $15 capper, $3 bottling wand, $10 autosiphon, $5 tubing, free bottles (you've been saving the bottles from beers you're buying, right? You'll need 50-60 for a batch. Don't worry you'll have a few weeks to stock up). $3 caps

Not so bad, cost wise...

Time wise? With a new baby? Good luck!

Oh.. and by the way... Welcome to the obsession!

Welcome to your new obsession. With a single pot, as folks have said, BIAB is a good place to start. If you are really down with the all-grain ... look into getting a ten gallon igloo cooler and converting it into a mashtun.

Also, I would encourage you to get a couple ale pales from the LHBS, you can do your fermenting in those and they are much easier to clean and harvest yeast from. As others have said, you can pick up used food grade buckets ... my only heartburn with this is that they can be scratched and scratches are hiding places for nasties that will ruin your beer.

Keep in mind that while there are several ways to make wort - fermentation is where all roads meet. Spend some time learning how to manage yeast, sterilization and fermentation temps.

Good luck and remember - you pretty much always end up with beer (unless you kill your yeast by pitching it into wort that is too hot). Pay attention to your sanitation (obsess over it) and you'll make pretty good beer.

jtratcliff said:

Go to smart n final or some local grocery chain and get a 40 qt aluminum tamale pot. Mine was $19.99 on sale at smart n final. I can regularly get one for $30ish at my local ethnic market.

Get a voile curtain from Walmart, Lowes, Ikea, etc. (2 panels from Ikea for under $5... FWIW I now use a bag from wilserbrewer here on HBT) to do BIAB.
Read the BIAB stickies. It's easy.

Go to a bakery, Chinese restaurant, etc. and ask for their cast off buckets. I get mine from a soap making shop. Food grade. 5-7 gallons. Free.

Pot, bag, bucket. That's all you need.

Then bottles, capper, bottling wand. Get more than one bucket. At least one fermeter, one bottling bucket. Drill a hole and install a spigot ~$2 in one bucket.


So were looking at $20-30 for the pot...$5 voile curtain, free buckets... $2 spigot... $15 capper, $3 bottling wand, $10 autosiphon, $5 tubing, free bottles (you've been saving the bottles from beers you're buying, right? You'll need 50-60 for a batch. Don't worry you'll have a few weeks to stock up). $3 caps

Not so bad, cost wise...

Time wise? With a new baby? Good luck!

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True, I eventually wanna have full control over everything which is why I initially thought all grain, now...I'm thinkin keep it simple, go with the biggest pot I can so I can brew large batches, then add on until I have everything for a full all grain setup, in the mean time, build on my experience/technique to fully understand everything.

We're at 14 weeks, I've got some brew time ahead of me! haha

jtratcliff said:

Oh.. and by the way... Welcome to the obsession!

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Thanks! Thanks to everyone thus far. This is a great forum group