It's official starting my own brewing business!

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akthor said:
Hey guys sorry I used to do most of my posting from work but they installed some sort of Net Nanny and HBT is now a blocked domain for me at work :(

Great thread! The above quote sounds like enough of a reason to increase the days of operation, and get rid of the day job ;)

Good luck. I look forward to seeing the continued progress!
 
Just stumbled across this thread and have been making my way through the whole thing all weekend.

Congrats on taking your dream and making a reality! Looks like you've done a great job thus far, and I can't wait to see more updates as you progress. Unfortunately I'm in Alberta for the next 2 years, but when I return to MA / the new England area, I look forward to stopping by for some hb & BBQ!

Cheers!
 
Hey guys live posting during my first brew session in the new place on the new rig. Course having a lot of bugs to work thru this first time.

First not really brewing but made a 5 gallon batch of Apfelwein and a 5 gallon batch of hard cider and got them into the fermentation room.

Next it was onto making my first brew with this gear a Red Ale.

Then first thing off discovered the electric motor I used for my grain mill is not powerful enough to do more than a cup or so of grain at a time so doing the near 19 lb grain bill sucked a little bit.

Then when i went to fire up the burners on my stand I couldn't get much of flame after messing around for an hour trying to get it to work I had to give up. I think it's a bad regulator.

So out came the old turkey frier and moving the keggles as needed on and off it sucked big time.

Was some good news. Chugger pumps work awesome! My vent fan and hood work great better than I thought they would even with the turkey burner not right under it.

Need some gloves for disconnecting the hot camlocks. Need to learn also how to do it without spilling whats left in the hose.

So find a bigger motor for my mill. Get my burners working. Hope to try again this weekend.

Finishing the boil on the Red Ale right now another 40 mins or so. Smells like beer so thats a good sign.

I will post a couple of pics tomorrow.
 
I got blitzed while reading the 29 pages on this thread (so far). One point occurred to me early on on reading this thread: F**k the man, start selling your brew to friends and supporters now. You clearly have a following and a base of customers who are willing to travel out of their way to support you... Even if your establishment isn't ready to open to the public, you could make up some of your initial start up costs by opening for "Private parties" as soon as you have brews that are ready to drink. Couple that with some killer BBQ, and you could pay for this venture one weekend at a time.

My Uncle started an automotive repair shop when he was relatively young. My brother went to work for him when he was 15. My Uncle got past some of the overly restrictive laws and regulations (in CA) by telling the inspectors "Sorry, I had no idea..." My brother now has his own shop and he often wishes he had the balls to do the same thing: he has spent tens of thousands of dollars in local fees for the opportunity to do business. I say brew up some good beer, put it out on this forum, and the money can start rollin in now. If anyone asks, they are your friends and houseguests. You have tons of potential customers, don't keep them waiting too long!

We're pullin for you!
 
congrats, I hope you're ready to work though, I ran the kitchen in a BBQ restaurant a while back.....not easy, and long hours.
 
Alot of people say its hard work.. And it is.. However any work is hard.. I rather work hard at something i love to do than work hard at something I have to do... Long as you can stay afloat you'll enjoy it!

Congrats man... I think most people on this forum want to do the same... If not all of them. I know i would. I have been approached many times by investors that would put money up for a place especially for my ribs and chicken smokes... Beer would be the icing. I work 80hr weeks now and pay the bills, cant seem to get the nerve to take them up on the offers and leave my job!! Im chicken.
 
I got blitzed while

I say brew up some good beer, put it out on this forum, and the money can start rollin in now. If anyone asks, they are your friends and houseguests. You have tons of potential customers, don't keep them waiting too long!

We're pullin for you!

Your either drunk, or an idiot. If you get caught selling alcohol without a license, after you spend a little time in jail, you can forget about every getting a license. Why would anyone that wants to do this for a profession even think about risking it for a few bucks.
 
Your either drunk, or an idiot. If you get caught selling alcohol without a license, after you spend a little time in jail, you can forget about every getting a license. Why would anyone that wants to do this for a profession even think about risking it for a few bucks.

or he's ATF trolling. :confused:
 
To an extent 60sd is right.
When he says tell the law "Sorry, I didn't know" That is correct.
I have been placed in bad situations in manufacturing medical devices when the owner says, "O, ya, we have that." When in reality he doesn't have a clue what he's talking about. he did that twice to me, which means i had to back log all kinds of records, and work my ass off, all the while, if he said "Sorry, I didn't know I needed that," the law would have said, "OK, lets get you what you need, if you need help, here is the small business division's number."
The law really isn't as bad as they're made out to be.....as long as you are paying the fines/fees/taxes/etc.
 
Your either drunk, or an idiot. If you get caught selling alcohol without a license, after you spend a little time in jail, you can forget about every getting a license. Why would anyone that wants to do this for a profession even think about risking it for a few bucks.

I was drunk when I wrote that, but I'm not an idiot. (and I'm not ATF!) I should clarify that I was talking about local regulations, permitting, inspections, etc. I certainly wouldn't endorse selling alcohol without the proper ATF or ABC licensing. On the other hand, if the local building inspector shows up and says you need 5 more fire extinguishers and a no smoking sign, as well as an $800 permit, you may be able to slide by pleading ignorance and promising to correct the situation as soon as possible. Here in California, the business environment is so restrictive that it seems like the only way to open your doors is to have 500,000 ready to spend, and good luck getting a loan without full collateral. I apologize if in my stupor I gave the wrong impression!
 
I don't sell my beer right now but I do leave a tip jar out. Course it don't do me much good since my friends tend to "forget" to put money in it but if I am lucky I get enough to cover the cost of what they drink which isn't very often.

Ended up that it was the regulator on my stand afterall I just wasn't operating the new regulator right. Spent three hours taking the burners off and apart checking orifices. Blowing air through the part of the stand that serves as the manifold looking for blockages. Finally while on the phone with the builder of my stand I discovered that the on off knob on the new regulator has to turned 3 or 4 times to be on and not just a 1/2 turn. So with that WOOOSH we were cooking with gas finally!

Still on the hunt for a new electric motor to power my mill I got a cheap plug in drill to power it in the meantime (mistake)

Crap posting this with an Ipad so I can't seem to attach pics. I will post the pics when I get home after work in the morning.

So after the first brew day fiasco I was ready for a 2nd go. Did another batch of Apfelwein and Hard Cider. Beers were a Nut Brown Ale and what I call Full Moon Ale, since it tastes similiar to Blue Moon Ale.

Nut Brown first, ground the grain, drill managed to do it with not too much trouble.

What a joy being able to use the burners on the stand and the pumps and the everything went great. Using the SS coil in my HLT filled with ice worked perfect as a chiller. Bonus was that it also warmed the water up in the HLT making it take less time to heat up for the 2nd batch.

On the second batch things didn't go so smoothly. First I pushed the drill too hard and it caught on fire. Had to grind most of the second batch by hand. During brewing I got a stuck sparge (been researching and I am leaning towards switching to batch sparging instead of fly sparging, I think the loss of efficiency is worth not having to constantly fiddle with everything) then I had some friends show up during the boil. I was showing them around and not paying attention and have a massive boil over :( I managed to salvage the brew but added about 3 hours to my clean up :confused:

So it gets better everytime and I am learning more too.

I know down the road when money allows I will be going all electric. Man those LP burners throw out some heat. I think electric would make for more comfortable brew days and be a lot easier to maintain temps with.

So here are some pics. I also got about 3/4 of the exterior of the building painted. My brother is coming down to help this weekend and so I fully expect the house and trim to be finished. We are also gooing to rip the white vinyl sidibg off of the shed and use the same sheathing as on the house and paint it to match right now it looks weird being white. So after the weekend I will post up pics of the finished exterior. My landlord will then pay me for the work in materials to be used for the brewery so I expect very soon to be ordering the flooring (green rubber type flooring) and to be framing in at least the walk in cooler but I hope also the wall seperating the utilty/laundry room from the brewery.

Also this weekend I will be doing more Apfelwein and hard cider and I am brewing a batch of wheat beer that I am going to divide into 5 gallon batches and use on to make a black rasberry wheat with rasberries picked on the property and the other 5 gallons will be a blueberry wheat with blueberries from a guy who sells them off of his property on my way to work.
 
Crap I am posting this from an Ipad and I can't seem to attach pics. Will will post them in the morning when I get home from work.
 
akthor said:
Crap I am posting this from an Ipad and I can't seem to attach pics. Will will post them in the morning when I get home from work.

Sounds great! I can't wait to see them! And for my iPhone I have to use the advanced setting, upload a picture then add a line of text for it to post, good luck on your business!!
 
Pics! I will have more after the weekend showing the exterior work.

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How's the licensing and other bureaucratic nonsense coming along?
 
Good luck!! I finally signed up to Homebrewtalk after spending the last hour reading this thread. Though Maine is far from where I am, I can see myself making a trip out there to have a pint and some BBQ.
 
Haven't checked into yet been too busy with work (been working 60 hrs per week) and trying to get stuff done here. Rapidly approaching the point where I need to find out though because once I get to the point of doing work specific to the brewing alone I have to know if we will keep the brewing area in the main building or turn the 12x16 shed into a brew shed.

After we get the exterior painting done this weekend I am going to find out what I need to do because the next part besides building the walk in cooler would be ordering flooring and building walls to seperate the utilty room/laundry room so before I do that I need to know.

I did make friends with my neighbor when he came to look for his dog on my property he loved my plans and told me to keep him in mind for the gravel and earthwork for the campground cuz he has a business that does that stuff. AND he has friends on the planning board here on the island ;)

How's the licensing and other bureaucratic nonsense coming along?
 
Hey fellas here's some Maine Small Brewery Law stuff, I have perused and don't anything say a residence CAN'T be attached to the brewery. Maybe I am reading it wrong but here are the links if you guys wanna look them over and give me your opinions:

http://www.mainelegislature.org/legis/statutes/28-a/title28-Ach51.pdf

http://www.maine.gov/dps/liqr/applications.html

http://law.justia.com/codes/maine/2005/title28-ach0sec0/title28-asec1355.html

http://www.cga.ct.gov/2009/rpt/2009-R-0291.htm

Free pint to anyone who can make heads or tails of this stuff ;)

Oh hell any of you who show up get a free pint anyways :)

Goin back out to paint :(
 
Hey fellas here's some Maine Small Brewery Law stuff, I have perused and don't anything say a residence CAN'T be attached to the brewery. Maybe I am reading it wrong but here are the links if you guys wanna look them over and give me your opinions

Not totally caught up on this thread, but a more likely issue would be that the zoning code in your municipality would not allow that. Again, apologies if this has already been covered, but I'd recommend meeting with whoever is in charge of zoning for the muni and see what regulations apply and how to seek out variances/etc. if needed.
 
This is pretty straight forward legal jargon. I mean straight forward to me. I did a bit of business law studying in college. And your right it doesn't say any in the alcohol section about residence and brewery issues but that might come up in zoning laws more than the creation and distribution of alcohol.

This looks like a good resource of all your permitting and legal reporting.

This is a distilled version of the first one.

This is a good quick reference to how many bbls you can produce in a year and how much other states can.

Good luck to you. I hope I helpped in some fashion and hopefully i can come out to maine one day and see it.
Cheers:mug:
 
Zoning is the least of my worries. Where I am is already zoned commercial. I will not be selling liquor or even bud light. And I have no close neighbors. I have several contacts who are either on the planning board or are friends with people on the planning board and all have given me a big thumbs up.

In reading the laws there seems to be nothing about a residence attached to a brewery. There is something about the brewing area being separated from the brew pub area by a door. So we may have to move the doorway to the fermentation room so that you enter from the brewing area and not the tap room.

We are going to start checking the building codes now to make sure there isn't anything we need to do special. My gf knows the code enforcement guy too.

More pics of the newly painted and trimmed building and the newly renovated shed exterior tomorrow.
 
Not for nothing, the minute you start selling your beer it's legally the same as bud light and is no longer homebrew. You're still going to need a liquor license etc even if you don't sell liquor or "commercial" brews.

Sounds like the zoning won't be a problem though which is nice. Have you considered an attorney for the convenience of not having to deal with any of it?
 
Good stuff. Good luck to you. I know that my winery has to report where tax paid wine is stored versus where bonded wine is stored and they dont care if that includes residence property as long as they know where it is stored. Cheers.
 
The Feds are the ones who will have a problem with your brewery attached to a residence.
 
Lol no what I mean is I won't be selling hard liquor or bud lt meaning that I won't have crazy drunk people fighting in the parking lot ;)


Not for nothing, the minute you start selling your beer it's legally the same as bud light and is no longer homebrew. You're still going to need a liquor license etc even if you don't sell liquor or "commercial" brews.

Sounds like the zoning won't be a problem though which is nice. Have you considered an attorney for the convenience of not having to deal with any of it?
 
Federal laws? Hmmm got any info on them I was only aware of state laws. Figured as long as the feds got their taxes they were happy? Of course federally marijuana is illegal but in Maine we have medical marijuana so who knows what is right?

The Feds are the ones who will have a problem with your brewery attached to a residence.
 
I haven't read through the first 32 pages but there are an asston of Federal, State and local laws that have to be dealt with. Two partners and I are,f reakin hopefully, about two weeks from opening a nano in SE Mass and have all of our licenses done. We are simply waiting for our HVAC guy to finish the ventilation and then get the final building inspector sign off.

The TTB has a mountain of paperwork that needs to be filled out but 99% of what they Feds care about is taxes, how you're going to track your payable taxes and then how you're going to pay them. (not remotely accusing you of this but folks who think, "meh... I'll figure it out and pay 'em what I want"... are in for a very rude awakening). They're going to want surety bonds, bank statements, proof of where all of the funding for this venture is coming from, blueprints of the floorplan, the deed or lease agreement on the space showing it is cleared for use, explanations of how you are going to keep your pre-tax and post-tax inventory physically separated... those are just a few things.

Then... once you have your TTB license, you can deal with the state... and go through all of the same stuff although the state is going to start getting more specific in terms of the various licenses you can apply for and how they will apply. They'll also want all of the same tax information, etc. On top of that, you'll start getting into the whole "brewery attached to a residence" issue ( I don't know what the laws in Maine say about it).

Once you have all of that done... THEN, you get the pleasure of dealing with the town building codes... and here's where the real fun begins. Is the building zoned properly for a brewery? Just because it may be zoned "commercial" or even "restaurant" doesn't mean it is zoned for being a brewery. We had a nightmare because our building was zoned for both commercial and restaurant but according to our town's by-laws, a brewery is a "manufacturing plant"... as you're "manufacturing" beer... so we had to deal with the building inspector and town zoning board before we could even lift a finger. Then you're going to need to pull every permit under the sun by licensed electricians, plumbers, HVAC guys, etc to hook everything up. Also... the town building inspector and plumbing inspector will likely have a strong opinion on the actual brewing equipment. The trusty old banjo burners?? Nope... not in our town. They aren't UL certified nor do they have any other industry safety certifications so we couldn't use them. We had to go out and buy commercial stove tops for $1,600 instead... and that's just the tip of the iceberg... Handicap bathrooms installations, gas leak sensors, automatic gas shutoff valves, we had to replace a sprinkler head per the Fire Dept.... that was fun... had to have a licensed electrician come in to shut down the fire alarm system (that's a permit) since the "fire sprinkler guy" didn't have that license... then the fire sprinkler guy had to drain the entire building's system (another permit)... twist off the old head, twist on the new head... refill the system... oh... then you have to have the FIre Dept come by and test the system to make sure it is all working.

Building Inspector
Plumbing Inspector
Fire Dept.
Don't forget the Board of Health...

They all have to sign off on everything..

THEN... then you can brew.

That doesn't include any marketing, distribution, accounting (the taxes are a nightmare) etc... . or a BBQ restaurant on top of that.
 
I only scrolled back a couple of pages... NO idea what it will be in your area but the OSD you have on the walls won't fly remotely in our area due to the codes... we needed 5/8s fire-rated sheet rock, floor to ceiling, anywhere that was going to be remotely close to the burners. We couldn't have any "wood" any where near the open flames of the burners.

Again... I have no idea what your local codes are going to require but I would recommend getting a REALLY strong handle on all of that before moving forward with anything else. The last thing you want to do is spend time and money putting something together only to find out you're going to have to rip it all down and start all over.

And sorry... one last thing because I think I saw someone kinda of say this... at least in our area here in SE Mass... there is no, "plead ignorance and ask for forgiveness" to this sort of stuff if you happen to skip over a code or something. All of the different folks (building inspector, plumbing, etc. etc) all have to sign off on an Occupancy Permit which is your final "permission to officially open" document and if you don't have that, they simply come in and shut you down. You can re-open once you then get that Occupancy Permit, which... requires all of those people to then sign off so it's not a matter of simply paying a $100 fine and then chugging right along. You're out of business until you're 100% up to snuff.... on top of any fines they want to deal you.
 
I thank you very much for the info and if you would PM me your email I would like to ask some more specific questions get some more info from you.

I knew the licensing would be a PITA. I have never intended to make any permanent modifications to where I plan to brew until I had all my ducks in a row on the licensing and permits ect. I am not borrowing any money I am doing things as I have the time and money to do them I am in no rush so I will be sure to do things according to the rules and regs.

I did start a Cafe' from scratch at my previous job so I am aware of the hoops you need to jump through tho it seems a brewery is a different animal (more complex)

I have to ask what savings of time and money do you think it might have made if you had not had any open flames and had gone all electric?
 
Just drop me a PM whenever you would like...

I can't give too much of an opinion on the electric question... I've never brewed on an electric rig but, and I am simply guessing here, I would think that might be just as big a pain given you're dealing with some fairly significant electricity there. That's something the inspectors would go through with a fine toothed comb, including wanting to see the license of the electrician that put it all together... including the permit they pulled to do so. Sure, they probably don't need a permit to build it... but to plug it in and run it, you probably would.
 
I PM'd you a response I got from the TTB concerning clarification on the brewery location issue.
 
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