Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > DIY Projects > Explosive decompression!!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 07-23-2010, 09:57 PM   #21
kladue
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Turner, Oregon, Oregon most of the time now
Posts: 2,306
Liked 47 Times on 43 Posts

Default

With a fairly simple steam mixer you can heat liquid quietly with steam, if you want to do on demand steam the flash boiler is the way to go. I have an older system with a flash boiler and mixer that raises steam in about 50-60 seconds and can do the strike and sparge with water and gas flow adjustments. Not hard to build, one cup or less water in play at any time, and with SS coils it will withstand dry firing to orange hot and quenching with cold water.

__________________
kladue is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 09:59 PM   #22
soldstatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by orangehero View Post
I believe Kladue does inline steam injection also. He uses an instant steam boiler, though...more efficient if you can figure out how to do it. His system is extremely sophisticated, check it out for ideas.

Kladue's system

None of them use steam to boil the wort, and I think this also is due to inefficiency. Personally I prefer electric heating...cheaper, cleaner, and more efficient; just make sure you use ultra low density elements for the kettle.
That's crazy... I'm going to have to look into how to build an on demand boiler, not sure how to do that one. That would be flippin amazing though.

I am going to use electric heating elements. Definitely cheaper and cleaner and more efficient. I just want to use them to make steam so I can change the temp of my mash super fast and get a 10 gal batch boiling in no time. And use the steam for other things too. Sanitizing kegs etc would be amazing with steam. Plus I could use it to remove wall paper, steam my clothes to a wrinkle free awesomeness, and in general make me feel awesome.

Side note and not really related: did you know you can buy activated carbon from ebay for (farily) cheap? I'm going to use that to build an on demand filter for my garden hose with a high rate of flow. Water here is great for stouts etc, but if I wanna do a pils I don't want to have to count on a flippin brita pitcher lol

Guess I could just go buy a couple gallons of water from the store, but what's the fun in that.
__________________
soldstatic is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 10:02 PM   #23
soldstatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kladue View Post
With a fairly simple steam mixer you can heat liquid quietly with steam, if you want to do on demand steam the flash boiler is the way to go. I have an older system with a flash boiler and mixer that raises steam in about 50-60 seconds and can do the strike and sparge with water and gas flow adjustments. Not hard to build, one cup or less water in play at any time, and with SS coils it will withstand dry firing to orange hot and quenching with cold water.
Mr K i was just drooling over your brewery pr0n. Do you have any guidance you can lend me on howh to build a flash boiler / mixer? I love the idea of less and less water in play. Less damage if the PRV were to fail lol.

Only catch is I want to do electric heating elements. Eventually I'm going to automate this rig with my old instruments and controls experience and electric elements would be so much more rad for automating.
__________________
soldstatic is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 10:20 PM   #24
kladue
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Turner, Oregon, Oregon most of the time now
Posts: 2,306
Liked 47 Times on 43 Posts

Default

Here is the old system http://picasaweb.google.com/kevin.ladue/SteamRimsBrewingEquipment# and a shot of the new system http://picasaweb.google.com/kevin.ladue/CoolingSystem#. Trying this with electricity will be a problem as the btu's needed will raise the kw requirements to levels not easily reachable with residential systems, the gas powered flash boiler is able to reach 30KW heating range. The new system is built around Opto 22 G1 series hardware and uses industry standard 4-20 Ma transmitters, RTD's, and J thermocouples. Gas flow is controlled with Mass flow controllers and a 0-5vdc signal, ignited by honeywell direct spark ignition modules. Hardware was assembled in about 3 months in 08, software is still ongoing as I have time on my hands while on the road away from home and come up with tweaks and features to incorporate.

__________________

Last edited by kladue; 07-23-2010 at 10:26 PM.
kladue is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 11:09 PM   #25
BrewBeemer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: an island, inside an atoll
Posts: 3,504
Liked 20 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Did you see the Mythbusters episode with the water heater blasting off thru their makeshift two story house? Add to this a heater out in the open that reached and altitude of 500' when the bottom blew off. A vast amount energy released during decompression. Use your boiler outside in an open field as I bet your homeowners policy will not build you a replacement house.

