First Brew Sunday

On Sunday I'll be brewing my first batch, a Scotch ale. Definitely looking forward to it. Picked up everything from the LHBS yesterday, looked at the directions, and decided to ignore them; they were obviously written for someone who grabbed the stuff on a whim and has no idea how anything works (no mention of sanitizing anywhere, ...).

But anyway, I had a couple questions to make sure I don't make a stupid mistake:

1) I only have an old 3-ish gallon stock pot very much like this one and a plastic stirring spoon. I'm planning to give the pot a good soaking with oxyclean first, but is the choice of materials going to be a problem? Should I go get a real stainless steel pot? Will the plastic on the spoon matter? I'll leave it in the boiling wort for a good 5 minutes to make sure it's sterile, just in case I need to use it for something else (heat can get places that sanitizer can't).

2) I'm going with a 6g glass carboy because I want to be able to see what's happening and take pictures, and I don't want to keep pulling the top off of a bucket. Anything I might need to know when using one of these? Other than to not pour hot liquid into it/drop it, that is...

3) I didn't get a chance to look at the yeast packet very closely... is it going to tell me what temperature range is best, or should I just assume 65*? That's the temp of the basement room I'm going to be fermenting in, so I'm hoping I don't need to figure out any special arrangements.

4) I only have the one carboy at the moment (although you can bet I'll be getting another at some point, if this goes well), so I'm basically stuck doing a long primary (guessing 10-14 days) and no secondary. Should I try to do a cold crash? I have a back porch that I could probably use in combination with a blanket to keep out sunlight and keep the beer from freezing at night (although so far I haven't seen many cold nights here), but then again it's a dark beer, so clarity isn't going to be much of an issue. Can you even do a cold crash in the primary? Or does it need to be in the secondary?

5) It came with specialty grains, which I was hoping for and am looking forward to using, but I just wanted to be absolutely sure of this: 3qt of water per pound for steeping at 150* to 160* for about 30-45 minutes, then sparge with some (how much?) 170* water. Should I use just 2-3 quarts, or should I sparge with enough water to fill the brewpot for the boil (probably about 6qt in that case)?

6) With liquid extract, should I try to warm up the container before pouring it into the pot? Should I wait until the pot is boiling before adding it (with the heat off to prevent scorching), or should I add it as soon as I take out the specialty grains and start heating towards a boil?

Wow, I guess I had more questions that I expected...

With liquid extract, should I try to warm up the container before pouring it into the pot?

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is about all i can answer here. yes it pours a lot easier. and having a rubber spatula if its in bucket for helps.

Illustrated Beer Brewing Primer - German Pilsner Partial Mash

I'd watch out with the plastic spoon; it might not hold up to boiling temperatures. I'd pick up something metal, but maybe that's just me.

As far as everything else... it sounds like you're overthinking steeping. You're not mashing; put all your boil water in the pot (in a 3-gallon pot, probably only 1.5-2 gallons), heat it up to 155ish, stick the grains in, and lid it up for a half hour, maybe in a warm oven. Then turn the heat back on, take the grain bag out, and get on with the boil. Watch for boilover: that's a small pot.

Liquid extract does flow better when it's a little warm, and definitely don't add it over the flame. You can think about late addition (I am all for it), but on your first brew, maybe don't worry about it.

Likewise, don't worry about cold-crashing and so-forth. Add some irish moss to the boil, give it enough time in primary, and you'll be fine. Heck, my mild only spent 10 days in primary, and it's clear enough to read through. I wouldn't give much thought to clarity until you've got the process down.

Take your time; sanitize, sanitize, sanitize; and have fun!

Illustrated Beer Brewing Primer - German Pilsner Partial Mash

yes warming the extract helps a lot for pouring. if its austin homebrew they send it in buckets so i bought a rubber spatula for scraping

Lots of stuff there. Let me start with question 1. I'm assuming you are doing a partial mash. You will need to keep a close eye one it for boil overs. I'm also assuming that you will be steeping with 2 gallons.

