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Old 07-24-2011, 06:49 PM   #1
flatulentfox
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Default Designing an eKeggle BIAB recirculating system, input?

So, I have been extract brewing for about six months, maybe 12 five gallon batches to date. Most have been pretty decent.

Any way, I have been wanting to get into all grain, and am trying to get a design nailed down so i can start collecting parts over the next few months and get something put together.

My first thought is this:

Single vessel, e-keggle recirculating BIAB. PID control to maintain mash temps. Either recirculate and drain to a bucket (for clarity, to use grain bed as filter) or if i can get clear enough beer, just lift out "bag" as in a standard BIAB system. As for the "bag", I am thinking a SS mesh bucket made (or modified form an off the shelf product if I can find something similar) to fit just inside the Keggle. Also, I plan on cutting off the entire top skirt of the keg, not just a smaller hole in the top of it. This will allow better access into the keg, and allow me to build a mesh bucket that will fill up the entire interior of the keg without much dead space, for a more efficient mash.

I am also considering a two vessel system similar to jkarps counter top brutus 20 system. I would use two kegs, and circulate during mash as needed to maintain temps.


A few specific questions.

In either system, I will be circulating constantly during the mash. Should the temp probe for the PID be in the output of the ball valve of the keggle, or would it be better off in the middle of the keg wall, like the placement of analog thermometer in most keggle builds? If i were to place it in the output of the keg I would not have a probe sticking into the interior space of the keggle, which might interfere with BIAB hardware.

Also, I'm trying to decide where to put the output valve. I am considering a bottom drain valve. I understand I can use a 2" tri-clamp to connect directly to the tap present on a sankey keg. I would cut off the bottom of the keg, connect a valve to the bottom of the keg. The question then is a hop screen. I would like to use a pump to whirlpool diring chilling (i plan on continuing to use my IC). If I cannot effectivley filter out hops and trub, i fear clogging the pump.

A bottom drain would be simple and would not require a diptube, but seems like it might create more problems than it solves. Am I better off with a standard valve setup? I would use a 1.5" triclamp fitting on the keg, and use a three piece TC ball valve, and weld the dip tube straight to the flange on the ball valve, this way it would fit through the 1.5" opening and be easily removable for cleaning. I want every piece of hardware that attaches directly to the keggle to be easily removed for cleaning.


Ideas? Comments? Suggestions?

Thanks!

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Old 07-24-2011, 07:19 PM   #2
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I love my bottom drain. I welded a 2" tri clover pipe to the bottom of the keg, as i had already cut the top off. mine was designed to accept a motorized mash mixer (up through the center) that I have not yet completed. I wish I had done it on all my kettles


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Old 07-24-2011, 08:09 PM   #3
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Do you have a bottom drain on your brew kettle? I so, do you use a hop spider/bag? My original plan was to whirlpool using a pump while chilling, then after everything had settled dump hops/cold break/trub as one would dump yeast with a conical through the bottom valve, then drain the rest to a fermentor.

Then I realized that my plan would not work bc recirculating with a pump through the bottom valve would a) not allow a pile to form directly above the valve and b) I would likely clog the pump.

I currently use a PVC and paint strainer hop spider. I would like to get away from using a hop spider or bags if possible. One less thing to keep clean, store, etc.

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Old 07-24-2011, 10:37 PM   #4
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Subscribed!

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Old 07-25-2011, 03:17 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flatulentfox View Post
Do you have a bottom drain on your brew kettle? I so, do you use a hop spider/bag? My original plan was to whirlpool using a pump while chilling, then after everything had settled dump hops/cold break/trub as one would dump yeast with a conical through the bottom valve, then drain the rest to a fermentor.

Then I realized that my plan would not work bc recirculating with a pump through the bottom valve would a) not allow a pile to form directly above the valve and b) I would likely clog the pump.

I currently use a PVC and paint strainer hop spider. I would like to get away from using a hop spider or bags if possible. One less thing to keep clean, store, etc.

I also want to whirlpool, but the MT is the only bottom drain. The dip tubes in the BK 's will still create an impressive whirlpool. I am thinking of adding a valve at my sight glass port, with a short side dip tube (for collection of wort).

I also dislike hop spider bags. I would prefer to just throw $hit in and whirlpool and or filter later.

I have this filter canister that I plan to add 3 filters. of different sizes to get rid of cold break and hop particles. Post whirlpool.



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Old 07-25-2011, 03:29 AM   #6
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You might also consider a BIAB vessel plus a flash boiler/ SIRMS system for steps and strike/sparge water. I have never brewed on anything else but I cant imagine anything else could compare.

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Old 07-25-2011, 01:14 PM   #7
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Did you read my thread? I love my single vessel e-BIAB.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/40-...e-biab-252920/

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Old 07-25-2011, 04:32 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by howabouttheiris
Did you read my thread? I love my single vessel e-BIAB.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/40-...e-biab-252920/
I hadn't seen it yet. Thanks for the link. I will probably have some questions for you once I get deeper into planning it all.
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:23 AM   #9
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Default I'm back.

Been thinking reading and planning much over the past few months. I think I have finally settled on a specific plan.

Two vessel system similar to jkarps. One pump and gravity feed between the two vessels, probably mash tun up top. This is how I plan to use it.

Fill mash tun with strike water, circulate and use RIMS to bring to to strike temp (unless this takes too long, more about this later). Dough in, recirculate as necessary to maintain temps, step, and for the last bit of mash for clarity. Sparge water will be in kettle/HLT. At this point recirculate through entire system until gravity is consistent through out system (20 mins?). The fill kettle, boil. Cooling, I will probably build a couterflow, probably use my existing IC for a while.


Both vessels will be sankeys with the bottom cut out. The kettle will have a traditional diptube and hop blocker, and weldless fittings for now. I wanted to use all tri clamps, but just dont have the budget now... I will use a ULD element. There will be weldless T on the side, with a temp probe and sight glass.

The MT will be a inverted keg, with a false bottom and bottom drain. I will have a 2" x 1" TC tee. I will have the element inserted in the bottom of tee attached to a 2" TC cap. The 1" out of the tee will be connected to an instrument tee with a thermowell. Out of that will be a TC valve, then to a barb fitting and hose from there. Make sense?

Rims element: I will probably use a SS 240V HD element (4500W???) and have it switchable between 120V and 240V. I would use it in 240V mode to reach strike temp, then use is in 120V mode whenever wort is involved. I could also see myself (well, SWMBO really) experimenting with sous vide cooking as well, so perhaps use it in 240V mode there as well.

I will try to get a pic up soon.

The control panel will be built into a Pelican case that I have, with a panel insert. I will have two PIDs and big knob controlling a PWM. Two SSRs and element outputs, one switchable between SSR control and PWM. I know the PIDs have manual mode, but I would prefer the ergonomics of a big old fashioned knob for controlling the boil. Rims element SSR will be switched by the pump switch somehow, so it will be impossible to run the RIMS element without the pump running. Of course the valve on the pump could sill be closed, but one less thing to accidentally screw up...

I will probably be doing this is stages. I have way to many expensive hobbies to split my money between. I just got a Jeep, and there is lots of stuff i want to buy for that....

I will be getting a pump soon and incorporate that. Then get the control panel done. Then get the boil kettle up and running, still using cooler mash tun. You get the idea.

Thoughts? Concerns?

photo.jpg  
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:35 AM   #10
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Also, I plan on using these fitting where applicable:

https://www.brewershardware.com/Weldless-Fittings/

The price (while not cheap) is reasonable. I shouldn't need more than a few...

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