__________________

Last edited by BrewBeemer; 07-23-2010 at 11:19 PM.
BrewBeemer is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 11:12 PM   #26
soldstatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kladue View Post
Here is the old system http://picasaweb.google.com/kevin.ladue/SteamRimsBrewingEquipment# and a shot of the new system http://picasaweb.google.com/kevin.ladue/CoolingSystem#. Trying this with electricity will be a problem as the btu's needed will raise the kw requirements to levels not easily reachable with residential systems, the gas powered flash boiler is able to reach 30KW heating range. The new system is built around Opto 22 G1 series hardware and uses industry standard 4-20 Ma transmitters, RTD's, and J thermocouples. Gas flow is controlled with Mass flow controllers and a 0-5vdc signal, ignited by honeywell direct spark ignition modules. Hardware was assembled in about 3 months in 08, software is still ongoing as I have time on my hands while on the road away from home and come up with tweaks and features to incorporate.

Yea 30kW isn't very feasible unless I get a special tap from the utility co. Luckily I work for my utility company lol, so i'm going to look into that. But it probably isn't a very good option. Given that limitation I guess I'll have to steer clear of the flash boiler. Let me know if you have any more detailed information about your flash boiler, I'd be interested to learn what you did!
__________________
soldstatic is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 11:22 PM   #27
soldstatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrewBeemer View Post
Did you see the Mythbusters episode with the water heater blasting off thru their makeshift two story house? Add to this a heater out in the open that reached and altitude of 500' when the bottom blew off. A vast amount energy released during decompression. Use your boiler outside in an open field as I bet your homeowners policy will not build you a replacement house.
Yea I've seen a ton of those videos! There are a couple about power plants and stuff, those are even crazier. But the reason they explode is the reason I want it!

Steam heat! I want steam heat!
__________________
soldstatic is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 11:24 PM   #28
kladue
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Turner, Oregon, Oregon most of the time now
Posts: 2,306
Liked 47 Times on 43 Posts

Default

Here is a picture of the old boiler http://picasaweb.google.com/kevin.ladue/InstantWaterHeater#5018859442542030754 4 10' coils wound around 2" pipe and connected to swagelok cross fittings top and bottom. Heated with a 6" cast burner on high pressure propane, water and gas flow controlled with needle valve and water flow monitored with flow meter. Here is the steam mixer http://picasaweb.google.com/kevin.ladue/NewSystemSteamMixer#5156297767550785986 SS screen wire rolled over 1/8" rod and silver soldered to 1/4" tube. Steam and water inside the screen, wort over the outside, with a sizzling sound like frying bacon at high steam injection rate.
Check GreenMonti's threads on flash boilers for detailed pictures of a copper tube boiler, the one I built with 100' of tubing was overkill and did not perform like expected, 50' is probably the right length.

__________________
kladue is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 11:39 PM   #29
triethylborane
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: denver
Posts: 131
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by orangehero View Post
Personally I prefer electric heating...cheaper, cleaner, and more efficient; just make sure you use ultra low density elements for the kettle.
Electric is generally more expensive than NG or Propane. Gas used to be wayyy cheaper, but electric is still more expensive than gas even considering inefficiency.
__________________
triethylborane is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-23-2010, 11:48 PM   #30
orangehero
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northeast
Posts: 842
Liked 102 Times on 53 Posts
Likes Given: 178

Default

Do you have a close-up of that steam injector?

Also how does the solder hold up after repeated use?

Quote:
Originally Posted by triethylborane View Post
Electric is generally more expensive than NG or Propane. Gas used to be wayyy cheaper, but electric is still more expensive than gas even considering inefficiency.
Well let's see...how much do you pay for a refill and how many brews do you get out a 20lb propane tank?

Electric vs. Propane
__________________

Last edited by orangehero; 07-23-2010 at 11:58 PM.
orangehero is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools