Get your HBT Growlers, Shirts and Membership before the Rush!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Ok first question of my brewing process
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-27-2012, 03:01 PM   #11
billl
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 1,984
Liked 286 Times on 241 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

You are going to have a heck of a time keeping a constant temp without some sort of insulation. Lots of us use old refrigerators or freezers. You put a heating element inside and then you can control heating or cooling with an external temperature controller.

A heating belt on a fermenter in an uninsulated shed probably isn't going to be able to maintain brewing temps when the ambient temps drop near freezing.

__________________
billl is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-27-2012, 03:13 PM   #12
stratslinger
Brewing Thespian
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
stratslinger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Terryville, CT
Posts: 1,986
Liked 137 Times on 115 Posts
Likes Given: 89

Default

+1 to what billl said - That shed, unless heavily insulated, is not going to stay warm at all in the winter.

That said, however you choose to proceed, do not arbitrarily attempt to keep your ambient temperature at 20C! For most ale yeasts, that's actually going to be too warm, and will lead to estery fermentations (you'll typically get some fruity flavors in your beers). Instead, pay attention to the yeasts you're using. Every yeast strain has a temperature range that it likes to ferment at. And every fermentation creates heat - so for the first few days of active fermentation, the fermenter will actually be 5-10 degrees warmer than the ambient temperature. So, if a given yeast, say S-04, likes temperatures around 18C, you'll want to keep the ambient temperature closer to 13C during the most active stages of fermentation, then raise it back up to 18C as fermentation starts to calm down. Better yet, if you have a temperature controller with a probe, just attach that probe to your fermenter and set the temperature to 18C, and just let the temperature controller do all the work for you! Keeping the temperature controlled like this will tend to help avoid those messy blow-offs too.

__________________
stratslinger is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-27-2012, 03:19 PM   #13
jakwhite
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 33
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by billl
You are going to have a heck of a time keeping a constant temp without some sort of insulation. Lots of us use old refrigerators or freezers. You put a heating element inside and then you can control heating or cooling with an external temperature controller.

A heating belt on a fermenter in an uninsulated shed probably isn't going to be able to maintain brewing temps when the ambient temps drop near freezing.
That's what I'm worried about, well I've been doing some research, I think I'm either going to go 1 of 2 ways,

1. Get the arc 1000 with a wall mounted heater and I already have an industrial heat lamp that is used to dry domestic dwellings after flood damage, so if I put that on a timer and set it to come on every hour for ten mins this should keep the chill off the shed then use the stc 1000 with a wall mounted heater to keep the shed above 18c, wich will kick in as a back up until the big rad kicks in again, and insulate as much of the shed as possible, it is only for 3 weeks of the fermenting process so the bill may not be too bad, aswell as insulating the shed as much as poss,

2, build a cupboard that will be well insulated with either the stc1000 or a heat belt / pad inside it,

I watched a vid of somebody using an old fridge with the heat pad in it with the stc1000 and the fridge plugged into the cooling side, I'm not sure if I can afford a fridge but think it may be worth having a look?
__________________
jakwhite is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 12:40 AM   #14
jakwhite
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 33
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stratslinger
+1 to what billl said - That shed, unless heavily insulated, is not going to stay warm at all in the winter.

That said, however you choose to proceed, do not arbitrarily attempt to keep your ambient temperature at 20C! For most ale yeasts, that's actually going to be too warm, and will lead to estery fermentations (you'll typically get some fruity flavors in your beers). Instead, pay attention to the yeasts you're using. Every yeast strain has a temperature range that it likes to ferment at. And every fermentation creates heat - so for the first few days of active fermentation, the fermenter will actually be 5-10 degrees warmer than the ambient temperature. So, if a given yeast, say S-04, likes temperatures around 18C, you'll want to keep the ambient temperature closer to 13C during the most active stages of fermentation, then raise it back up to 18C as fermentation starts to calm down. Better yet, if you have a temperature controller with a probe, just attach that probe to your fermenter and set the temperature to 18C, and just let the temperature controller do all the work for you! Keeping the temperature controlled like this will tend to help avoid those messy blow-offs too.
So for instance if I built a box with a door on, well insulated eg 0.5" kingspan (used to insulate roofs and walls) sat my fermentor on a head pad inside and set the temp to what you said to, would that be more reliable? It would be easier than trying to heat the entire shed, at least then with the probe inside the box the stc will have a rather specific reading and the boxing should maintain a constant temp?

Would you agree?
__________________
jakwhite is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 12:50 AM   #15
HopZombie99
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Auckland, NZ
Posts: 102
Liked 16 Times on 12 Posts
Likes Given: 65

Default

I put jackets and fleece vests on my fermenters when its cold. Just a few weeks ago, my fermenter was wearing a fleece vest and two jackets. You could also try sleeping bags or other things like that. Those with a heat pad underneath in the insulated box would be pretty good. It would take way less heat as well. Insulated box, covered with blankets, inside the fermenter on a heat pad wearing a couple jackets.... Your problem will be it getting too hot!

You could also sleep outside and cuddle it the whole night.

__________________
HopZombie99 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 01:14 AM   #16
jakwhite
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 33
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HopZombie99
I put jackets and fleece vests on my fermenters when its cold. Just a few weeks ago, my fermenter was wearing a fleece vest and two jackets. You could also try sleeping bags or other things like that. Those with a heat pad underneath in the insulated box would be pretty good. It would take way less heat as well. Insulated box, covered with blankets, inside the fermenter on a heat pad wearing a couple jackets.... Your problem will be it getting too hot!

