Happy HolidaySs Giveaway - Last Sponsor Giveaway of the Year!

Come Enter the BrewDeals/FastFerment Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Is this the result of a poor cold break?
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-12-2011, 02:48 AM   #1
Fishin-Jay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Fishin-Jay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Coeur d Alene, I-duh-ho
Posts: 234
Liked 18 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default Is this the result of a poor cold break?

I've been brewing about a year and a half now, and I've had a consistently off flavor noticeable in most of my beers. The best way I could describe it, is that it is a lingering aftertaste that is kind of a cross between wet cardboard (oxidation) and astringent (over sparge). It really doesn't match either "off flavor profile" perfectly, and it has been evident in early recipes when I was using extract.

What I am noticing is that I also taste this flavor in beers that don't clear very well. However, if I let the beer sit in the fridge for 3 or 4 months, the off flavor disappears and the beer clears. In fact, I'm drinking a pale ale right now that is 8 months old and tastes better than the beer did at 2 months. No weird aftertaste.

Considering the noticeable clearing I am seeing along with improved flavor, is this the result of not cooling my beer fast enough and relying on an extremely long cold conditioning to fix the problem?

I'm using a MoreBeer 25' immersion cooler, which takes 30+ minutes to get the beer down to 70 -75 degrees.

All recipes have been various pale ales with OGs around 1.050, some all grain, some PM, some extract, all with the same issue.

Ideas?

__________________

There's a thin line between fishing and standing on the shore swinging a stick around like an idiot...

Fishin-Jay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 03:19 AM   #2
theredben
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Langley, BC
Posts: 934
Liked 23 Times on 22 Posts
Likes Given: 9

Default

Have you tried using something like Irish Moss, Isinglass, or Whirlfloc?

These should help settle out some of the suspended solids. No idea if these will fix your issue, but worth a try.

__________________
theredben is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 02:35 PM   #3
Fishin-Jay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Fishin-Jay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Coeur d Alene, I-duh-ho
Posts: 234
Liked 18 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by theredben View Post
Have you tried using something like Irish Moss, Isinglass, or Whirlfloc?

These should help settle out some of the suspended solids. No idea if these will fix your issue, but worth a try.
I forgot to mention, I use whirlfloc in the last 15 minutes of every boil.
__________________

There's a thin line between fishing and standing on the shore swinging a stick around like an idiot...

Fishin-Jay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 02:47 PM   #4
broadbill
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Southern Maine
Posts: 3,402
Liked 320 Times on 224 Posts
Likes Given: 222

Default

I don't think your off-flavors are the result of a slow cooling/poor cold break. I'd say a 30 minute cool to 70-75F with an immersion chiller is pretty average, actually (from what I've read; I don't use one).

More details on your process would help, especially what is happening post-boil (since you have this flavor in all brewing methods, its probably not a feature specific to the process pre-boil since they are all different). How long and what temps are your fermenting at? Are you cold-crashing? How old are the beers where you notice this flavor? It sounds like it goes away with time, correct?

__________________
broadbill is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 03:07 PM   #5
edie
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: , The Great State of Oklahoma
Posts: 325
Default

hoping to hijack the thread for just a quick answer(s)

cold break = bringing down the temp of the wort after boil ?

cold crash = don't know

__________________
14th Street Brewing Company

PRIMARY
nada

SECONDARY
nada

ON TAP
#1 damn near dead guy
#2 lil pils
#3 daisy's dunkel
#4 cream of the crop

ON DECK
-still looking for a rye (an extract with a low hop profile)
edie is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 04:42 PM   #6
Fishin-Jay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Fishin-Jay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Coeur d Alene, I-duh-ho
Posts: 234
Liked 18 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by broadbill View Post
I don't think your off-flavors are the result of a slow cooling/poor cold break. I'd say a 30 minute cool to 70-75F with an immersion chiller is pretty average, actually (from what I've read; I don't use one).

