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Old 12-28-2009, 04:03 AM   #11
Vinic
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Thanx Rocketman,

I've only one brew thru the original one, but expect to do many more with this version.

Nice job!

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Old 12-28-2009, 04:19 AM   #12
mordantly
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can recipes from promash or beersmith be put in some format to use with this software?


i didn't see it but now i do. beerxml. awesome. i see it's coded in c++. nice.

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Old 12-28-2009, 01:19 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martinworswick View Post
whenever i try and start the mash wizard it causes it to crash, i've tried it 3 times with 3 crashes, i'm using a mac if it makes any difference.

cheers
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Strange. Can you walk me through the exact steps to reproduce this problem?
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Old 12-28-2009, 04:20 PM   #14
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I'll download and play with it tonight. Thanks!

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Old 12-28-2009, 06:02 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by rocketman768 View Post
Strange. Can you walk me through the exact steps to reproduce this problem?
i created a new equipment list then proceded onto creating a recipe i'm making today,entered fermentables,hops and yeast.
next went to the mash option, created a new single step infusion at 68c entered the info into the relevant boxes, hit mash wiz,it froze for a few seconds and crashed.

i'm not sure if this helps but if i can offer anything more specific then just ask
cheers
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Old 12-28-2009, 06:24 PM   #16
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Thanks for your efforts. I downloaded it last night and played with it a bit today, reproducing the brew I did yesterday.
It has some nice features, but I had a few problems.
I started by redefining the ideal equipment to match mine using the equipment editor. No problem until I hit ENTER after entering the lauter deadspace. Lo and behold, the ideal equipment had been deleted! Exit without saving, and started again. This time, I hit the save button instead of hitting enter. I like the boil-off rate in gallons per hour instead of %
Then I entered my fermentables:
10 lbs UK 2 row, 8 0z crystal 55 (I used 60) and 4 oz Special roast. For a 5.25g batch it predicted an OG of 1.059. Promash predicted 1.062 for the same brew. This was easily explained. The UK 2 row in the database had a yield of 78%, whereas 82%+ would be more typical. (Promash used 82.23%). I changed the yield to 82.25% and got 1.062.
Then, I adjusted the AA% for the hops I used, and entered the hops. Your predicted IBU's came out at 44.4 as opposed to Promash's 45.9 (both using Tinseth). No problem there.
Incidentally, I love the way you add the ingredients, where you can select all the grains (or hops) and add 0 weight of each item, and then quickly go through and enter the weights. This is so much easier than either Promash or Beersmith.
Rather than creating a record for WLP002 (that I used) I substituted the Wyeast 1968. As far as I can tell, these are the same yeast, so again, no problem.
I was a little puzzled that you predicted a FG at this point (without knowing any details of the mash), but that is a minor detail. Promash doesn't even try to predict a FG.
Lastly, I tried to enter the mash details, and this is where I had some problems.
I fly sparge rather than batch sparge, and instead of using your mash wizard, I tried to enter what I did yesterday to keep things as close as possible to my actual practice especially as I achieved exactly the results that Promash forecast.
First, I infused 3 gal of 168 F water to hit 152 F for 60 minutes
My predicted OG dropped from 1.062 to 0.730, and my preboil gravity increased from 1.046 to 1.202. This is clearly impossible, and I suspect you have an undetected overflow condition somewhere in the calculations.
After thinking about this for a while, I generated a Brewday report, which showed that the mash tab covers the sparge as well as the mash. Perhaps you could change the "Mash" to "Mash/Sparge" as that tab covers both operations.
I continued by adding 6 qts 205 F water for a mash out, followed by 5 gal of 168 F water for the sparge. This is effectively what I did yesterday, and combined with 0.6 gal lauter dead space, and 0.5 g loss to chiller, kettle dead space, and trub should have delivered 7.0 gallons to the kettle, boiled down over 75 minutes to 5.75 gal, and 5.25 gal into the fermenter.
Having put these figures into Brewtarget, it reported that my OG would be 1.048 at 80% efficiency, rather than 1.062 which Promash forecast, and I achieved.

At this point, I tried to save the mash details, and the program quit, destroying all my data.

One thing I did do was to examine your code, and found that the 0.6 gal dead space in my MLT was treated as a loss of 0.6 gal with a gravity of 1.062. In actual fact, the wort remaining in the MLT at the end of the sparge had a gravity of 1.010. This would account for 6 points, but I have no idea where the other 8 points went.

-a.

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Old 12-28-2009, 09:59 PM   #17
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No problem until I hit ENTER after entering the lauter deadspace. Lo and behold, the ideal equipment had been deleted!
Ah, I see that the delete button had been mistakenly marked as the default button for this dialog, which means that if you press enter, that button gets pressed. Fixed. Thanks for telling me that!

Quote:
Incidentally, I love the way you add the ingredients, where you can select all the grains (or hops) and add 0 weight of each item, and then quickly go through and enter the weights. This is so much easier than either Promash or Beersmith.
Thanks man.

Quote:
I was a little puzzled that you predicted a FG at this point (without knowing any details of the mash), but that is a minor detail. Promash doesn't even try to predict a FG.
Yeah, predicting FG from mash temps combined with a particular yeast is a crap shoot. I just use the apparent attenuation given by the yeast to estimate.

Quote:
First, I infused 3 gal of 168 F water to hit 152 F for 60 minutes
My predicted OG dropped from 1.062 to 0.730, and my preboil gravity increased from 1.046 to 1.202. This is clearly impossible, and I suspect you have an undetected overflow condition somewhere in the calculations.
Actually, this is supposed to happen. Before you enter the mash details, you'll notice that the "Calculated batch size" reads just what you want it to. Brewtarget is lying to you here since how can that be the batch size if you're adding no water? But, I like just starting up a new recipe and adding my ingredients to get running, so I make bt pretend that the batch size is right. After you added the 3 gal infusion, it assumed that was all the water you were adding, and you should notice that your batch size is like 1 qt or something tiny, which means an extremely high OG of 10.730 (which displayed as 0.730). Bottom line: only trust the OG when your calculated batch size is near your target batch size.

Quote:
Having put these figures into Brewtarget, it reported that my OG would be 1.048 at 80% efficiency, rather than 1.062 which Promash forecast, and I achieved.
I'm almost sure this has to do with a calculated batch size (takes into account mash additions, grain absorption, losses, etc.) that is just too far above the target batch size.

Quote:
At this point, I tried to save the mash details, and the program quit, destroying all my data.
Really? What platform? I can't get it to crash when saving a mash.

Quote:
One thing I did do was to examine your code, and found that the 0.6 gal dead space in my MLT was treated as a loss of 0.6 gal with a gravity of 1.062.
Sort of. Right now, I am basically assuming a batch sparge since I always do batch sparges. I'm not very familiar with the details of fly sparging. Of course, a quick fix is just to reduce your lauter deadspace, though I know that's not ideal. I'll work on including fly sparging since I know it's common.
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Old 12-28-2009, 11:06 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketman768 View Post
After you added the 3 gal infusion, it assumed that was all the water you were adding, and you should notice that your batch size is like 1 qt or something tiny, which means an extremely high OG of 10.730 (which displayed as 0.730). Bottom line: only trust the OG when your calculated batch size is near your target batch size.
I realized that as soon as I looked at the Brewday mode report.
I checked again, and with the 3 gal addition, I would have ended up with -ve volume post boil. I guess -ve volumes can be expressed any way you want to.

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I'm almost sure this has to do with a calculated batch size (takes into account mash additions, grain absorption, losses, etc.) that is just too far above the target batch size.
I don't think so. The figures I entered were:
Pre-boil volume 7 gal
Batch size 5.25 gal
Boil Time 1.25 hr
Boil Off rate 4 qts per hour
Kettle to Fermenter loss 0.5 gal
Lauter Losses 0.6 gal

With the 3 gal, 6 qt, and 4.5 gal additions (I made a mistake in the previous post, the sparge should have been 4.5 gal not 5), my pre-boil volume came out at 7.002 gal, which leaves 5.252 gal in the fermenter. I hope that you don't have to get within 0.002 gal (1.5 tsp) when estimating the batch sizes.

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Really? What platform? I can't get it to crash when saving a mash.
Windows (XP Pro - S.P. 3) I can't get it to crash now either, but it did when I tried it the first time. I also cannot get it to save the Mash.


-a.
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Old 12-29-2009, 12:05 AM   #19
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OK, I'm on the Jaunty install of Mint (Mint 7). I start the program from the terminal, like you do, and then go to the 'New Recipe' button. The window pops up and asks me for a name. When I enter the name and click 'OK', the program closes on me.

When starting the program, I get the following messages in the terminal:

Code:
WARNING: Could not open /home/colin/.config/brewtarget/options.xml for reading.
ERROR: Could not open /home/colin/.config/brewtarget/database.xml for reading.
ERROR: Could not open /home/colin/.config/brewtarget/database.xml for reading.
ERROR: Could not open /home/colin/.config/brewtarget/database.xml for reading.
brewtarget(25208) Phonon::KdePlatformPlugin::createBackend: using backend:  "Xine"
When it errors out, I get:
Code:
ERROR: Could not open /home/colin/.config/brewtarget/database.xml for reading.
Hope this helps! The layout is really nice, I'd like to be able to use this!

I also can't seem to get the example to load. I go to About -> Manual and the window that pops up (HTML Viewer) is blank.
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Old 12-29-2009, 02:56 AM   #20
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Hmm, I'm running 1.1 on Mac right now but 1.2 won't run. I get the same error i used to get before QT was installed right "brewtarget quit unexpectedly" but obviously it is still installed or 1.1 wouldn't work. do i need to do anything because 1.1 was installed?

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