How much Flaked Barley 'rule of thumb'

What would be a good 'rule of thumb' for using Flaked Barley for head retention and body?

I use 1/2 to 3/4 lb per 5 gal batch. Seems to work well for me.

Beersmiths default max for flaked barley is 20%.

for head retention I do about 5%
Anymore than that and you're just asking for chill-haze

I guess it depends on the style. Dry Stouts are usually 25% (Guinness). I used 2.5lbs in my Dry Stout and Foreign Extra Stout. I've never used it in other styles though.

Depends on style. I like to go from 5%-10% for a pale, 10%-15% for an IPA or brown and 15%-25% for a stout. In all it matters what you are making, but let me tell you, that chill haze isn't a myth, but it is not something I care about one bit.

Yeah, I'm not too put out by chill haze. I like a good 3/4" head that lasts.

I've been using about 8 oz. for a 5 gal batch for a few my Belgians and I was wondering if a 30min steep was right.

I add a 1/2 lbs to most pale ales, IPAs, and porter and stouts. It has become a staple. I first used it when making EdWorts Rye IPA, now I add it to several regular recipes.

Are some of the responses confusing Roasted Barley with Flaked?

I have been using about 12 ounces for a 10 gallon batch for most beers and though it does add some body it does help greatly with head retention.

What's the *low* end for flaked barley; will 2% make any noticeable difference in a blonde ale?

In my experimentation for several years with flaked barley, you can taste the graininess of that grain in pale beers at surprisingly low percentages. While that graininess melds very nicely with roast barley flavor in dry stouts, I found it to be distracting in the pale beers.

It takes very little flaked barley to have substantial effect on heading and retention. A quarter pound in a 5 gal batch can make a huge and rocky head. Beta-glucan is very effective at creating the body to drive those head effects. A couple of ounces is more than enough to boost head.

I ultimately dropped flaked barley and went with flaked wheat since it has some of the head building ability, but the flavor is much crisper and less grainy.

Thanks, Martin. That was very helpful. So the 2 ounces I was going to add to a 4 gallon batch would be enough, OTOH it's also enough to negatively affect the taste. I will leave it out; save the barley flakes for a dark beer. Does the same go for oatmeal? (just curious, I don't think I'll add any adjuncts to this beer)

I have used a little crystal wheat malt in pale ales and liked it, but this one is just going to be pilsner malt with some Vienna and I don't want the color or any caramel.

z-bob said:

Thanks, Martin. That was very helpful. So the 2 ounces I was going to add to a 4 gallon batch would be enough, OTOH it's also enough to negatively affect the taste. I will leave it out; save the barley flakes for a dark beer. Does the same go for oatmeal? (just curious, I don't think I'll add any adjuncts to this beer)

I have used a little crystal wheat malt in pale ales and liked it, but this one is just going to be pilsner malt with some Vienna and I don't want the color or any caramel.

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I just recently did an experiment with an 100% Heidelberg smash and the same beer with 30% flaked barley. The direct taste comparison didn't show a huge difference, in fact the difference was so low that I think it might be only my brain being stupid because it just looked very hazy compared to the clear smash. I did not pay much attention to the head though...

I just added a thread about flakes that could be related with this tread too. I'm having a lot of trouble going up with flakes. If you want to take a look:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/too-much-flakes-kill-head-retention.649523/

Cheers from Italy!
Piteko

mabrungard said:

In my experimentation for several years with flaked barley, you can taste the graininess of that grain in pale beers at surprisingly low percentages. While that graininess melds very nicely with roast barley flavor in dry stouts, I found it to be distracting in the pale beers.

It takes very little flaked barley to have substantial effect on heading and retention. A quarter pound in a 5 gal batch can make a huge and rocky head. Beta-glucan is very effective at creating the body to drive those head effects. A couple of ounces is more than enough to boost head.

I ultimately dropped flaked barley and went with flaked wheat since it has some of the head building ability, but the flavor is much crisper and less grainy.

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This identical to expirences, I have used 3% in IPA's and though the foam quality is excellent I could still detect a grain aroma other the lb of hops. It was sutble but once you pick it up it was easy to distract your enjoyment.

I have used flaked wheat, but didn't find that added much. I found torrified wheat at 2-3% to work well despite negative reviews you see elsewhere.

I now use 2lb wheat malt as I find it blends and smooths the beer out as well as providing good head retention.

Did you guys do blind tests against the same beer without fb? Cause I did 30% fb with and without, 1to1 comparison and I couldn't detect any graininess at all.

Confirmation bias can be a beast!

Miraculix said:

Did you guys do blind tests against the same beer without fb? Cause I did 30% fb with and without, 1to1 comparison and I couldn't detect any graininess at all.

Confirmation bias can be a beast!

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It's interesting that you detect no difference. I find it immediately apparent. Another consideration is that having much, if any, beta-glucan in your wort is very widely seen as a negative for beer quality. There is a reason why including flaked barley is not prevalent for brewing most beers.

mabrungard said:

It's interesting that you detect no difference. I find it immediately apparent. Another consideration is that having much, if any, beta-glucan in your wort is very widely seen as a negative for beer quality. There is a reason why including flaked barley is not prevalent for brewing most beers.

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I also found it very interesting as I expected it to be a quite in your face difference at this high rate. Same with oats. The oats did do something to the body, but really not as much as I expected them to do at a 30% rate.

I read so often that oats taste like porridge and fb tastes grainy, but after those tests I did, I really believe that this is actually a confirmation bias thing.

What both adjuncts did was turning the beer really hazy and the oats made the mash turn into goo so those two factors alone would be reason enough for me to justify that they are not a standard ingredient in most beers.

I will do a side by side test this weekend if I find the time. So far I have just tasted it against each each directly out of the fermenter. Maybe with carbonation, differences will be more obvious.