No chill question

Hey guys and gals, I have a question about no chill brewing. I've read a lot into the methods of doing this. I've heard about just no chilling in the brew kettle then transferring to fermentation vessels. I have a 20 gallon kettle, so ill be doing about 7-10 gallons of brew. If I leave it in the kettle to chill overnight/24 hours, is this safe? And has anyone had experience with it? I have a nice fitting lid for the top to keep things out. I'd just rack the wort into two separate vessels. It's not that I cant afford a chiller because they are actually cheap, it's just the insane amount of water that would be wasted.

I can't help you with the no chill question since I haven't ever bothered with it, but if wasting water is your only draw back from using a chiller you could always recirculate the water through a ice bath with a pump instead of hooking it straight to a drain. Can save even more water by using the first gallon or two of hot water in a separate vessel to use for clean-up once your brew day is done.

What do you plan to ferment in? You could always split it up between 2 plastic buckets, transfer it into them and let it chill there over night.

Well I think dealing with a pump and chiller would be too much for me since I'm very new to brewing. Someday I will do what you have advised me, as I read a bit about it. For now I'll keep it simple as possible.

And was gonna use buckets to ferment in, so racking them in there to cool would make sense too, would i do the same by keeping the lid on? And keep it loose? I love the idea of racking into the vessels to cool and then just pitching the next day/night. Combined with BIAB I can save a ton of money on using minimal equipment, not to mention the time.

Thanks for your replies BTW, much appreciated!

I can't be 100% sure, but I thought I've seen something about hot-side aeration being an issue. Then again I also vaguely recall reading that it isn't as big as an issue for homebrewers. It could be another one of those secondary/don't secondary types of debates, but might be something to look into.

JakeSparrow said:

I'd just rack the wort into two separate vessels. It's not that I cant afford a chiller because they are actually cheap, it's just the insane amount of water that would be wasted.

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I've been doing a modified no-chill process for quite a while and have had no problem with it. We are in a drought-stressed area and excessive water use is a big deal here.

You definitely should chill the wort in the boil kettle. It works just fine. As long as you have a good tight-fitting lid, which you do, you should have no problems. I would NOT transfer the hot wort to fermenting vessels to chill. The problems with hot-side aeration aren't just a fake boogey-man.

Hot side aeration is a much debated topic. If you decide to transfer your wort out of the boil kettle while still hot, (and many of our friends down under do just that with great results) be sure and siphon or use a ball valve, if you siphon do not use an auto siphon because they will not hold up to high temperatures. (Haha ask me how I know!)

I see, well to avoid problems I'll just cool in the BK. I should probably whirlpool before transferring to the two buckets correct? Just talking about all of it makes me real itchy to start brewing already!

Wilserbrewer chills in the pot. I've tried it for my last couple brews, and had no problem. I put a couple pieces of sanitized aluminum foil over the pot, under the lid to make a better seal.

I know many no-chill people use an HDPE container to pour the hot wort into, but haven't found one that's just right yet.

Good info at biabrewer.com. You will have no probs cooling naturally overnight with a good lid but might be disappointed when it is sitting at 75 to 80 degrees the next day. Depends on where you live i guess .. maybe you yanks can get it cooler than that. Do you have a fridge that the kettle will fit in .. or can you do an ice bath in a utility sink the next am to get those last 5 or 10 degrees?

Good to know, the foil is a good idea. I'm surprised homebrew shops haven't jumped on making specialized no chill cubes specifically designed for hot wort storage. Perhaps once it catches on more here in the states. As I have no need to store the wort for longer than a day, the kettle shall work perfectly. :rockin:

soccerdad said:

Good info at biabrewer.com. You will have no probs cooling naturally overnight with a good lid but might be disappointed when it is sitting at 75 to 80 degrees the next day. Depends on where you live i guess .. maybe you yanks can get it cooler than that. Do you have a fridge that the kettle will fit in .. or can you do an ice bath in a utility sink the next am to get those last 5 or 10 degrees?

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I do have a freezer (no temp controller installed) if that would work. Just needs to be cleaned thoroughly. I live in southern California, it gets pretty chilly at night until summer starts.

Ten gallons is a lot to chill. Best use of thermodynamics is to get the wort into two kettles to chill overnight. The more area of wort touching the kettle walls the better it would chill. It takes a while to chill in a plastic buckets because the bucket is a better insulator than conductor. I would leave it in the kettle with the lid on and wrap the edge of the lid in foil just in case. Will cool much faster than in a bucket.

Why don't you brew high gravity and then dilute to fermentation strength. This would save water and the dilution water can act as a coolant, especially if you chill it. Sort of like the extract brewing process with a concentrated boil. Some high gravity beers you may not be able to pull this off.

TD


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I always drain my hot wort into my bucket to cool overnight, the heat helps to sanitize the bucket. In the hot months where I live it doesn't cool completely by morning, but a simple ice bath will take it from the 80s to the 60s in a few hours. I use frozen bottles in rotation, and leave the bucket in the ice bath for the first few days of fermentation.

sfgoat said:

Ten gallons is a lot to chill. Best use of thermodynamics is to get the wort into two kettles to chill overnight. The more area of wort touching the kettle walls the better it would chill. It takes a while to chill in a plastic buckets because the bucket is a better insulator than conductor. I would leave it in the kettle with the lid on and wrap the edge of the lid in foil just in case. Will cool much faster than in a bucket.

