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Old 01-24-2010, 05:41 PM   #11
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i wouldnt have posted the recipe if it wasnt damn close. its real close. also, if you research it a little bit, Surly uses the same malt the Macallan uses to make their scotch. It is definitly NOT a SMaSH. the late hop additions of Amarillo and Simcoe are pretty much dead on. its the addition of an oz of Ahtanum for DH that i'll try next time. otherwise, very very close.

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Old 02-11-2010, 09:09 PM   #12
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I agree with permo ... you missed the bus on this a bit. First, I don't think a 60 min. boil is long enough to develop the caramel/malty flavors you need. Surely, to me, wasn't an over-the-top, punch-you-in-the-face IPA. It's a balanced and malty IPA with a very nice floral smell/flavor from the amarillo.

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Old 02-11-2010, 10:29 PM   #13
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interesting that people are not trying the recipe but saying its wrong. again, i would not have posted if i didnt think it was very close. a few of my friends who also have accounts here at HBT confirm the thing is damn close.

so here is the site i found the recipe from.

http://www.cockale.com/?p=1032

please note the guy actually posts Midwest Supplies clone recipe, the reason he has the recipe to post is because he bought it and made it and also confirms its damn close.

then please note that he writes he has a friend with a PhD who is a master judge for BJCP blah blah blah whatever any of that means and she comments on Midwest's Kit and makes changes. I used her hop schedule but i used Midwests specialty grains. also as previously noted, Surly uses the same malt that McCallan uses to make their scotch.

************************************************** *******
“Ferocious IPA: LIMITED EDITION ALL GRAIN RECIPE KIT: Advanced Equipment and knowledge required to make this kit. Created with the brewers of Surly Brewing in Minnesota, this IPA uses 6 ounces of hops to create a bold brew that is rich in malt sweetness infused with bright hop flavor and aroma. Our ingredients for this recipe kit include 11 lbs. Golden Promise base malt, 1 lb. Munich 10°L, 4 oz. Medium Crystal 50-60°L, 1 oz. high-alpha bittering hops, 2 oz. Amarillo, 3 oz. Simcoe hops, priming sugar, and yeast. Yeast Upgrade Options: Wyeast British II Ale # 1335 or White Labs Dry English Ale Ale # 007.

Hopping Schedule

1 oz Magnum - 60
Mix 1 oz each of Amarillo/Simcoe - equal parts @ 20, 15, 10, 5, 0
1 oz Amarillo DH
2 oz Simcoe DH”
And yet, with a little research into the veracity of this claim…we come to find problems with Midwest’s formulation of the Furious. The brilliant, arrogant, and notoriously salty, Kristen England, Ph.D. BJCP Continuing Education Director, Grand Master Judge, posted this on the Northern Brewer forums this past autumn.

“Nov 07, 2008 9:28 am

A buddy forwarded this to me to ask me what I thought of the ‘clone’ recipe. Although close it doesn’t seem right to me. So I sat down with a can of furious, this recipe and all my ‘cloning’ gadgets.

I do understand that some Surly brewer helped with this so take all this with a grain of salt. I very much could have picked up the phone and asked Todd about this but Im very much against doing that. Frankly I would hate it if someone did that to me. If someone got it right by experiment then good on them.

So here are my problems with this recipe:

1. Its not dark enough. I used my colormeter and Furious seems about 15srm NOT 7.
2. That amount of light munich wouldn’t seem to give it enough of that Munichy character that I get out of furious. Its tastes more of the caramunich to me. This however could be a greater amount of munich with a darker crystal malt. The 55L stuff doesn’t give those deep chewy flavors unless used in high quantities but then you get a ton of caramel sweetness which I don’t get out of Furious.
3. FG and crystal amount. Ive used golden promise and munich extensively for years now. Ive mashed them for single infusions and triple decocted them. The thing I’ve found is that with any of the mashing schema, I’ve still been able to get a very good finishing gravity. Testing the fg of surly makes it about 1.014 (~8brix measured). This data with the color and attenuation of the yeast indicates that they amount and type of crystal malt is along the lines of what Im thinking.
3. There are 4 hops used in Furious, not 3. The bitterness is too sharp to be 100% Magnum IMO. Tastes more like Warrior or Zeus.
4. There are about 3.25lbs/ bbl of hops used in Furious, this recipe has only 2.3. More hops at the beginning can’t be done as it ups the IBU’s way out of range. The dry hopping looks right as its about 1.25#/bbl which is quite a high amount as is. Plus the flavor is not just hoppy but ‘hops’ with all the resins and such. 2oz wont give you that.

As i said before, this recipe is based on what I tasted in the beer and off the stuff that I know and could find out. Take it for what its worth but it does seem to be much more spot on. This recipe may be complete crap…but I would bet otherwise.