As for sterilizing the pot (or soaking in Oxyclean) - as long as it's clean there should be no problem. The boil will sanitize everything. As for cleaning the spoon - just use a no-rinse sanitizer then there should be no problem with it melting. No need to over egg the pudding.
Use common sense and all will go well with you, grasshopper! (just kidding - I've only done 4 batches so far so I'm far from an expert!!!)

sorry bout the double post.... the submit button quit responding

For the steeping grains, use 155F water at 1.5-2.0 qts/lb. and steep for 30 minutes. I use a large muslin bag, like a hop bag and put the grains in. At the end of the 30 minutes use a "tea bag" technique (cue FPS jokes) to "sparge" the grains. If you like you could put the bag in a strainer and pour 155F water over them to extract even more flavor. However, you're not really going for fermentable sugars here, you're just after the malty and grainy flavor that it will add to your finished product.

For the liquid extract, I simply poured it in without warming it. After pouring it I would spoon some of the hot wort back into the container and let it sit for a few minutes. When it is all loosened up, you can pour the remaining extract in the kettle.

uncleozzy said:

You can think about late addition (I am all for it), but on your first brew, maybe don't worry about it.

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Anything special to worry about with late addition? Or do I just wait until the last 15 minutes or so before dumping in the rest of the extract? I assume the only things in the pot up until then would be the steeped grain-water and the bittering hops...

Also, any suggestions for aerating? I don't have a bubble-stone or pump, and I don't think that would be a worthwhile investment for a first timer...

I was thinking that after I cool my wort, but before I pour it into the carboy, I'll take a sanitized whisk to it for a couple minutes.

Hegh said:

Anything special to worry about with late addition? Or do I just wait until the last 15 minutes or so before dumping in the rest of the extract? I assume the only things in the pot up until then would be the steeped grain-water and the bittering hops...

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The thing about late addition is that you'll get increased hops utilization during your boil (due to lower wort gravity). The flip side is that you're doing a very small partial boil, so you probably want a lot of bittering (since you'll be diluting with 3+ gallons of water). I'd put maybe a pound of the LME in at the start of your boil, and then the rest at 15 minutes or so (removing the pot from the flame while you incorporate it), or even at flameout.

uncleozzy said:

The thing about late addition is that you'll get increased hops utilization during your boil (due to lower wort gravity). The flip side is that you're doing a very small partial boil, so you probably want a lot of bittering (since you'll be diluting with 3+ gallons of water). I'd put maybe a pound of the LME in at the start of your boil, and then the rest at 15 minutes or so (removing the pot from the flame while you incorporate it), or even at flameout.

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Will it dissolve properly if I wait until flameout? I may wait until the last five minutes, just to get a bit more rolling boil mixing going.

After you are done steeping the grains, simply remove the bag and throw it away. You don't want to squeeze it, or poor hot water over it (attempting to sparge), just let the bag soak in the 160 degree water for a half hour or so and then throw it out.

You will cause tannins to leach out of the bag if you squeeze it, etc...and that will give your beer a nasty bitter taste.

If you do decide to brew on a pretty regular basis, you will want to get a nice big pot for brewing. 3 gallons is a little unforgiving but will work for now. Don't worry about the plastic spoon, it will be fine. Just clean it real good before the boil and then you want to sanitize it if before each use anytime after the boil.

When it comes time to get a second carboy...I'd recommend you look to get a 6.5 gallon better bottle. IMO, the glass carboys aren't worth the risk. Be extra careful with the glass one!!

You'll be fine just doing one long primary ferment IMO. (you could rack into that better bottle I mentioned earlier if you get one it in time.) Also, I wouldn't worry about a cold crash this time around. Be sure to have a hydrometer handy to take samples before you pitch the yeast (OG), and during the fermentation, your instructions will most likely have a taget final gravity (FG). When you sample gets close to this number, then your fermentation is over and it's time to bottle. This could take 10 days, 14 day, 20 days. My point being that you don't want to rely upon a count of days, or until the airlock stops bubbling to determine when to bottle. Let the hyrdrometer be you guide. OG - FG x 100 = % alochol...this way you'll know how strong your beer is. The more extract, the more sugar, the stronger the beer.

Are you using dry or liquid yeast? If you are using a liquid yeast viale, the do a search on here for how to make a starter. This is a must do step to insure you pitch a good amount of healthy yeast. If you are using a dry yeast pack, they just follow it's instructions. Some do require rehydration, others don't.

Yes, slighlty warm the extract before adding it. It will pour much easier, a spatcula is a good idea to get the rest of it out. I'd also not worry too much about adding some of it later then the rest. Just remove the steeping grains, bring to a boil, remove from heat, pour in the extract, stir to dissolve and the start the boil. I'd error on the side of not trying to get too cute with your first beer, there will be plenty going on to keep track of. Cold crashing, late additions of extract, etc... are all fine for specific purposes but won't dramatically impact the overall flavor.