You could also sleep outside and cuddle it the whole night.
Haha well my girlfriend moans I don't cuddle / give her enough attention, imagine the reaction when I'm cuddling my brew all night,

Well with the stc-1000 it shouldn't get too hot as it would cut the heat pad off when the box is upto temp, cut back in if it drops below 3 degrees what I set it to, so theoretically once it's upto say 18c the pad will turn off the box should if insulated well enough remain at 18 for a while then it will drop down to say 15c then kick back in until 18c is reached again

Like I said theoretically! I have seen a fridge for £20 it may be worth me looking at the sizes wether I can fit it into my shed, if it fits snug ill use that as the box then in the summer as a fridge for it still connected to the stc 1000 but obv with our summers I will rarely need it!!

If its too big I can't afford to re arrange the shed,

£20 on fridge £14 on an stc-1000 £4 on 2 sockets, £20 on a heat pad/ belt, the girlfriend will kill me with 3 weeks to Xmas!!

Wish I was in America where the weathers decent and the garages are big and a big freezer doesn't cost an arm and a leg to turn into a kegerator
__________________
jakwhite is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 10:34 AM   #17
jakwhite
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 33
Default

Ok just been to the shed to have a measure up, I have a 700mm gap under my counter, perfect for a fridge I'm waiting for a guy to get back to me if he still has his old fridge for £20 as I have just been to b&q (uks DIY store chain) and priced up. Some wood, insulated polystyrene, and 2x2 for framework and it came to £50 just for materials for a box that's without hinges and catches etc,

Quick question though, won't the fridge stink if I put it on heat?

Atleast this way the fridge is insulated and will keep the heat in, I can keep my 2nd phase barrel in it during the summer, and when I get really into it I'm 50% closer to making a keezer!

__________________
jakwhite is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 11:26 AM   #18
Odin_Brews
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: golden, CO
Posts: 265
Liked 19 Times on 18 Posts
Likes Given: 10

Default

I once saw a setup where he mounted a normal 75W light bulb in a metal paint can, hooked it up to a thermostat, and sat that on the floor of his fridge to heat the chamber up. Light makes can hot, radiates out from there. He claimed it could move the temp up a good 5 degrees in 30 minutes.

__________________
Odin_Brews is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 12:15 PM   #19
stratslinger
Brewing Thespian
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
stratslinger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Terryville, CT
Posts: 1,986
Liked 137 Times on 115 Posts
Likes Given: 89

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jakwhite View Post
Ok just been to the shed to have a measure up, I have a 700mm gap under my counter, perfect for a fridge I'm waiting for a guy to get back to me if he still has his old fridge for £20 as I have just been to b&q (uks DIY store chain) and priced up. Some wood, insulated polystyrene, and 2x2 for framework and it came to £50 just for materials for a box that's without hinges and catches etc,

Quick question though, won't the fridge stink if I put it on heat?

Atleast this way the fridge is insulated and will keep the heat in, I can keep my 2nd phase barrel in it during the summer, and when I get really into it I'm 50% closer to making a keezer!
So long as you give it a good, thorough cleaning before you do anything with it, why should a fridge heated to 18C or so stink? Make sure that, if it's an upright fridge, you've got room to place it in an upright position! Fridge compressors don't tend to like to work in any other position.

Also, what you described for the insulated box is fairly close to what I've got for my fermentation chamber, except I went with more insulation. It's framed out with 1x3's sideways (so there's a 1.5" frame depth) with 1.5" rigid insulation in the gaps between frame members, and then another layer of foil backed rigid insulation inside that, for a total of 3" of insulation. Possibly overkill in my basement, but for an outdoor space like you're describing, even inside a (probably drafty) old shed I wouldn't go any less (I think it comes to a total R value of 11, if I recall - maybe a touch lower).
__________________
stratslinger is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2012, 01:00 PM   #20
jakwhite
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 33
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stratslinger

So long as you give it a good, thorough cleaning before you do anything with it, why should a fridge heated to 18C or so stink? Make sure that, if it's an upright fridge, you've got room to place it in an upright position! Fridge compressors don't tend to like to work in any other position.

Also, what you described for the insulated box is fairly close to what I've got for my fermentation chamber, except I went with more insulation. It's framed out with 1x3's sideways (so there's a 1.5" frame depth) with 1.5" rigid insulation in the gaps between frame members, and then another layer of foil backed rigid insulation inside that, for a total of 3" of insulation. Possibly overkill in my basement, but for an outdoor space like you're describing, even inside a (probably drafty) old shed I wouldn't go any less (I think it comes to a total R value of 11, if I recall - maybe a touch lower).
Well I used to do house restoration fire & flood, 1 thing I was always taught was to tape the fridge shut to stop it opening as the smell is terrible and a few times a whiffed it myself, even when the fridge is empty it starts to smell, I may try and find a brand new one but with Christmas around the corner I'm not sure, I really wanted to get a brew on for the new year,

I've just changed jobs and I get back about 3 am this morning it was minus 4 I went into the shed and yes it was cold but not as cold as I thought it would be,

The fridge would be stood up correct, I'm going to try source I reasonably cheep one and probably get set up mid December,

I want to really get into brewing doing it from scratch like mashing etc
__________________
jakwhite is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Lambic brewing process aceparadis Lambic & Wild Brewing 4 07-14-2012 10:02 AM
Question About John Palmer's Brewing Process. LiquidFlame Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 4 03-29-2012 04:50 PM
Extract brewing process question tmurph6 Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 7 02-18-2011 01:53 PM
Brewing Process Question NortheasternPJ Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 5 10-10-2010 11:25 PM
My brewing process zaprozdower General Beer Discussion 6 02-15-2009 02:26 PM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS