Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider) - Page 9

**Brandon O** · 06-14-2009, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobjohnson77

Possible infection...I moved the graff to a secondary and was very careful about sanitation. I used the gelatin reccomendation to clear it. This morning I have some white dots on top. Is this a possible infection or maybe I just woke up the yeast. I will try to get some picts on here soon for better identification. But so far it looks like the begging of fermentation sotra...the white little dots that appear.

chances are you just woke up the yeast. i have had little quarter sized bubble colonies forming after racking. I would taste it to find out though.

If it is infected, you could always add some wyeast roselare blend to get some brettanomyces on it and let it sit for 8-12 months to let it properly sour.

I have a belgian blonde wich started to spontaneously ferment, so I added a roselare smack pack to it. In a year, after the pelicle has dropped, i'm sure it will be good.

**Shooter** · 06-14-2009, 07:12 PM

I bottled my Graff yesterday. The sample tasted good, but a little more bitter than expected. I didn't have 1/2 an oz of 6% AA hops. So, I used a full ounce of 4% AA hops. It should mellow out fine in a few weeks. Otherwise no issue. I'll report back once it carbs up!

fidjit · 06-14-2009, 11:41 PM

Just finished our first batch of Graff! We left out the flaked wheat this time cause I could not get down the HBS to get some 2-row. Followed the original directions otherwise. Used 1/2oz of New Zealand Hallertau at 7.1 alpha. We added the AJ and wort to a 6.5 gallon glass carboy, shook it, then took a hydrometer reading. Got 1.054 OG. Fermentation will be closer to 72-74 deg due to my lack of a fermentation cooler. The sample tasted pretty good, like a malty AJ. Can't wait to give the finished product a taste! Thanks for the recipe.

Does this produce much trub after fermentation?

**Brandon O** · 06-15-2009, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shooter

I bottled my Graff yesterday. The sample tasted good, but a little more bitter than expected. I didn't have 1/2 an oz of 6% AA hops. So, I used a full ounce of 4% AA hops. It should mellow out fine in a few weeks. Otherwise no issue. I'll report back once it carbs up!

Ya, it's definately better to use less hops than more.

The only reason the hops are in there is for preservation purposes and to interact with the tart.

Less is better than more.

I had a batch where I used .5 oz of summit 18.5 AA and it just didn't taste right.

Less is better than more.

**Shooter** · 06-15-2009, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brandon O

Less is better than more.

I see you've doubly emphasized this point!

(BTW, I meant to say doubly here, not Dolby!)

It's not insanely hoppy, but might be a little too much. I think given a little time in the bottle, it should be fine.

yeastluvr · 06-16-2009, 02:59 AM

Ok...here goes....I'm opening my first bottle of Graff, "no joke, right now". Its been in the bottle about 3 1/2 weeks. Smells pretty good...and here goes the first taste...
And its good! Heres the difference I taste between this and my regular cider with apple juice and sugar.

For me Graff has a fuller taste....I get a lot more aftertaste with Graff.....not that this is a bad thing. I actually taste more apple in it especially this young compared to my regular cider.

OK I'm about 1/2 way through the glass and there is no doubt it has a fuller flavor. I'm getting a hint of bitterness.....I really notice the flavor hangs on in my mouth....not as clean and short as the simple cider. Brandon your correct that this cider is very drinkable after a short aging...it tastes very good for the short amount of time its been in the bottle. I'm very curious how this will taste in another month or two.

I like it....and its a good thing because I have another batch ready to bottle next week!

**Brandon O** · 06-16-2009, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeastluvr

Ok...here goes....I'm opening my first bottle of Graff, "no joke, right now". Its been in the bottle about 3 1/2 weeks. Smells pretty good...and here goes the first taste...
And its good! Heres the difference I taste between this and my regular cider with apple juice and sugar.

For me Graff has a fuller taste....I get a lot more aftertaste with Graff.....not that this is a bad thing. I actually taste more apple in it especially this young compared to my regular cider.

OK I'm about 1/2 way through the glass and there is no doubt it has a fuller flavor. I'm getting a hint of bitterness.....I really notice the flavor hangs on in my mouth....not as clean and short as the simple cider. Brandon your correct that this cider is very drinkable after a short aging...it tastes very good for the short amount of time its been in the bottle. I'm very curious how this will taste in another month or two.

I like it....and its a good thing because I have another batch ready to bottle next week!

SCORE!!!! Dude, so glad you like it man. I tell you what, I feel like all the experimenting I have done paid off. For me, it's everything I want a cider to be. A bit of body, big apple taste, not dry but not sweet, and VERY drinkable. I cannot drink regular cider all night with out getting heartburn, but I can drink Graff all night.

What do you think about the hops in the flavor profile? I was trying to balance or layer the tart of the cider. To me, tart can take away from drinkability if there is a lot of tart.

yeastluvr · 06-17-2009, 03:40 AM

Well, there's no doubt about it....it's definitely less tart then regular cider I've made, especially this young. If I were to drink a 3-4 week old sugar and juice cider, it would be pretty tart, maybe a little acidic at this point. I dont get that tartness with the graff. Now I dont know if thats from the hops or malt "my palate is not that refined!!" I agree I would not add to much in the hop department, and as I said before I added hopped DME instead of hops and I dont know how much hops are actually in a lb of hopped DME. I mostly noticed the hanging flavor in my mouth. I agree this is easier to drink this young, no doubt about it. I'm giving it another 1-2 weeks "not that it needs it" and going to start really pile driving it. My next batch is ready to bottle in the next couple days. I might add......this stuff can be potent as it is too easy to drink!

MrBeetle · 06-22-2009, 05:11 AM

Mine is still bubbling away, at about 2 weeks or so now...

How much should I prime it with - carb to about 2.5 like a normal ale, or should it be lighter than that?

aeroscarr13 · 06-23-2009, 12:53 AM

I just brewed up my first batch on Saturday. I followed the recipe almost to a T using extra light DME, a little less than 1/2 oz. of Cascade pellet hops and Safale-05 yeast. Oh, and no Torrified Wheat. The initial specific gravity reading came out at 1.067 and a sample tasted awesome. I have high hopes for this one.

It's busy churning away in a glass carboy in the basement. It's got a nice 2-inch thick krausen on it but it hasn't quite needed the blowoff tube. No nasty smells either, which is more than I can say for Apfelwein!

I'll let you know how it turns out.