Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Primary Bucket - Ok for extended primary fermentation?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-02-2009, 04:45 AM   #1
GonzoIllini
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 38
Default Primary Bucket - Ok for extended primary fermentation?

I am a new homebrewer who just bottled my first batch this morning (Brewers Best American Micro Pale Ale). I bottled after 7 days and checking my hydrometer reading on 3 consecutive days and seeing no change. (OG 1.046 / F.G. 1.008). After extended browsing of this forum as well as Palmers online book and Papazians book i have a question that has been nagging at me.

The consensus on this site seems to be to leave your beer in your primary fermentation device even after primary fermentation is over. I understand the reasons behind this, but my question is can I also do this using a plastic bucket as my primary?

Papazian seems to label this as an "open" fermentation saying that the maximum amount of time in plastic buckets should be 10 days. However, i see that many of you are saying that for most beers we should skip the secondary fermenter (5 gallon glass carboy in my case) and simply let the beer sit in our primary fermenters for an extended period of time to allow it to clear.

So my question is... is it ok to let my beer do an extended fermentation in a plastic bucket? This is an "Ale Pail" primary with lid and an airlock. Thanks for your help!

Cheers!

__________________
GonzoIllini is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-02-2009, 04:57 AM   #2
llazy_llama
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
Posts: 2,885
Liked 65 Times on 27 Posts

Default

If your bucket has a lid and an airlock, there's no reason why you couldn't/shouldn't let it sit another week or so. If you aren't racking to secondary, you should really let it sit for a while. Personally, for a pale ale, I'd rack it to secondary after 2 weeks to really have a clear final product, but that's my personal 2 shillings.

Edited: Reread your post, and saw that you bottled after 7 days. Your beer should be just fine, just make sure to let it condition, and don't get greedy. Let her rest up, and your beer will be delicious.

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catt22 View Post
I would never use a dead mouse in my beer. It's much better to use live ones. You could probably just steep a dead one, but live ones must be mashed. Actually, smashed and mashed would be best.

Last edited by llazy_llama; 02-02-2009 at 05:00 AM.
llazy_llama is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-02-2009, 05:04 AM   #3
GonzoIllini
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 38
Default

Ok thanks for some quick input. Yea i probably should have let my beer sit longer, but i was following a hybrid of instructions from Palmer, Papazian, and the instructions from my brewers best kit.

Luckily my primary is now empty so as soon as i get back to the LHBS i can start my second batch.

Thanks and Cheers!

__________________
GonzoIllini is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-02-2009, 12:23 PM   #4
MajorTom
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 179
Default

With that low of an OG beer, you beer will turn out just fine. Maybe a little more sediment in the bottles than you would like though.

__________________
MajorTom is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-02-2009, 12:43 PM   #5
Revvy
Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Revvy's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: "Detroitish" Michigan
Posts: 40,804
Liked 2729 Times on 1637 Posts
Likes Given: 3485

Default

I leave my beers in primary for a month no matter what fermenter I use, and I use both buckets and carboys...

One thing to remember is that Papazian, as wonderful as it is, was written 30 years ago...and a lot of "science" or "common wisdom" that he as an author tapped into has evolved....all authors face this issue with their work.

His basic info is timeless....how to brew beer, figure out recipes, etc...but some of the info is just a reflection of the "opinions," or prevailing wisdom of the times, and may not even reflect his current beliefs...There's a podcast with Papazian from a year or so ago, where he talks about just having started using rice hulls in his mash ton...so if he doesn't update the book again, or write a new one, unless you've heard the podcast or read it on here, you won't KNOW about it.

Here's a good example John Palmer basically admits that what he wrote about IBU's in How to brew, was esentially "wrong" or at least outdated in light of new science...

Quote:
March 20, 2008 - What Is an IBU . . . Really?
John Palmer, author of How to Brew, shares information from a conference that challenged his concept of what defines an International Bitterness Unit (IBU).

http://media.libsyn.com/media/basicbrewing/bbr03-20-08ibu.mp3
I cite that podcast as an example of how the knowlegebase shifts so fast in this hobby because of places like this or podcasts...A book is a snapshot of the author's body of knowlege and the "common wisdom" at the time the author wrote the book, which may mean 3 years before it was even published. Papazian's book is 30+ years old. The basic knowlege is good, but brewing science and experience has progressed to where some things an author believes or says at that time may no-longer be valid...even to the author.

I mean I look at my own writings, including my E-book on spirituality, it was written back in 1999-2000, and a lot of my beliefs and ideas have shifted about things in the 8 years...

In that Podcast, Palmer basically contradicts in some was what he wrote in HTB...and I bet it will be reflected in his subsequent writings, but if he doesn't go back and revise HTB, and people don't read or listen to anything by him after, than they won't realize that the knowlegebase has already shifted...

In terms of long primaring, back then, yeah autolysis WAS the big fear at the time of Papazian, someone said this week it may have been a reflection of the oldier and crappier yeasts in the pre-prohibition days.....

Also what is of concern to commercial brewers of light lagers (by the way to lager means to store for a great length of time) or lager brewers in general doesn't necessarily apply to ales...or doesn't apply for a few weeks (or even a couple months of a healthy yeast cake.)

But things, like science, and even the yeasts themselves have changed, and we by our OWN experience have witnessed how much better our beer is when we've left it alone in primary for 2-4 weeks.

By the way a closed, sealed bucket, with an airlock is NOT an open fermentation vessel...an open fermentation would be a bucket without a lid, or a pie tin or towel on it like what was done before homebrewing was legalized in 1978...