Best of luck, sorry if this seems like a long rant and happy brewing.

Hegh said:

Also, any suggestions for aerating? I don't have a bubble-stone or pump, and I don't think that would be a worthwhile investment for a first timer...

I was thinking that after I cool my wort, but before I pour it into the carboy, I'll take a sanitized whisk to it for a couple minutes.

Click to expand...

Go to the paint section of your hardware store and buy a 5G paint mixer. Hook it up to your drill and bam, you've of a super wisk to aerate your wort before pitching. cost $5

Note...you will want to take you sample for your OG before this step our you may have a lot of bubbles in the sample that will give you a fake reading...

Padstack31 said:

After you are done steeping the grains, simply remove the bag and throw it away. You don't want to squeeze it, or poor hot water over it (attempting to sparge), just let the bag soak in the 160 degree water for a half hour or so and then throw it out.

Click to expand...

Interesting... From everything I've read and seen, pouring hot water over it is fine and expected, but squeezing is bad. I guess I'll just have to try both ways at some point and see which I prefer.

Padstack31 said:

Go to the paint section of your hardware store and buy a 5G paint mixer. Hook it up to your drill and bam, you've of a super wisk to aerate your wort before pitching. cost $5

Note...you will want to take you sample for your OG before this step our you may have a lot of bubbles in the sample that will give you a fake reading...

Click to expand...

I like that idea... Very Alton Brown-esque, if you watch Good Eats on the Food Network. Although I think I may need to buy another whisk, mine has a big rubber handle attached.

Hegh said:

Will it dissolve properly if I wait until flameout? I may wait until the last five minutes, just to get a bit more rolling boil mixing going.

Click to expand...

Either way should be fine. LME dissolves very easily in hot water. Some people like to boil for a few minutes (to boil away any possible nasties), but others don't think it's necessary.

Hegh said:

Interesting... From everything I've read and seen, pouring hot water over it is fine and expected, but squeezing is bad. I guess I'll just have to try both ways at some point and see which I prefer.

Click to expand...

Where did you read this? I've never even heard of people sparging their steeping grains during a partial mash, I never did back in my extract days. You aren't really looking for sugar from these grains just flavor and color. The whole purpose of a sparge is to rinse of the remaining sugars off the grains and you'll be getting all those sugars from the extract. If you want more sugar, I'd just add more extract. But hey, I'm all for experimentation, that's a lot of the fun of this hobby but I'm just not seeing the purpose here.

Padstack31 said:

Where did you read this? I've never even heard of people sparging their steeping grains during a partial mash, I never did back in my extract days. You aren't really looking for sugar from these grains just flavor and color. The whole purpose of a sparge is to rinse of the remaining sugars off the grains and you'll be getting all those sugars from the extract. If you want more sugar, I'd just add more extract. But hey, I'm all for experimentation, that's a lot of the fun of this hobby but I'm just not seeing the purpose here.

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There are some video tutorials on YouTube. This one specifically mentions it:


It's part of a series; I put together a [ame="http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=A566812AAE26F058"]public playlist[/ame] for it a while back so it's easier to watch from beginning to end.

Interesting...I've never seen that before...I'd still skip that step but to each their own...

Hegh said:

1) I only have an old 3-ish gallon stock pot very much like this one and a plastic stirring spoon. I'm planning to give the pot a good soaking with oxyclean first, but is the choice of materials going to be a problem? Should I go get a real stainless steel pot? Will the plastic on the spoon matter? I'll leave it in the boiling wort for a good 5 minutes to make sure it's sterile, just in case I need to use it for something else (heat can get places that sanitizer can't).

2) I'm going with a 6g glass carboy because I want to be able to see what's happening and take pictures, and I don't want to keep pulling the top off of a bucket. Anything I might need to know when using one of these? Other than to not pour hot liquid into it/drop it, that is...

3) I didn't get a chance to look at the yeast packet very closely... is it going to tell me what temperature range is best, or should I just assume 65*? That's the temp of the basement room I'm going to be fermenting in, so I'm hoping I don't need to figure out any special arrangements.

