Kegconnection Complete Starter Kit and More Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > DIY Projects > LOVE or PID to control Brutus Solenoids?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-19-2010, 10:20 PM   #1
ubermick
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Rafael, California
Posts: 989
Liked 21 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 8

Default LOVE or PID to control Brutus Solenoids?

Afternoon all!

So am (still) kicking around building a brutus, and am (still) amassing a cost for this to present to SWMBO for final budget approval. Nearly there, tho.

When it comes to controlling ye olde solenoid valves though, I've got a bit of a question. I know the Love TS-13010 are the controllers of choice for the Brutus, $65 a pop from Dwyer, plus shipping. Fair enough.

However.

My evil cohort has suggested that a PID like this one would be able to do the same thing, as well as displaying the target AND current liquid temps (which I'd find handy!), for almost half the price?

I've found tons of threads of folks using these for e-keggles, but nobody (as yet) for a Brutus. I'm assuming (as usual) that the draw from a solenoid valve like the STCs or ASCOs wouldn't require the use of a SSR either?

ubermick is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-19-2010, 10:29 PM   #2
lamarguy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,657
Liked 20 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

I think you want simple on/off control for the solenoids. If you feel the Love controller is too expensive, Auberins sells a PID with an on/off control mode for $42.

__________________
Doggfather Brewery

Planned: Lambic, American IPA
Fermenting: 6 gals of 1.090 stout (Belgian) & 6 gals of 1.090 stout (English)
Tapped: Berliner Weisse, Black English IPA, German Pils, & Live Oak Primus
lamarguy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-19-2010, 11:51 PM   #3
ubermick
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Rafael, California
Posts: 989
Liked 21 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 8

Default

Well, the cost savings are nice (although kinda negligible when you figure in the cost of thermocouples as well), but I was really digging the fact that the PID displayed current AND target temp right there.

ubermick is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 12:12 AM   #4
BucksPA
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Bucks, PA
Posts: 443
Liked 5 Times on 5 Posts

Default

subscribed. i'm right there with you, shopping for control panel parts. i saw the same one on ebay just a few hours ago. I'll be curious as to what everyone else says, but I'm thinking it will work. Look at Lonnie Mac's Brutus Clone's on his website and you'll see all sorts of temperature controllers.

__________________
BucksPA is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 12:17 AM   #5
IrregularPulse
Hobby Collector
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
IrregularPulse's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 42,248
Liked 2754 Times on 2705 Posts
Likes Given: 113

Default

As long as it has the proper Output voltage type and rating, and can handle the current draw of the valve, it will work. That's what you need to look at compared to your valves.

__________________
Tap Room Hobo

I should have stuck to four fingers in Vegas. :o - marubozo
IrregularPulse is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 03:33 PM   #6
ubermick
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Rafael, California
Posts: 989
Liked 21 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucksPA View Post
subscribed. i'm right there with you, shopping for control panel parts. i saw the same one on ebay just a few hours ago. I'll be curious as to what everyone else says, but I'm thinking it will work. Look at Lonnie Mac's Brutus Clone's on his website and you'll see all sorts of temperature controllers.
Hmm, well as Lamar says, a solenoid really needs two states, on and off.

Since I can't verify if the one on ebay offers on/off control (seems that the Auber flavour has "new" features) then I don't think this ebay one would work for controlling a solenoid, since there's no real variable curve involved. (for example with a heating element, the PID will slowly reduce current as it approaches target temp, valve doesn't really work like that, it's either on or off, and messing around with the current to the valve could cause issues.)

Those on here who... what's the word I'm looking for... oh yeah, know what they're talking about (unlike me!) can please correct me if I'm wrong.

(Also, I'm using a lot of parenthesis lately...)
__________________
Hey look, a Brutus! | Hey look, a keezer! | Hey look, a milling station!
ubermick is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 04:17 PM   #7
CodeRage
Death by Magumba!
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
CodeRage's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Melbourne, Fl
Posts: 2,254
Liked 29 Times on 16 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ubermick View Post
Hmm, well as Lamar says, a solenoid really needs two states, on and off.

Since I can't verify if the one on ebay offers on/off control (seems that the Auber flavour has "new" features) then I don't think this ebay one would work for controlling a solenoid, since there's no real variable curve involved. (for example with a heating element, the PID will slowly reduce current as it approaches target temp, valve doesn't really work like that, it's either on or off, and messing around with the current to the valve could cause issues.)

Those on here who... what's the word I'm looking for... oh yeah, know what they're talking about (unlike me!) can please correct me if I'm wrong.

(Also, I'm using a lot of parenthesis lately...)
Well, all of the PIDs you see people using on here have digital outputs. The SSRs are switched frequently to emulate an analog output. With that said...
The one lamar posted would be my recommendation, the relay contacts in the controller shouldn't have an issue controlling a solenoid. I bought a few of the chinese PID controllers on e-bay which was a mistake. Their support sucks butt, I had to find the documentation to the controller they ripped off to answer my questions.
__________________
Brutus 20e build | Electrical Primer for Brewers | Auber SYL-2362A2 PID Install & Config
So as I am walking out the door this morning I think to my self:
"self, going to work on Monday is like knowing you're going to get kicked in the nuts. You just don't know when or by who"
CodeRage is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 05:43 PM   #8
ubermick
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Rafael, California
Posts: 989
Liked 21 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CodeRage View Post
Well, all of the PIDs you see people using on here have digital outputs. The SSRs are switched frequently to emulate an analog output. With that said...
The one lamar posted would be my recommendation, the relay contacts in the controller shouldn't have an issue controlling a solenoid. I bought a few of the chinese PID controllers on e-bay which was a mistake. Their support sucks butt, I had to find the documentation to the controller they ripped off to answer my questions.
Cheers for that, Code. More and more tho, I'm starting to think that as nice as it would be to have the dual readout, just going with a tried and tested temp switch like ye olde Love TS-13010 might solve some potential headaches.

Here's another question, tho - anyone know of a nice countdown timer to use in a control panel?
__________________
Hey look, a Brutus! | Hey look, a keezer! | Hey look, a milling station!
ubermick is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 06:10 PM   #9
CodeRage
Death by Magumba!
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
CodeRage's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Melbourne, Fl
Posts: 2,254
Liked 29 Times on 16 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

I'm not going to try to talk you out of the Love controller, The Auber isn't any more complicated and they are pretty tried and true as well. Not to mention more bang for your buck.

Usually the programmable timers are insanely expensive (%150+). Just found this one at auber, which is a stinking steal. ASL-51

__________________
Brutus 20e build | Electrical Primer for Brewers | Auber SYL-2362A2 PID Install & Config
So as I am walking out the door this morning I think to my self:
"self, going to work on Monday is like knowing you're going to get kicked in the nuts. You just don't know when or by who"
CodeRage is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2010, 06:19 PM   #10
ubermick
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Rafael, California
Posts: 989
Liked 21 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CodeRage View Post
I'm not going to try to talk you out of the Love controller, The Auber isn't any more complicated and they are pretty tried and true as well. Not to mention more bang for your buck.

Usually the programmable timers are insanely expensive (%150+). Just found this one at auber, which is a stinking steal. ASL-51
Great googaly moogaly, that's more than I want! I was thinking just having a wee kitchen timer type dealie that I could use for hop additions, etc., and figured there'd be something uber basic that could be wired in as opposed to clipping something on from Bed Bath and Beyond!
__________________
Hey look, a Brutus! | Hey look, a keezer! | Hey look, a milling station!
ubermick is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Think I screwed up on a love control Ed_ DIY Projects 5 12-28-2009 06:31 PM
Brutus Control Panel Wiring Gordie Equipment/Sanitation 13 12-02-2008 04:24 PM
brutus control panel thooper41 Equipment/Sanitation 3 10-07-2008 11:50 PM
Love control help? Battery_BreweryNJ Equipment/Sanitation 9 07-13-2008 12:35 AM
Brutus wire gage for Love controllers pieper DIY Projects 1 04-02-2008 08:00 PM