Rememeber Papazian was writing his book from right around that time period, when yeasts cake in dry cakes and may not have even been stored properly, and many people just placed towles and cookie sheets on their ceramic crock pot fermenters.

It is podcasts and forums like this where you will find a lot more state of the art, or current views, and even scientific information...I mean if Jamil, John Palmer or Papazian even farts on a podcast, one of us beergeeks are going to start a thread on it within 10 minutes.

__________________

Like my snazzy new avatar? Get Sons of Zymurgy swag, here, and brew with the best.

Revvy's one of the cool reverends. He has a Harley and a t-shirt that says on the back "If you can read this, the bitch was Raptured. - Madman

I gotta tell ya, just between us girls, that Revvy is HOT. Very tall, gorgeous grey hair and a terrific smile. He's very good looking in person, with a charismatic personality... he drives like a ****ing maniac! - YooperBrew


Last edited by Revvy; 02-02-2009 at 03:23 PM.
Revvy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-03-2009, 05:52 AM   #6
GonzoIllini
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 38
Default

Revvy thanks for your reply, and honestly your threads on bottling and relaxing if you think you made a mistake have helped me out tremendously in my initial interest in this hobby. I found myself having "information overload" about what i should do to make my first batch the best it could possibly be. Before i started brewing i read Palmer's online book, Papazian's book, the book with my homebrewing kit, the directions for the brewers best kit, and this forum. Now that i have the basic process down and am more comfortable with my cleaning and sanitation procedures i feel that subsequent batches will only get better.

I was under the impression that Papazian updated his book every once in a while, and since i have the third edition the publishing page has 2003 listed as the time for the third edition. However, i completely understand and agree with your point about the rapid evolution of this hobby.

Thanks for the confirmation about my plastic bucket being a "closed" fermentation system, and now i feel much more comfortable leaving my beers in the primary for an extended period of time. People like Revvy have made this forum and hobby much more accessible to people like me who are just beginning in this hobby.

Cheers!

__________________
GonzoIllini is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-03-2009, 10:02 AM   #7
Revvy
Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Revvy's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: "Detroitish" Michigan
Posts: 40,804
Liked 2729 Times on 1637 Posts
Likes Given: 3485

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GonzoIllini View Post

I was under the impression that Papazian updated his book every once in a while, and since i have the third edition the publishing page has 2003 listed as the time for the third edition. However, i completely understand and agree with your point about the rapid evolution of this hobby.
Cheers!
Most of the time when someone "revises" a book they don't necessarilly "re-write" the entire thing...and unless they annotated the changes, often all a "revised" edition has to make it up to date is a new introduction, and maybe the addition or removal of some things. But Rarely is a revision in a book a serious comb through of the entire book. If an author plans to devote months to an extensive revision, they more than likely would just write a new book anyway.

And it's usually done for money or simply to get it back into the marketplace after a long lag..Sometimes a revised edition is simply a new cover or a different shaped book (like a trade paperback.) With a new intro and conclusion tagged on...

So there's really no way to know too much how updated the book was..I mean my copy is the 2002 edition iirc, and the photos are still pretty much have the look of bygone times.

__________________

Like my snazzy new avatar? Get Sons of Zymurgy swag, here, and brew with the best.

Revvy's one of the cool reverends. He has a Harley and a t-shirt that says on the back "If you can read this, the bitch was Raptured. - Madman

I gotta tell ya, just between us girls, that Revvy is HOT. Very tall, gorgeous grey hair and a terrific smile. He's very good looking in person, with a charismatic personality... he drives like a ****ing maniac! - YooperBrew

Revvy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-28-2010, 05:16 PM   #8
fat_al33
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 7
Default

I'm thinking of trying the long primary / no secondary method advocated by many on this blog. At the moment I'm using a bucket with a loosely fitting lid (no airlock) as my primary and a BB carboy as my secondary. Anyone think I'll run into trouble using my current bucket with loosely fitting lid for a long primary (3-4 weeks)?

__________________
fat_al33 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-29-2010, 03:23 AM   #9
Billy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 25
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fat_al33 View Post
I'm thinking of trying the long primary / no secondary method advocated by many on this blog. At the moment I'm using a bucket with a loosely fitting lid (no airlock) as my primary and a BB carboy as my secondary. Anyone think I'll run into trouble using my current bucket with loosely fitting lid for a long primary (3-4 weeks)?
I wouldn't recommend it. Personally I'd go get a stopper and air lock for the BB, should be able to pick them up for under $10 at your LHBS. I think you'll notice a marked improvement to the clarity by sticking with a primary for a month and no secondary, but the risk of infection leaving a loose lid and no air lock is something I wouldn't want to chance. I hate the idea of having to dump a batch due to infection and horrible off-flavors.
__________________
Billy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-29-2010, 04:07 AM   #10
eon
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Corvallis, OR, Oregon
Posts: 452
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

I leave all my beers in primary for 3 weeks, bottle for 2 weeks, then drink! works for me so far...

RDWHAHB!

__________________

You must brew the beer you want to see in this world.

eon is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Primary fermentation in a bucket instead of carboy ? PtotheL Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 15 02-24-2010 06:22 PM
extended time in primary slomo Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 4 06-04-2009 03:58 AM
Primary Fermentation Bucket Question jo7hs2 Cider Forum 0 08-26-2007 06:34 PM
Questions on bucket primary/secondary fermentation Poppy360 Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 19 05-16-2007 07:49 PM
Primary Fermentation in Bottling Bucket rjester Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 7 01-07-2007 09:33 PM