4) I only have the one carboy at the moment (although you can bet I'll be getting another at some point, if this goes well), so I'm basically stuck doing a long primary (guessing 10-14 days) and no secondary. Should I try to do a cold crash? I have a back porch that I could probably use in combination with a blanket to keep out sunlight and keep the beer from freezing at night (although so far I haven't seen many cold nights here), but then again it's a dark beer, so clarity isn't going to be much of an issue. Can you even do a cold crash in the primary? Or does it need to be in the secondary?

5) It came with specialty grains, which I was hoping for and am looking forward to using, but I just wanted to be absolutely sure of this: 3qt of water per pound for steeping at 150* to 160* for about 30-45 minutes, then sparge with some (how much?) 170* water. Should I use just 2-3 quarts, or should I sparge with enough water to fill the brewpot for the boil (probably about 6qt in that case)?

6) With liquid extract, should I try to warm up the container before pouring it into the pot? Should I wait until the pot is boiling before adding it (with the heat off to prevent scorching), or should I add it as soon as I take out the specialty grains and start heating towards a boil?

Click to expand...

Here are my 2 cents:

1) Plastic spoon is fine, but I never sanitize. Use it to stir once in awhile during the boil, but never use it for anything else. If the wort is boiling, no need to worry. However I mix the cooled wort and yeast by dumping btw two plastic buckets, one of which I use as the primary. This also serves to aerate the wort. You only have to sanitize the spoon if you plan on touching the spoon to the wort after the boil.

2)Glass carboys can be dangerous, so just be careful when transporting. There are some horror stories in the forum. Most people prefer plastic of Better Bottles.

3)Depends on the kind of yeast. If you search on the internet you should be able to find the temp range. When I have used liquid yeasts, I have bought White Labs and they list all the temp ranges on the bottle and on the web site. 65 sounds good for an ale yeast. Most brew supply shops online like Midwest will also list the optimum ferm temps.

4)Not sure about the cold crash, but most folks on this forum recommend a primary of 3-4 weeks and forget the secondary altogether. I usually have done a secondary but have started skipping this step.

5)I just dump the bag into my 3 gallons of water and steep for 20-30 minutes around 160 F. I then rinse the grains with a couple cups of water at about 170 F. You don't have to rinse though, since you aren't mashing. However you don't want to rinse with too much water, as you may get some tannins. You can skip the rinse if you want. +1 on the "don't squeeze" advice.

6) I usually use DME, but warming up LME does help when attempting to pour. After pouring most of the LME out of the container, I usually fill it up with warm water and shake to get the last bit out. I bring the water to a boil before adding... but make sure you take the pot off the heat before adding the LME, otherwise you could get a boil over which is a mess.

One other question -- Everything says that ale should ferment around in the 60-70* range, and lager in the 40-55* range (I haven't seen the numbers recently, so I may be a bit off). But is that the temperature that the beer should be as it ferments, or is that the temperature of the surrounding environment?

My cellar is about 65*, but the yeasts are going to warm themselves up to around 75* I expect. Should I try to cool them down to 65*, or is the ambient temperature around them what is called for?

Thanks, everybody is being very helpful so far!

They won't warm the beer 10 degrees, it's true that the yeast will give of a little heat but as long as the room is in the mid-60's you'll be money...I have 10 gallons of an Pale Ale sitting at 68 degrees as we speak and the yeast are doing there thing.

So I was just reading Jamil's flavor profile section in the last issue of BYO. In the instructions for how to make a partial mash Imperial IPA he mentions that "you should pour warm water over your steeping grains after they're done sitting in 170 degree water from 30 minutes." So it looks like I stand corrected. Until this week, I honestly never even heard of doing this. but guess you learn somthing new everyday.

Best of luck on Sunday.

Well, I ended up brewing yesterday (Saturday) instead, and it went pretty well. I'll post a writeup with some pictures and movies later.

I did pour 2qt of 170* water over the grain bag when I pulled it out, hopefully it won't introduce any extra tannins or anything.

Also, the yeasts are going strong; I checked on it 3 hours after pitching, and there was already some steady airlock activity; nine hours later and a nice krausen had built up and I could see stuff inside churning around. Same thing this morning (19 hours), so I'm pretty hopeful that it'll turn out well.

Hoping to bottle and have it conditioned for any New Years parties I may be invited to, but if the yeasties do their thing quickly, I may even have it for Xmas.