More details on your process would help, especially what is happening post-boil (since you have this flavor in all brewing methods, its probably not a feature specific to the process pre-boil since they are all different). How long and what temps are your fermenting at? Are you cold-crashing? How old are the beers where you notice this flavor? It sounds like it goes away with time, correct?
  • About 5 minutes before flame out I add the sanitized chiller.
  • At flame out I start the chiller, with the lid on the pot, and chill to ~70-75 degrees in 30 minutes.
  • I Whirlpool and then wait 30 minutes before transferring to a Better Bottle.
  • Then I oxygenate for 3-5 minutes with O2 and a stone.
  • I pitch my whole starter (usually 1.5 liters), install the airlock and ferment in a water bath at ~66-68 degrees.
  • I use a fermometer to get the approximate temp and adjust the temp of the water bath to keep the fermometer reading between 66 and 68. The fermometer is stuck to the carboy above the water line to ensure it is reading carboy temp, not water bath temp.
  • I ferment for 2 - 3 weeks. 2 weeks in primary, then 1 week in secondary if I am dry hopping.
  • Before I bottle I move the fermenter to the kitchen counter and let it sit 4 - 6 hours before transfering to a bottling bucket. I add 4oz of corn sugar which I disolved in 1.5 cups of boiling water.
  • I store the bottled beer at 68 - 70 degrees for 2 weeks, then put them in the fridge for at least a week before I try one.

When I try the first one, it has the poor aftertaste. The longer they are in the fridge, the better they taste. Usually it has taken at least 6 weeks in the fridge to lose the bad aftertaste. Also, if I have beer that has been stored in the closet for a few months, it also needs 6 weeks in the fridge before it tastes right.

This whole situation has me considering giving up brewing since I can't seem to figure it out. Brewing is fun, but if I don't like my beer, it just isn't very satisfying.
__________________

There's a thin line between fishing and standing on the shore swinging a stick around like an idiot...

Fishin-Jay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 05:00 PM   #7
Hockeyhunter99
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Hockeyhunter99's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 603
Liked 5 Times on 5 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

start with a common thread between all of the beers. what is your water source? start with that, change your source and see if there is difference.

__________________

Beer Renaissance definition - transformation from a heavy beer drinker to drinking heavy beer

Keg - American Pale Ale

Primary - Chocolate Cascadian Dark Ale
Primary - ButterBeer

Hockeyhunter99 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 05:11 PM   #8
Fishin-Jay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Fishin-Jay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Coeur d Alene, I-duh-ho
Posts: 234
Liked 18 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeyhunter99 View Post
start with a common thread between all of the beers. what is your water source? start with that, change your source and see if there is difference.
I've been buying bottled spring water. So far I have used the Safeway brand, Albertson's brand, and Arrowhead.
Maybe next time I could try using distilled water and then add minerals?

Thinking along the lines of common threads between all of the brew sessions, I've been thinking about my equipment. I've been using StarSan to sanitize everything, but my equipment is the only common thread for every brew session.

It's been exasperating trying to figure out the cause of this aftertaste. I keep hoping somone will chime in that has had the same issue and figured out how to fix it. I feel like I'm flying solo on this problem.
__________________

There's a thin line between fishing and standing on the shore swinging a stick around like an idiot...

Fishin-Jay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 05:13 PM   #9
Fishin-Jay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Fishin-Jay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Coeur d Alene, I-duh-ho
Posts: 234
Liked 18 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default

One other thing that seems odd to me is that the problem is an aftertaste. The beer always smells fine and tastes fine when it hits my tongue. It's the taste that remains after I swallow that is bad. Nothing I'm reading tends to discuss how the brewing and fermenting process affect the beer's finish.

__________________

There's a thin line between fishing and standing on the shore swinging a stick around like an idiot...

Fishin-Jay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2011, 05:52 PM   #10
BrookdaleBrew
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 833
Liked 11 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

My question is, what kind of commercial beers do you normally drink? Are they the same kind of beers you're attempting to brew?

__________________
BrookdaleBrew is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cold Break/Hot Break Questions jalgayer Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 2 04-09-2010 04:29 PM
Hot/cold break kingoslo Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 11 10-21-2009 12:54 PM
Cold Break Help iXanadu Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 8 12-18-2008 05:46 PM
Cold and Hot break? Bytor1100 Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 10 07-28-2008 02:25 AM
cold break/ hot break joejaz Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 7 01-05-2008 04:25 PM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS