Happy HolidaySs Giveaway - Winners Re-Re-Re-Drawn - 24 hours to Claim!

Get your HBT Growlers, Shirts and Membership before the Rush!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Liguid Mal Exract Late Addition...why?
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-18-2008, 06:31 PM   #1
imaguitargod
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Local Mind Expander of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 1,046
Liked 9 Times on 8 Posts

Default Liguid Mal Exract Late Addition...why?

This has cropped up from time to time and I wanted to know why. Some recipies say to add (for example) 3lbs of dry malt extract and bring to a boil, then as a late addition add 3.75 lbs of liquid malt extract.

Is there some reason that this must be done? I try not to use liquid malt extract (don't quite know why) can I just substatue with dry malt extract and still do the late edition or can I even just skip the late edition and add it right before I boil. Is the late edition to compinsate for lost enzymes or something?

(side question, what's a good "roiling boil" temp? 190 degrees?)

__________________

Brewer for Hoppin' Frog Brewery.
"I am not an alcoholic, I’m a drunk. An alcoholic means that I have a problem and when I drink all my problems go away."

imaguitargod is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 06:42 PM   #2
dontman
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 2,430
Liked 25 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

In Cleveland a rolling boil is 212+, cranked to the gills and guns blazing. You want as hard a boil as you get to really agitate that wort, break down the proteins and assimilate those alpha acids.

Late addition on Dry or Liquid reduces the caramelization than can occur with extracts. This minimizes the off flavors associated with that.

Yes you can sub Dry for liquid but you want to compensate for the for the different water content by reducing the Dry by ~20%. The only reason not to do this is the expense.

__________________
On Tap: 1. Kelly R. IPA, 2. Roter Hund Hefeweizen, 3. Bud Killer Blonde, 4. Red Dog Pale, 5. Roter Hund Oktoberfest, 6. Pumpkin Ale, 7. McRed's Stout (with new nitro system and stout tap,) Cream Soda, 8. ESB # 3, & 9. Ordinary Bitter.

dontman is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 07:27 PM   #3
Saccharomyces
Be good to your yeast...
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Saccharomyces's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Pflugerville, