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Old 10-29-2010, 02:03 PM   #111
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Hello, I'm the originator of this post and converted it to LME. This is not directed at you Grasslands, but is a response to some of your comments and what you have read so far from others. Don't listen to the whole adding sugar after the malt fermented!

Adding the sugar, candi sugar, beet sugar or whatever you want to call it NEEDS to be added at the beginning phase (at boil) as instructed. This is what the recipe calls for and has a purpose behind it. To others arguments of a dry(er) beer, you can still get down to 1.006 to 1.010 easily, it's all on your mash schedule. And it's possible to get an extract to 1.012, I have done it personally. I have NEVER EVER had issues getting the FG down when adding sugar during the boil. ESPECIALLY with a high attenuation of WLP500!

Now, the reason you add the sugar at the last minute boil phase vs. adding after fermentation is... One, keeps it sanitary. Two and importantly, it allows the sugar to be fermented first!!! key word, fermented first! When adding sugar later, you run into the possibility that you will only ferment 70% or less of the sugar, Opposed to having slightly more malt (for which this style was designed to have a small amount of malt left). Thus affecting the flavor and truly straying away from the style.

Guys, I admire your willingness to experiment and try new things. But don't pass your "Experiments" off like they are the gospel and tried and tested with OUT MERIT!!! Nothing annoys me more when I see someone new say they are going to try this and try their ass hat method with no follow up or anything to back in a diligent and scientific manner. The fact is, the original recipe that I posted is about authentic as you can get. And will get you to the closet style of the original beer, and other TRUE BELGIAN(s), for which I have been in Europe and tasted personally.

With so many new people coming on the scene and what I truly believe is the next revolution/renaissance of our time, we need to direct people down the proper paths. Sorry for ranting, I just want to clear stuff up with people on this post. It's had a lot of hits, and I had a lot of private messages and such.
This isn't a fly by the hip strategy that was mentioned (adding the sugar after fermentation has been underway for a few days). You keep using the word experiment. This is a pretty common method and it certainly isn't an "experiment." I've heard Jamil and Palmer talk about this several times.

Go listen to the Jamil podcast on Tripels and he mentions that if you add the candi or table sugar during the boil, that many times the yeast go on a feeding frenzy because they go after the simple sugar first and you risk them "pooping out" and not being able to eat the rest of the fermentables.

He even makes the comparison of the two sugars being like hot dogs and prime rib. Which would you eat first?

So I understand what you're trying to say but I don't think it's a cut and dry 100% point that it needs to be done the way you are stating.

You mention sanitation concerns with this method which is not an issue at ALL. You boil a couple of cups of water with the sugar and gently pour it through a sanitized funnel. Where is the sanitation concern?

Again, props on this recipe. I've posted many times in this thread. For the record, I brewed this and added the sugar 5 days into fermentation and the beer dried out right where it needed to and I hit my gravity.

Brewing it using this method won me a first place ribbon in the Belgian category. So this method does work if done correctly.
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Old 11-03-2010, 06:46 PM   #112
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I racked my 5g batch to a secondary yesterday (12 days primary) and I came back with an SG of 1.012 (from 1.075) and it tasted awesome!

In the secondary, it looks like it's trying to figure out what final color it wants to be...darker toward the top, lighter on down to the bottom. Interesting process indeed. It's still bubbling here & there, but I'm planning on bottling this sucker up after 12 more days.

Can't wait for it to get ready!

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Old 11-04-2010, 06:11 AM   #113
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I'm drinking this now and wow, it's amazing that this has nearly 10 percent and drinks so well. What a great recipe! Thank you guys so much!

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Old 11-08-2010, 03:54 AM   #114
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Hi everyone,
Can't wait to brew this next Sunday. A few quick questions:

1) Brewtarget is predicting a final gravity of 1.021, will mashing lower make more fermentables, or should I just trust the yeast?

2) Most people have said they would keep the IBU's down, and BT is predicting 25.4 for me at 5.5 gallons, but is calling it extra malty. (Also predicting 1.085 for OG)

I can't give much advice on my typical efficiency, because this is the first time that I am going to use my new cooler/mash tun.

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Old 11-08-2010, 03:46 PM   #115
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Hi everyone,
Can't wait to brew this next Sunday. A few quick questions:

1) Brewtarget is predicting a final gravity of 1.021, will mashing lower make more fermentables, or should I just trust the yeast?

2) Most people have said they would keep the IBU's down, and BT is predicting 25.4 for me at 5.5 gallons, but is calling it extra malty. (Also predicting 1.085 for OG)

I can't give much advice on my typical efficiency, because this is the first time that I am going to use my new cooler/mash tun.
I easily hit 1.012 - and even down to 1.010 as of this past Thursday (3 days after racking to a secondary) - though I did add a post-boil dextrose addition.

I would go with the mash schedule as Hurricane listed and make a yeast starter 36 hours in advance and keep it in 70-72 temps. Also, given the hop schedule, just adjust accordingly based on your AA% to get to the IBU level initially listed.
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Old 11-09-2010, 01:00 AM   #116
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Hit an FG of 1.013 before bottling last week. Coming in at 9% ABV and quite tasty warm and flat. Hoping to enjoy this at Thanksgiving.

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Old 11-09-2010, 02:30 PM   #117
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Hit an FG of 1.013 before bottling last week. Coming in at 9% ABV and quite tasty warm and flat. Hoping to enjoy this at Thanksgiving.
I know it might be tough to wait, but I envision this beer hitting its stride after a couple months - I'm going to do my very best to pace myself after bottling tonight.
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Old 11-10-2010, 06:22 AM   #118
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I know it might be tough to wait, but I envision this beer hitting its stride after a couple months - I'm going to do my very best to pace myself after bottling tonight.
Yes, this beer is a bit rough early on, but this is getting better every day. I should hold off and bottle my other brew so that this can work itself out a little bit. It took a long time to carb in the bottle, but the wait is worth it!
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Old 11-10-2010, 01:35 PM   #119
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Yes, this beer is a bit rough early on, but this is getting better every day. I should hold off and bottle my other brew so that this can work itself out a little bit. It took a long time to carb in the bottle, but the wait is worth it!
I'm planning on bottle priming with cane sugar - how long did yours take to carb?
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:43 PM   #120
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I'm planning on bottle priming with cane sugar - how long did yours take to carb?
I used 3/4 cups of corn sugar and it took a month in a cold house to get a weak carb. In retrospect I should have kept it a bit warmer.
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