When does a pale ale become an IPA?

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Eltenchiz

Eltenchiz

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Hi all,
I know this seems like a dumb question but i just made a pale ale (8lbs 2-row, 2lbs Vienna, .5lbs crystal 15L, 1oz Summit 60min, .5oz Cascade 30min, .25 Cascade 15min, .25oz Cascade 5min) all together with 75% efficincey this beer should be 5.8%ABV and have an IBU of 63. So would this still be a Pale Ale or would this be considered an IPA? When does a Pale Ale become an IPA? is it a certain number of IBU's?
Thanks
Mike
 
Style Guidelines for an APA

Vital Statistics: OG: 1.045 – 1.060
IBUs: 30 – 45 FG: 1.010 – 1.015
SRM: 5 – 14 ABV: 4.5 – 6.2%

Commercial Examples: Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, Stone Pale Ale, Great Lakes Burning River Pale Ale, Bear Republic XP Pale Ale, Anderson Valley Poleeko Gold Pale Ale, Deschutes Mirror Pond, Full Sail Pale Ale, Three Floyds X-Tra Pale Ale, Firestone Pale Ale, Left Hand Brewing Jackman’s Pale Ale
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Style Guidelines for an IPA

Vital Statistics: OG: 1.056 – 1.075
IBUs: 40 – 70 FG: 1.010 – 1.018
SRM: 6 – 15 ABV: 5.5 – 7.5%

Commercial Examples: Bell’s Two-Hearted Ale, AleSmith IPA, Russian River Blind Pig IPA, Stone IPA, Three Floyds Alpha King, Great Divide Titan IPA, Bear Republic Racer 5 IPA, Victory Hop Devil, Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale, Anderson Valley Hop Ottin’, Dogfish Head 60 Minute IPA, Founder’s Centennial IPA, Anchor Liberty Ale, Harpoon IPA, Avery IPA
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SO it is an IPA
 
IMO it really depends on the balance between malt and hops, along with the intensity of the hop flavor/aroma. Your pale ale may have enough IBUs to be considered an IPA, but your late additions don't do it enough justice to be called a full fledged IPA in my experience. While hops will be present, they won't dominate the flavor profile in those amounts. For instance, Grand Teton's Sweetgrass APA falls into the IPA category by stats (6.0% ABV, 60 IBUs), yet they call it an APA. I tend to agree with them based on what it actually tastes like rather than just going by numbers.
 
Ok. So I guess it can vary based on the dascression of the brewer. A mild IPA or a bitter pale ale. Regardless, I'm sure it will be good. I hope. I also added some ginger just to mix it up.
 
By taste; An APA is an easy drinker, goes down smooth (could be a high-end session beer) while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and not something you would want to down several of in short order. I have an APA/IPA recipe I use and the only difference in the two recipes is more 2-row and more hops in the IPA version, both are awesome.
 
Basically I was going for just that. I wanted to make a good session beer for under $20 with everything included. With all that I listed and a packet of dry yeast it was $19 something after tax. So if it's good I'll probably use it as my poor man recipe. I was gonna go back to the brew store today to make another one except replace the 2-row with American pale malt and get .5lbs of carapils. What do u think?
 
"while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and not something you would want to down several of in short order."

FAIL!!!!


"while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and IS something you would want to down several of in short order."

SUCESS!!!!!

:mug:
 
flatfour64 said:
"while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and not something you would want to down several of in short order."

FAIL!!!!


"while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and IS something you would want to down several of in short order."

SUCESS!!!!!

:mug:
Click to expand...

I was just going to make the similar comment...of course you want to down several in short order! That way you get more of the deliciousness faster! :mug:
 
Eltenchiz said:
Basically I was going for just that. I wanted to make a good session beer for under $20 with everything included. With all that I listed and a packet of dry yeast it was $19 something after tax. So if it's good I'll probably use it as my poor man recipe. I was gonna go back to the brew store today to make another one except replace the 2-row with American pale malt and get .5lbs of carapils. What do u think?
Click to expand...

Under $20 including hops and dry yeast is a great price. Beer with a lot of hops is rarely a cheap brew candidate.

With 8 oz of Crystal Malts you really don't need carapils unless you want a puffy head to the last drop. With 8oz of crystal you should have a light clinging head till you finish the glass.
 
IMO the OP's beer is a Pale ale. the "I" in IPA designates imperial which means more ABV% than the standard version of a beer style. Hops and IBU's have nothing to do with it.

Good IPA's normally follow a 1:1 on OG points and IBUs to maintain a balance. This is not a carved in stone rule but seems to be a standard.

When looking at the beers that NORMALLY win in BJCP comps they tend to push the styles OG, ABV% and IBUs to the high side. This helps the brew to stand out. So since the OP's brew is on the low end for an IPA I would call it a Pale Ale.

A commercial example is Point Breweries Cascade Pale Ale this is a standard 5.4% ABV and has MASSIVE aroma. It is the hoppiest aroma pale ale I have ever had and has inspired me to brew up a PTE influenced Pale Ale. I have very high hopes that my pale ale is going to be my hoppy summer brew of choice.
 
Zamial said:
IMO the OP's beer is a Pale ale. the "I" in IPA designates imperial which means more ABV% than the standard version of a beer style. Hops and IBU's have nothing to do with it.

Good IPA's normally follow a 1:1 on OG points and IBUs to maintain a balance. This is not a carved in stone rule but seems to be a standard.

When looking at the beers that NORMALLY win in BJCP comps they tend to push the styles OG, ABV% and IBUs to the high side. This helps the brew to stand out. So since the OP's brew is on the low end for an IPA I would call it a Pale Ale.

A commercial example is Point Breweries Cascade Pale Ale this is a standard 5.4% ABV and has MASSIVE aroma. It is the hoppiest aroma pale ale I have ever had and has inspired me to brew up a PTE influenced Pale Ale. I have very high hopes that my pale ale is going to be my hoppy summer brew of choice.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that the I in IPA stands for India, as in the traditional India Pale Ale. Twas a pale ale that was hopped heavily so it would last the boat ride to India and still taste good. I guess I could be wrong, but it has never happened before...
 
flatfour64 said:
I'm pretty sure that the I in IPA stands for India, as in the traditional India Pale Ale. Twas a pale ale that was hopped heavily so it would last the boat ride to India and still taste good. I guess I could be wrong, but it has never happened before...
Click to expand...

/facepalm... I was thing IIPA. You are 100% right.
 
Zamial said:
IMO the OP's beer is a Pale ale. the "I" in IPA designates imperial which means more ABV% than the standard version of a beer style. Hops and IBU's have nothing to do with it.

Good IPA's normally follow a 1:1 on OG points and IBUs to maintain a balance. This is not a carved in stone rule but seems to be a standard.

When looking at the beers that NORMALLY win in BJCP comps they tend to push the styles OG, ABV% and IBUs to the high side. This helps the brew to stand out. So since the OP's brew is on the low end for an IPA I would call it a Pale Ale.

A commercial example is Point Breweries Cascade Pale Ale this is a standard 5.4% ABV and has MASSIVE aroma. It is the hoppiest aroma pale ale I have ever had and has inspired me to brew up a PTE influenced Pale Ale. I have very high hopes that my pale ale is going to be my hoppy summer brew of choice.
Click to expand...

Yeah, think you are referring to an IIPA. ;)
 
IPA's are not supposed to be huge beers. Zamial is thinking of Imperial India Pale Ales. :)

The commercial examples that pass as IPA are only 6-7% ABV.
 
Zamial said:
/facepalm... I was thing IIPA. You are 100% right.
Click to expand...


We can all grow and learn from our mistakes in life, except for me, because again, non have been made.

:tank:


Edit: non = NONE! BLAST!!!! So this is what it feels like to be human!!!!
 
Jayhem said:
Under $20 including hops and dry yeast is a great price. Beer with a lot of hops is rarely a cheap brew candidate.

With 8 oz of Crystal Malts you really don't need carapils unless you want a puffy head to the last drop. With 8oz of crystal you should have a light clinging head till you finish the glass.
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Thanks Jayhem. I didn't see this in time. I ended up getting the carapils. I also reduced the price a bit because my brew shop had Pacific Jade hops on sale. I guess it's a New Zealand variety used in like NZ style IPA's. Altogether it was $18.20
 
Eltenchiz said:
Altogether it was $18.20
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Wow that is reasonable! Wish I had a place like this...around here simple 2 row is like $2.25 and dry yeast is 3-4 bucks, just guessing but a simple recipe like this would be $25-30, not really sure as I can't afford to go there that often, but rather bulk buy.
 