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This was also a concern of mine, it taking much longer because of the amount of wort cooling. Unfortunately I do not have 2 other smaller kettles, I was planning on buying a smaller kettle to do smaller batches when I wanted to. Do I risk infection by letting it cool for longer than 24 hours or however long it takes to cool?

TrickyDick said:

Why don't you brew high gravity and then dilute to fermentation strength. This would save water and the dilution water can act as a coolant, especially if you chill it. Sort of like the extract brewing process with a concentrated boil. Some high gravity beers you may not be able to pull this off.

TD


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This would be interesting. With 10 or so gallons of high gravity wort, wouldn't that mean either fermenting in two 13 gallon fermentors or four 7 gallon ones, with a total of about 20 gallons of brew? That's an awful lot of beer

I have been doing no chill all winter as I broke my outside faucet

I do 13 gallon boils for 11.5 gallon batches, I have been just leaving it in the boil kettle overnight

I use four binder clips on the lids after it has stop steaming a bit and let sit

I have had no problem with the 15 or so batches I have done over the winter and I have brewed recipes I have chilled with a chiller they taste the same

I am doing my last two no chill this week and then fixing my outside faucet

I have my water go into a 275 gallon water tank to save for my livestock, garden etc. as I have dug wells here and cannot waste water

all the best

S_M

brew_ny said:

I have been doing no chill all winter as I broke my outside faucet

I do 13 gallon boils for 11.5 gallon batches, I have been just leaving it in the boil kettle overnight

I use four binder clips on the lids after it has stop steaming a bit and let sit

I have had no problem with the 15 or so batches I have done over the winter and I have brewed recipes I have chilled with a chiller they taste the same

I am doing my last two no chill this week and then fixing my outside faucet

I have my water go into a 275 gallon water tank to save for my livestock, garden etc. as I have dug wells here and cannot waste water

all the best

S_M

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About how long did it take your wort to cool down to pitching temps?

JakeSparrow said:

This was also a concern of mine, it taking much longer because of the amount of wort cooling. Unfortunately I do not have 2 other smaller kettles, I was planning on buying a smaller kettle to do smaller batches when I wanted to. Do I risk infection by letting it cool for longer than 24 hours or however long it takes to cool?



This would be interesting. With 10 or so gallons of high gravity wort, wouldn't that mean either fermenting in two 13 gallon fermentors or four 7 gallon ones, with a total of about 20 gallons of brew? That's an awful lot of beer

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I wouldn't say you really risk infection more one way or the other. Just takes longer, but doing it all in one is fine.

Why don't you do the no chill cube method.

Find a HDPE water storage cube. Clean it and then put some starsan in it. Once you whirlpool, drain the near boiling wort into the cube. Squeeze out any excess air you can and then screw on the lid. Flip it upside down to sanitize the lid and make sure all the surfaces have come into contact with the hot wort.

Problem solved. It won't get infected and you can let cool down naturally without wasting water even if it takes a couple of days.


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JakeSparrow said:

About how long did it take your wort to cool down to pitching temps?

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if I was done by noon I would pitch the yeast first thing in the morning 7 or 8 o'clock

It will take longer now as it is warmer here so on Saturday I will let it sit overnight then put it in the freezer to finish to 62-63 degrees for US-05

all the best

S_M

What about DMS flavor? Extract?

TD


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TrickyDick said:

What about DMS flavor? Extract?

TD


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I do all grain I have never noticed it

S_M

I never noticed until I tried doing an all Pils brew with light hopping. I'd stay away from those styles if you can't chill.


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TrickyDick said:

I never noticed until I tried doing an all Pils brew with light hopping. I'd stay away from those styles if you can't chill.


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I have never used Pilsner but do a lot of SMaSH brews with two row, pale malt and vienna

I shot for 20-25 IBU with a 4 -5 SRM

did cream of three crops no chill a couple batches back to that were great

all the best

S_M

I'm drinking a blonde ale made with 2-row and golden promise as the only malt (recipe in my dropdown), 18 calculated IBUs. The color is almost identical to a Corona Light. No-chilled this in the kettle, lid went on as soon as the flame went out. Wrapped plastic wrap around the lid to seal and left it overnight. No DMS. I can't speak about using Pilsen, because I have not used it yet, but US 2-row and Golden Promise seem to be safe to use for no-chill. I've also used a full sack of Maris Otter since February, sometimes in very pale beers, and not run into issues.

There's an episode of Basic Brewing Radio that has a blind taste test part of a no chill experiment if anyone is interested.

estricklin said:

There's an episode of Basic Brewing Radio that has a blind taste test part of a no chill experiment if anyone is interested.

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Any chance you could post a link to this.

Nevermind, I found it.

http://www.basicbrewing.com/index.php?page=basic-brewing-brew-your-own-experiments

It is OK to cool in the kettle if you have a good lid and starsan the lid prior to popping it on the kettle. Pitch as soon as you can get to pitching temp... don't let it sit around longer than required. In my basement, it used to take me 16 hours to go from boil to pitching temp. The nice thing about no chill is that when you put the beer into your fermenter it has had 16 hours to settle out all the break and trub.

DMS is not an issue if you have a vigorous boil. If you have a lot of pilsner malt, boil for 90 mins, but it needs to be vigorous. I never had a problem with DMS in my no-chills. It is a great way to get into brewing on the cheap and easy. I no-chilled extract and all grain brews in the kettle for well over a year before moving on to a more elaborate set-up. Good luck! N_G