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-   -   Why is it when I listen to Jamil and John, they seem to say... (http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/why-when-i-listen-jamil-john-they-seem-say-171224/)

tamoore 04-01-2010 09:23 AM

Why is it when I listen to Jamil and John, they seem to say...
 
....That they can go from brew day to finished beer (with kegging) in like 10 days, but when I come here, you guys say that it's a month or two before it's 'done'?

I just listened to a Brew Strong episode, where Jamil made it sound like he has brewed some of the 'Can You Brew It?' beer rather quickly. Like, 4-5 days of primary fermentation, 2 or 3 days after to clean up, and then it's done.

What am I missing, and why the large disparity of opinions on the topic?

How long do the general microbreweries age their beer? It would seem to me that they don't have the resources to keep stuff in holding tanks for a month or two, and I bet they're motivated to get it down the road as soon as it is possible.

What say you?

GNBrews 04-01-2010 09:39 AM

It really depends on the style of beer. Wheat beers are pretty quick to the glass. I spoke with the head brewer at Summit a few weeks back, and he said ~14 days for most of their beers.

skiwithg 04-01-2010 10:41 AM

If you leave it in the fermenter for 7 days, you can transfer to a keg, force carbonate with 30 PSI and shake the living hell out of it and be drinking in a week. That's not to say that you're drinking the beer at it's peak of flavor, just that you're drinking it fast.

Cheers,
Glenn

tamoore 04-01-2010 11:36 AM

Thanks for the info, guys.


Glenn,
Jamil is winning awards with his beer. Do you suppose he's just taking the piss when he says that he brews these things in a week to 10 days? Or, do you think his ribbon winning beers would be substantially better after a month? Is he just trying to keep his award winning secrets to himself in order to maintain competitive advantage?

I'm seriously puzzled by the whole thing.

jkarp 04-01-2010 11:46 AM

As you listen to Jamil's shows more, you'll find he doesn't do competitions anymore and when he did, he'd normally just go to his beer fridge, pull something (often brewed LONG LONG ago) and submit it. So yes, he knows about aging.

Also, the schedule of CYBI pretty much requires they drink the beer green to keep up and they very often mention that the beer tastes "young" and will be better with age.

No real mystery in my opinion.

ezerhoden 04-01-2010 11:50 AM

If you aerate well, pitch enough yeast, and have stable fermentation temperatures in the yeasts range then you can keg in 10 days. Depending on the beer, something like a simple pale ale, it will be ready to drink by the time it carbs. Something like a stout with roasted malts, black patent, etc will probably take a few more weeks to blend.

tamoore 04-01-2010 11:53 AM

That sheds some light on it. Thanks.

wyzazz 04-01-2010 11:55 AM

Have a read here it's a long read but well worth it. If you start to use fining agents, filter, keg, brew simple beers, cold crash, pitch the proper amounts of yeast, etc... ...you can have a pretty quick turn around time on your beers.

ajwillys 04-01-2010 12:04 PM

This is one of the issues that I think about all the time. I just can't believe that serious craft brewers (and famous homebrewers such as JZ) are knowingly putting out an inferior product that they know will be better in a month.

With that in mind, and through my own trials, I have come up with the following things that reduce the aging time required. I have no scientific fact, just my observations. Here they are:

1) Having the proper amount of properly prepared yeast.
2) Maintaining precise temperature control over the fermentation.
3) Cold crashing (really cold and for awhile)

I've found that the first two points seem to drastically improve that first sample (for FG readings) and make it much closer to a finished beer. The third really seems to clarify and 'drop out' anything that I know I don't want (and will drop out eventually anyway).

For a Kolsch I did recently, I did 6 days in primary fermentation after pitching a healthy amount of yeast. Then, I dropped it to 32 degrees for another week. After that, I kegged it and let it carb. It was probably a total of 3 weeks from grain to glass, but it was certainly not green in the least bit.

EDIT: Good link wyzazz.

Bobby_M 04-01-2010 01:08 PM

I guess I've listened to more of his shows because he's said many many times that he primaries for 4 weeks (when asked in general). Sure there are lighter beers that don't need all that.


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