14B - Surly - Furious

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
—————-

Batch Size (Gal): 5.00 Wort Size (Gal): 5.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 11.50
Anticipated OG: 1.060 Plato: 14.74
Anticipated SRM: 15.8
Anticipated IBU: 98.8
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
—————————————————————————–
84.8 9.75 lbs. Pale malt - Golden Promise Scotland 1.038 3
13.0 1.50 lbs. CaraMunich Malt Belgium 1.033 75
2.2 0.25 lbs. Crystal 55L Great Britian 1.034 55

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.
Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
—————————————————————————–
0.50 oz. Warrior Pellet 15.70 30.9 60 min.
0.50 oz. Magnum Pellet 11.00 21.6 60 min.
0.33 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.20 6.4 20 min.
0.33 oz. Simcoe Pellet 13.20 10.4 20 min.
0.33 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.20 5.3 15 min.
0.33 oz. Simcoe Pellet 13.20 8.5 15 min.
0.33 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.20 3.9 10 min.
0.33 oz. Simcoe Pellet 13.20 6.2 10 min.
0.33 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.20 2.1 5 min.
0.33 oz. Simcoe Pellet 13.20 3.4 5 min.
0.33 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.20 0.0 0 min.
0.33 oz. Simcoe Pellet 13.20 0.0 0 min.
2.00 oz. Simcoe Pellet 13.20 0.0 Dry Hop
1.00 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.20 0.0 Dry Hop
Yeast
—–
WYeast 1335 British Ale II

Mash Schedule
————-

Mash Name: Single Infusion Mash

Total Grain Lbs: 11.50
Total Water Qts: 13.22 - Before Additional Infusions
Total Water Gal: 3.31 - Before Additional Infusions

Tun Thermal Mass: 0.00
Grain Temp: 70.00 F

Step Rest Start Stop Heat Infuse Infuse Infuse
Step Name Time Time Temp Temp Type Temp Amount Ratio
———————————————————————————
Single Infusion 1 60 153 153 Infuse 167 13.22 1.15

Total Water Qts: 13.22 - After Additional Infusions
Total Water Gal: 3.31 - After Additional Infusions
Total Mash Volume Gal: 4.23 - After Additional Infusions

All temperature measurements are degrees Fahrenheit.
All infusion amounts are in Quarts.
All infusion ratios are Quarts/Lbs.

Egészségedre,
Kristen England, Ph.D.
BJCP Continuing Education Director
Grand Master Judge
http://www.bjcp.org
http://www.bjcp.org/cep“

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Old 02-12-2010, 07:35 PM   #14
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Default From Surly's website:


BEER FOR A GLASS, FROM A CAN.
Furious

A tempest on the tongue, or a moment of pure hop bliss? Brewed with a dazzling blend of American hops and Scottish malt, this crimson-hued ale delivers waves of citrus, pine and caramel-toffee. For those who favor flavor, Furious has the hop-fire your taste buds have been screeching for.

STYLE: American India Pale Ale
MALT: Pale Ale, Golden Promise, Aromatic, Medium Crystal, Roasted Barley
HOPS: Warrior, Ahtanum, Simcoe, Amarillo
YEAST: English Ale

OG: 15º Plato
ABV: 6.5% v/v
COLOR: 27 ÌŠL
IBU: 99

AVAILABILITY: Cans and Kegs
, Year Round

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Old 02-15-2010, 11:48 PM   #15
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Ok Jackson, not trying to hijack your thread or anything, but this seems to be the time and place to have the debate about Furious. This is such a good beer that I think it deserves the debate.

I have not brewed the beer with the recipe you have posted. I am not doubting that it is very good and very close to the same beer. I believe there are many ways to get to the same goal. However, according to the Surly website, they use different ingredients than all of the clone recipes that I have seen.

I have come up with a recipe using the ingredients listed on the site along with Kristen England's critique. I will post it tonight when I get off work and have access to my beersmith. I am planning on brewing this recipe in the next couple of weeks, and would be open to doing a beer swap with you if you wanted to compare.

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Old 02-16-2010, 01:20 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MachineShopBrewing View Post
I have come up with a recipe using the ingredients listed on the site along with Kristen England's critique. I will post it tonight when I get off work and have access to my beersmith. I am planning on brewing this recipe in the next couple of weeks, and would be open to doing a beer swap with you if you wanted to compare.
Heck yea dude. I'm not concerned about a thread hi jack, just stating that I did research this *&%^ out of this before I brewed, then brewed and tasted, then confirmed with other beer snob friends all of whom consider IPA their favorite style. Damn close.

I can tell you the Simcoe/ Amarillo hop schedule for the last 20min seems to be dead on. I can also tell you that the idea of some aromatic might help becuase my version didnt seem to have quite the malt backbone. I have no idea how the roasted barley would fit in unless its maybe just an ounce. Also I'm not totally sold on the 1oz of Warrior. The real Furious seems a bit more bitter up front. So maybe an ounce and a half?

Just some more thoughts if they help with your formulation. Only other concern- I'm out of this right now. It went real quick. And I have a bunch more on the schedule before I get to this one again. Barleywine, Lambic and I'm on a lager kick right now. So not sure when I can make another batch. But when you really are gonna fire thsi one up, let me know and I'll do one side by side with you if I can.

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Old 02-16-2010, 07:40 AM   #17
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Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 6.00 gal
Boil Size: 7.50 gal
Estimated OG: 1.061 SG
Estimated Color: 16.0 SRM
Estimated IBU: 97.8 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 60.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
7.25 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 43.94 %
7.25 lb Pale Malt, Golden Promise (3.0 SRM) Grain 43.94 %
1.00 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 6.06 %
0.75 lb Aromatic Malt (26.0 SRM) Grain 4.55 %
0.25 lb Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM) Grain 1.52 %
1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [7.50 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.00 oz Ahtanum [6.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (60 min) Hops 18.2 IBU
1.00 oz Warrior [15.00 %] (60 min) Hops 42.1 IBU
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (20 min) Hops 11.0 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [7.50 %] (20 min) Hops 6.4 IBU
0.33 oz Amarillo Gold [7.50 %] (15 min) Hops 3.4 IBU
0.33 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (15 min) Hops 6.0 IBU
0.33 oz Amarillo Gold [7.50 %] (10 min) Hops 2.5 IBU
0.33 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (10 min) Hops 4.4 IBU
0.33 oz Amarillo Gold [7.50 %] (5 min) Hops 1.4 IBU
0.33 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (5 min) Hops 2.4 IBU
0.33 oz Amarillo Gold [7.50 %] (0 min) Hops -
0.33 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (0 min) Hops -
1 Pkgs Dry English Ale (White Labs #WLP007) [StarYeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: My Mash
Total Grain Weight: 16.50 lb
----------------------------
My Mash
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
60 min Step Add 24.00 qt of water at 167.1 F 153.0 F

Ferment at 68 F (controlled, Ranco two stage is on the way from MoreBeer.com)


Ok, couple of things about this recipe. They list both Pale malt and Golden Promise. I thought I would split it even the first time and see what it tastes like. The other thing is the Roasted Barley. I just plugged in .25 lb. That might be too much, I have to research that a little more. I think that is what gives them that great fire red color though. Also, I have Simcoe and Amarillo on hand so I went with the AA% that I have, YMMV. I tend to add my 0 min additions at 2 min because of the way that I strain the hops with a paint strainer hop device. I pull it out a minute after flame out and then chill. Mash temp could be 152-153. I was going to brew and see where I ended up and adjust for next time. I threw .50 oz Simcoe at 60 min just because I don't have warrior on hand and didn't want to buy 2 oz and have .5 oz left over. I base my recipes on 60% because that is what I seem to get and I am happy with the results.

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Old 02-16-2010, 05:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
then please note that he writes he has a friend with a PhD who is a master judge for BJCP blah blah blah whatever any of that means and she comments on Midwest's Kit and makes changes. I used her hop schedule but i used Midwests specialty grains.
Just for FYI, Kristen England is one of the top homebrewers in the world, and is a Grand Master Judge, which is no small feat. Also, Kristen is a guy, not a girl. I generally take everything he says regarding brewing as law.

Not to rip or anything, just FYI.
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Old 02-16-2010, 05:33 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MachineShopBrewing View Post
Just for FYI, Kristen England is one of the top homebrewers in the world, and is a Grand Master Judge, which is no small feat. Also, Kristen is a guy, not a girl. I generally take everything he says regarding brewing as law.
ah ha. i accidentally assumed Yooper was a guy when I first got here. so there I go putting my foot in my mouth again.

and i get it. i get that the person is certified judge and all that good stuff and that why i put a lot of stock in their recipe. i didnt know who they were but i didnt assume their titale was fake. just that lots of people use lots of different titles for lots of different stuff, and sometimes it doenst mean anything, and if i dont know the person i dont always believe everything i see written. but i brewed the thing and it was fantastic so thats good enuff for me

now otherwise i would think that .25# roasted barley is way to much. but your Beersmith says the color is right on...

i would be concerned with a whole pound of crystal being to sweet, but then i see that WLP007 says it will kill most residual sweetness. still i would prob use less crystal. notice Kristen uses .25# crystal... in my experience with my own recipes, 1# crystal leaves an IPA waaay too sweet.

keep thinking on it



I like WLP005 better becuase it looks closest to Wyeast British Ale II.
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Old 02-16-2010, 06:29 PM   #20
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I am going to pick up a four pack today on my way to work and drink some tonight. I want to have it fresh in my mind and then look at the recipe again.

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