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Old 09-12-2011, 03:06 AM   #1
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Default Scalded Dog IPA

I wanted to try something like a "Two Hearted Ale" clone.

I used ingredients I had on hand and borrowed from a recipe in a different thread (You wouldn't recognize it).

I wanted to mash at 165 deg. F, but had a difficult time keeping it in the mid 150's. I wanted to go at a higher temp to give it a little red character.

It will be beer.

Scalded Dog IPA

21.2 lbs 2 row malted
3.4 lb Cara Pils #1
3.4 lbs Caramel 15L Malt
2.0 oz Chinook @60 minutes
2.0 oz Cascade whole leaf dry @30 minutes
1.5 oz Cascade whole leaf dry @3 minutes

15 gallons water - yielded approximately 12.5 gallons wort.

Wort was left to cool on the back deck.


I'll post original gravity when I get a chance after it cools.

I tried my new Corona Mill. Ground it a tad too fine. I lost a bit of liquid to stuck sparge from what I can tell. I'll grind courser next time.

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Old 09-12-2011, 03:09 AM   #2
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This is the other thread. Im just going to go with only the S04. I'm working long days and I'm just going to take the easy route.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/s05-...d-clone-82699/

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Old 09-13-2011, 04:00 AM   #3
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I have a 1.060 O.G.

The wort tastes sweet and nicely hoppy.

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Old 09-13-2011, 08:08 AM   #4
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I'm curious why the high mash temp. I know you stated you wanted a deeper red color, but that could be easily achieved by adding a pound of higher L crystal and a 90 min boil. Typically mash outs are done at 165-168 because all enzyme conversation stops at those temps. What was your sparge temp?

Everything looks good except the high mash temp. I fear you may have extracted some unwanted proteins and tannins, and may end up with phenolic off flavors.

I would keep the recipe as is, but add 1 pound crystal at 70L, and drop your mash
temp down to 149-151. If it's not as deep a color as you desire then simply up the lovibond degrees in your crystal malt.

I might also suggest a wort chiller so you don't have to chill your wort on the back deck.

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Old 09-13-2011, 01:10 PM   #5
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Anything over about 160 will denature the enzymes required for conversion, so I wouldn't mash over 160.

I think you have WAY too much crystal malt already. 7 pounds of crystal malt in a 28 pound grain bill is about 4 pounds too much! It'll be nothing like Two-Hearted in my opinion.

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Old 09-13-2011, 03:07 PM   #6
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Isn't 72C (~162F) the very highest you'll ever want to go, in order to have Alpha-amylase convert some of the most stubborn starch?

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Old 09-13-2011, 04:38 PM   #7
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You will get some starch conversion at 162, but along with that you will start extracting a lot of tannins and proteins which can contribute to chill haze. According to jamiel zanchef and John Palmer, it is better to do a longer scarification rest at a lower temp with a 60-70 minute sparge than a high temp mash. This will also contribute to mouthfeel; a higher mashed wort will be thiner whereas a slower lower temp mash should yield better efficiency and a fuller mouthfeel. At 168 all enzyme conversation stops, and you are then just rinsing the extracted sugars from the malt. John palmer's book "how to brew" explains this well.

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Old 09-13-2011, 04:40 PM   #8
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Ah. I've had different resources suggest different things. For example, the Swedish brewing wiki (which is mostly written by a few people, to be fair) suggests 30 minutes at 62C and 30 minutes at 72C.

In the end I guess it depends on beer style.

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Old 09-13-2011, 07:42 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squirrelly View Post
This will also contribute to mouthfeel; a higher mashed wort will be thiner whereas a slower lower temp mash should yield better efficiency and a fuller mouthfeel. At 168 all enzyme conversation stops, and you are then just rinsing the extracted sugars from the malt. John palmer's book "how to brew" explains this well.
That's actually reversed- a lower temp mash should result in a thinner drier beer, while a higher temp mash will have a fuller mouthfeel and a higher FG.

That's because lower temperature mashes (131-150) favor beta amylase. A higher mash temp (154-164) favors alpha amylase, which will produce a "thicker" bodied beer.

You can mash up to 162 or so without worrying about tannin extraction, but you're getting close to the temperature when all of the enzymes will be denatured, so you really have to watch it! I'd suggest never going over 160 for a mash temp.
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Old 09-13-2011, 07:59 PM   #10
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Thanks yooper, I did have the temps and effects reversed. It's still early here, and I have not yet kick started my brain. As far as tannin extraction, the topic is discussed quite a bit on the BN, and getting up in the 160s to 170s is always deemed dangerous during your rests. When I first started competing in AHA and BJCP events a lot of the feedback I got on score sheets reflected too high mash temps resulting in phenols and tannin extractions. I was doughing in at 162 and sparging at 170. Since I've begun doing 70-90 minute scarification rests at 149-152 depending on style, I've received a lot more positive feedback. I also noticed that in jamil's book "brewing classic styles" most recipes call for mash temps of 148-152 with a 90 min rest and 90 min boil.

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