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Old 01-11-2012, 04:31 AM   #11
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You'll be fine with the 8" burner on the mash. The grain will retain enough heat that you won't need insulation. Burner automation will keep the wort from scorching, it only fires for short periods and should never get to the scorching point, especially running at .5 psi.
On that size kettle you will want to measure the mash temp inside the kettle as well. Ultimately, it's the grain temperature that needs to be managed, not the wort itself. (which you probably already know)
What size pump ports are you using? What are the dimensions of your kettles?
I would LOVE to build something this size.

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Old 01-11-2012, 04:43 AM   #12
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An up and coming microbrew in san diego county uses RIMS for 40 bbl. Surprised the heck out of me but i'll post a pic as soon as i can find it.
that would be truly cool! I'm wondering if it's the original rims though, with the heat tube. My business partner would definitely be interested in that, as she is from San Diego.
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Old 01-11-2012, 04:57 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by OneHoppyGuy View Post
You'll be fine with the 8" burner on the mash. The grain will retain enough heat that you won't need insulation. Burner automation will keep the wort from scorching, it only fires for short periods and should never get to the scorching point, especially running at .5 psi.
On that size kettle you will want to measure the mash temp inside the kettle as well. Ultimately, it's the grain temperature that needs to be managed, not the wort itself. (which you probably already know)
What size pump ports are you using? What are the dimensions of your kettles?
I would LOVE to build something this size.
the pumps are March Home Brewing AC-5SSB-MD Magnetic Drive Pump 1" inlet, 1/2" outlet. Kettles are 24" diameter.

The thing is, is that when I talked to them, they said a low inlet pressure such as 0.5psi would actually give the full 200K btu.
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Old 01-11-2012, 08:53 AM   #14
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Dedhed, what brewery in GA do you work with? I lived in Athens for several years and was very active in the beer community up there

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Old 01-11-2012, 10:21 AM   #15
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I run a direct fire 1.5 BBL system with jet burners, but infusion mash and recirculated herms style. I have (2) 32 tip jet burners(275K) under the BK and HLT , and a 75K 8 tip under the MT. The mash never scorches in my experience because of the false bottom and the constant recirculation, the MT is also uninsulated and I find that temps hold pretty nicely( remembering that most starch conversion takes place in the first 1/2 hour). That said, I don't use a pilot light, and the Honeywell option needs to be carefully considered, with the .5 PSI rating. It's been debated enough, and I don't talk about it anymore, but I have had much success with a 0-30 psi regulator as an option to plugging jets.

When running this size system, I would recommend a 100lb LP tank because of freezing, and indeed, this is not the most economical way to make beer, but it works. I built my system for a movie I am making, so the application is slightly different, but you get the idea.
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Old 01-11-2012, 01:14 PM   #16
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Rtockst

I'm starting to think... damn... should have went all electric.

I think you still should go electric. If you are home brewing 1-2 times per month then energy cost is not a big concern. But you said you were going for a license so I guess profit is some of your thinking.

Crunch the numbers any way you want and you will find electric cheaper for production. Instillation cost could still force you back to propane. We run a 1bb electric system on 50 amps. 55 gallon Blichmann kettle for all heating with single infusion mash. KISS it

We use Rubbermaid MT and HLT which cuts down on heat loss and with up to 165 lb of grain we loose only 5 degrees in 60 min.

What are you using for fermentation?

We run 6 42 gallon Blichmann

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Old 01-11-2012, 03:33 PM   #17
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I built a 1BBL system almost exactly as you described. I use 200K BTU jet burners with Honeywell electronic ignition and Auber Instruments PID's. The control panel is a gas modification of the panel featured at The Electric Brewery. I have 35 gal Blichmann Boilermaker's for the MLT and HLT with a 55 gal for the Boil Kettle. To heat water faster I just plumbed a hot water supply line from my home hot water heater. It only takes around 30 minutes to heat the 125 degree hot water to 155-170 degrees. To "soften" the direct fired MLT, I raised the MLT off of the frame 3 inches to reduce the heat. I have had no scorching problems after 4 batches. In addition I can heat the 150-165 wort to boil in my kettle in around 40-50 minutes, but I ignite the burner early in the sparge cycle to expedite the process. Finally, I fuel the system with tandem 40lb LP tanks plumbed in series. After 4 batches the tanks are only about half to 2/3 empty. As far as electric is concerned, you would have issues as well as it would likely take 50 plus amps to feed the multiple 5-6K watt elements required to heat such volumes. I calculated the feasibility of going electric, and the heating times were very similar with common residential elements. I cant remember the specific amp requirements, but it was large. You would need industrial elements, and 230-440 service to really shorten the time. I have attached pictures of my build for your review.
Now, that is a nice setup. Is that a dumping mechanism on the mash tun? I wish I would have planned that into the frame build. Anyway, yes I looked into electric a bit ago also. You can do 2 of the 5500W ULWD elements in one kettle, but some posts I've seen make it sound like that would still take longer than necessary. My main concern, other than burner size, is just money and energy savings. I think I'd save money per batch using either a tankless water heater (rinnai 96, uses gas) or just using 2 or 3 5500W elements in the HLT instead of a burner. It may take an hour to heat that strike water up with electric, but it would be much cheaper, I believe.

Awesome system! Was the control panel very hard to wire?
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Old 01-11-2012, 03:39 PM   #18
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Rtockst

I'm starting to think... damn... should have went all electric.

I think you still should go electric. If you are home brewing 1-2 times per month then energy cost is not a big concern. But you said you were going for a license so I guess profit is some of your thinking.

Crunch the numbers any way you want and you will find electric cheaper for production. Instillation cost could still force you back to propane. We run a 1bb electric system on 50 amps. 55 gallon Blichmann kettle for all heating with single infusion mass. KISS it

We use Rubbermaid MT and HLT which cuts down on heat loss and with up to 165 lb of grain we loose only 5 degrees in 60 min.

What are you using for fermentation?

We run 6 42 gallon Blichmann
Yes, I'd like to make parts of it electric, such as the boil and the hlt. But, we're trying to get our fed paperwork sent in the next week or so, and they require you to list all of you energy usage (3 x 200K BTU burners, etc). If we can file an amendment after we get the license, then I might do that.

We're going to buy a few Stout brand conicals. Probably a few 55gals, and one or two 80 gal.

Can you give me a few more of your systems specs such as element wattage, how many elements, heating times and temps.

Thanks.
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Old 01-11-2012, 03:43 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by mrbowenz View Post
I run a direct fire 1.5 BBL system with jet burners, but infusion mash and recirculated herms style. I have (2) 32 tip jet burners(275K) under the BK and HLT , and a 75K 8 tip under the MT. The mash never scorches in my experience because of the false bottom and the constant recirculation, the MT is also uninsulated and I find that temps hold pretty nicely( remembering that most starch conversion takes place in the first 1/2 hour). That said, I don't use a pilot light, and the Honeywell option needs to be carefully considered, with the .5 PSI rating. It's been debated enough, and I don't talk about it anymore, but I have had much success with a 0-30 psi regulator as an option to plugging jets.

When running this size system, I would recommend a 100lb LP tank because of freezing, and indeed, this is not the most economical way to make beer, but it works. I built my system for a movie I am making, so the application is slightly different, but you get the idea.
Arctic Brewery and Mobile Fermentation Trailer
I dig your mobile system. I can't imagine how much work it took to build it all.

Do you find with your adjustable regulator, that if you take the pressure too low, it won't burn cleanly? I figure there is some adjustability of it, but would think there are limits since you can't adjust air intake.
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Old 01-11-2012, 03:47 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by thelorax121
Off topic:

Dedhed, what brewery in GA do you work with? I lived in Athens for several years and was very active in the beer community up there
I'm a brewer at SweetWater Brewing Company...
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