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LAbrewer · 12-08-2012, 06:39 PM

I'm going to brew this tomorrow and need to know if I'm prepared. Does this look right?

- Add dextrose at last 15 minutes of boil along with moss and chiller
- Use actual AA from http://beerdujour.com/recipes/1pliny%20the%20elder%20clone%20pdf.pdf on 90, 45 and 30 minute additions and weighed amounts in the OP on all of the rest.
- 0.5L followed by 1.8L starter of WLP001
- 5.5 gallons in the keggle after the 90 minute boil assuming 73% efficiency and 77% attenuation (brewers friend). Try to strain the hops to 5.25 in the fermenter.
- Transfer 5 days after terminal gravity
- Batch sparge mash starting at 152 (assuming) 1 degree loss.
- first dry hops added in a fine bag to the keg.
- second dry hops added in a tea ball.

fifthcircle · 12-08-2012, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAbrewer

Why not?

I assume you are asking why not put the flame out hops in the fermenter....

My answer would be, it'll make it funky. LOL
Hops used in the boil kettle, no matter at what stage, are always filtered out prior to fermentation. If not, I would guess that you would get a very grassy tasting beer. Same reason most folks don't dry hop for longer than 14days.
Then again, I'm no expert! I just do what is the norm, and drink too much beer

Your recipe looks good, but a little confusing being out of order in your post.

Try to end up with 6gal in the primary fermenter. The trub loss in primary, and the dry hops soaking up beer in secondary will result in a 5gal total yield of drinkable brew. Just sparge a bit more to get what you need, pre-boil.

Also, don't let the AA content, and resulting IBU's scare you. I used hop shots for bittering. Calculated to 150IBU. Its not bitter. Its just perfect to balance out all that grain, resulting in a great IPA.

Good luck!

Kurt

mooshimanx · 12-09-2012, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAbrewer

Why not?

Because flameout hops are still a hot-side technique. Putting hops into the fermenter is dry-hopping, which is not advisable due to the fact that the volatile aromatics will just blow off when the yeast off-gas CO2.

Flameout hops and Dry Hops are not the same thing and they don't DO the same thing in the beer, even if they are both considered "aroma" additions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAbrewer

I'm going to brew this tomorrow and need to know if I'm prepared. Does this look right?

- Add dextrose at last 15 minutes of boil along with moss and chiller
- Use actual AA from http://beerdujour.com/recipes/1pliny%20the%20elder%20clone%20pdf.pdf on 90, 45 and 30 minute additions and weighed amounts in the OP on all of the rest.
- 0.5L followed by 1.8L starter of WLP001
- 5.5 gallons in the keggle after the 90 minute boil assuming 73% efficiency and 77% attenuation (brewers friend). Try to strain the hops to 5.25 in the fermenter.
- Transfer 5 days after terminal gravity
- Batch sparge mash starting at 152 (assuming) 1 degree loss.
- first dry hops added in a fine bag to the keg.
- second dry hops added in a tea ball.

You're going to hit that IBU solubility barrier here, so I wouldn't be particularly worried about IBU adjustment. In Brewing Classic Styles, Jamil Zainasheff has a very similar recipe derived from the Pliny recipe and he specifically recommends not substituting any hops for AA%s. He doesn't explain exactly why but I think it is because 3.5 oz. of Columbus at practically any AA% is going to contribute calculated IBUs in the 200s, which is beyond the level bitterness can really get into the beer.

You want to scale this to a 6 gallon recipe, which is why the base malt should be 13.25 lbs and the Crystal and Carapils should be .6 lbs. You will lose a large amount of beer to absorption from the hops and dry hops.

LAbrewer · 12-11-2012, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fifthcircle

I assume you are asking why not put the flame out hops in the fermenter....

My answer would be, it'll make it funky. LOL
Hops used in the boil kettle, no matter at what stage, are always filtered out prior to fermentation. If not, I would guess that you would get a very grassy tasting beer. Same reason most folks don't dry hop for longer than 14days.
Then again, I'm no expert! I just do what is the norm, and drink too much beer

Your recipe looks good, but a little confusing being out of order in your post.

Try to end up with 6gal in the primary fermenter. The trub loss in primary, and the dry hops soaking up beer in secondary will result in a 5gal total yield of drinkable brew. Just sparge a bit more to get what you need, pre-boil.

Also, don't let the AA content, and resulting IBU's scare you. I used hop shots for bittering. Calculated to 150IBU. Its not bitter. Its just perfect to balance out all that grain, resulting in a great IPA.

Good luck!

Kurt

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooshimanx

Because flameout hops are still a hot-side technique. Putting hops into the fermenter is dry-hopping, which is not advisable due to the fact that the volatile aromatics will just blow off when the yeast off-gas CO2.

Flameout hops and Dry Hops are not the same thing and they don't DO the same thing in the beer, even if they are both considered "aroma" additions.

You're going to hit that IBU solubility barrier here, so I wouldn't be particularly worried about IBU adjustment. In Brewing Classic Styles, Jamil Zainasheff has a very similar recipe derived from the Pliny recipe and he specifically recommends not substituting any hops for AA%s. He doesn't explain exactly why but I think it is because 3.5 oz. of Columbus at practically any AA% is going to contribute calculated IBUs in the 200s, which is beyond the level bitterness can really get into the beer.

You want to scale this to a 6 gallon recipe, which is why the base malt should be 13.25 lbs and the Crystal and Carapils should be .6 lbs. You will lose a large amount of beer to absorption from the hops and dry hops.

Well It looks like I'm headed for disaster because I dumped about 75% of the hops in the fermenter.

Next time I think I will siphon because I got plugged while trying to filter the junk and had to scrape the bottom and let it all go. I'm not too worried about that though because it will only be there for about 10 to 14 days. My real concern is getting only 1.063 after I got 1.050 preboil. It doesn't seem to add up.

I got 7.1 gal down to about 5.7 gal and my calculations told me I should be higher in the end.

fifthcircle · 12-13-2012, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAbrewer

Well It looks like I'm headed for disaster because I dumped about 75% of the hops in the fermenter.

Next time I think I will siphon because I got plugged while trying to filter the junk and had to scrape the bottom and let it all go. I'm not too worried about that though because it will only be there for about 10 to 14 days. My real concern is getting only 1.063 after I got 1.050 preboil. It doesn't seem to add up.

I got 7.1 gal down to about 5.7 gal and my calculations told me I should be higher in the end.

Yeah, just roll with it. Maybe rack to secondary as early as possible.

hbr2547 · 12-13-2012, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fifthcircle

Yeah, just roll with it. Maybe rack to secondary as early as possible.

Subscribed

mooshimanx · 12-21-2012, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fifthcircle

Yeah, just roll with it. Maybe rack to secondary as early as possible.

My personal opinion (and this is taste-subjective) is that for IPAs dropping all the trub into the fermenter doens't really mean anything so long as you can chill/let it all settle out. It mostly affects (to me, again) the appearance and not the taste since it stays hazy for a bit longer when you have a ton of trub in the fermenter flying around during the ferment.

If it makes people feel better, I drink real Pliny with some regularity at a local watering hole that has it on draft 70% of the time. It is not always a clear beer. It sometimes looks full on filtered (they centrifuge, I believe, but I know they treat bottles and draft differently, so I can't for certain specify), but just as often it looks slightly hazy. Don't sweat it. If you give the beer to someone that can appreciate its flavor and aroma they won't care about the clarity at all.

(Full disclosure, I made this with whole hops, but a lot of the broken down bits made it through the bazooka tube)

LAbrewer · 12-21-2012, 01:40 PM

I crashed mine yesterday with gelatin. Tasted like a grapefruit bomb toward the end of fermentation. Now it's a little less acidic bitter and it has a honey like taste. Still really bitter though.

Stokes_ · 12-25-2012, 03:52 PM

Bookmarked. Thanks for posting.

doublehaul · 12-28-2012, 06:07 PM

How critical is the second dry hop? I'm in a 5 gallon secondary and the first round hasn't even soaked up yet' and I doubt another round would even get wet.

Also - I put the hops in the fermenter loose because I couldn't squeeze the 3oz hop bag through the hole. There's got to be a better way to dry hop
My columbus was pellets, so there's a ton of debris in the beer now. Any advice on filtering this when I keg? I just have an auto siphon.

Tasted great - real grapefruity. My OG was 1.070 and I'm at 1.012 right now.