I'm doing a "Pale" next also. Want something around 5% that kinda tastes like an IPA without the bitterness and IBU. There seems to be a very forgiving curve, if it's in a competition it's probably going to be relative to the other entries. The other year somewhere I saw Racer 5 win gold for extra pale, thought that was a cop out.
 
Yeah, prices at the brew shops in southern California are pretty good. Probably because of dense population and all the great brewery's around inspire people.
 
sivdrinks said:
I'm doing a "Pale" next also. Want something around 5% that kinda tastes like an IPA without the bitterness and IBU. There seems to be a very forgiving curve, if it's in a competition it's probably going to be relative to the other entries. The other year somewhere I saw Racer 5 win gold for extra pale, thought that was a cop out.
Click to expand...

I'm not exactly sure what u mean? You don't want the IBU's but the ABV? Or you want your pale to be maltier? Just add some extra 2-row or pale malt for the ABV. If you want it maltier get a higher crystal L. Like 60L
 
flatfour64 said:
"while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and not something you would want to down several of in short order."

FAIL!!!!


"while an IPA is noticeably more bitter/hoppy and higher alcohol content and IS something you would want to down several of in short order."

SUCESS!!!!!

:mug:
Click to expand...

You successfully misspelled the word "success" :D

Sorry, had to do it!
 
Eltenchiz said:
I'm not exactly sure what u mean? You don't want the IBU's but the ABV? Or you want your pale to be maltier? Just add some extra 2-row or pale malt for the ABV. If you want it maltier get a higher crystal L. Like 60L
Click to expand...

Guess I mean a session IPA. Lower ABV and lower IBU's. Just because you have low IBU's doesn't mean it's not full of hop flavor and aroma, just not very bitter. Something like bittering hops at 60 and then more at 10 on in plus dry hop.
 
ManyBrews said:
i always thought dale's pale ale from oskar blues really pushed the pale ale enevelope.... at 6.5% and 65 ibus.
Click to expand...

This, the line is blurred so often.It's only went being technical and entering them into competition probably that matters.Even worse is trying a commercial ipa which doesnt even taste like a pale ale.:confused:
Higer ibu's doenst always mean more of a bittered beer though, ive had pale ales taste more bitter than ipa'a.In fact i didnt like them when i was first trying them because i thought pale ales were more bitter than ipa's.Really it depends which and whose pale ales/ipa's your trying i found that out later after having quite a differnt range of the style.
Im shure they will become more updated to style over time also with things like belgian ipa's,black ipa's,brown ipa's etc..
 
IMO, one of the key differences is the Dry Hop. I think an IPA should be dry hopped(obviously) and a APA shouldn't be. Thats the biggest difference to me. But that's just my opinion and you know what they say about those. Though I think the style guidelines say otherwise about APA's.
 
I think thats why there are alot of labeled "dry hopped" pale ales commercially.Its like what i think an extra pale ale would be,but im not shure the decription of" extra" and what that even means.
 
The dryhop has nothing to do with it. Both styles can (or cannot) be dryhopped with good results and stay true to style.

Things like bitterness and body and/or alcohol content is key...

From most to least:

Imperial IPA
Regular IPA
APA
 
bobbrews said:
The dryhop has nothing to do with it. Both styles can (or cannot) be dryhopped with good results and stay true to style.

Things like bitterness and body and/or alcohol content is key...

From most to least:

Imperial IPA
Regular IPA
APA
Click to expand...

I couldn't disagree more, Dry Hopping has plenty to do with it. I think dryhopping defines the style of IPA. It's what sets it apart from an APA. Again that's my opinion, I realize the style guidelines state otherwise, but theres a lot of grey area there.
 
Stouts are sometimes dryhopped. So are barleywines and red ales. Adding more hop aroma to a beer doesn't automatically make it an IPA.

Again, the dryhop has nothing to do with it.
 
Just did a Pale Ale today. Probably finish right at 5% with 40 IBU's, I'm dry hopping it. Still a Pale to me.
 

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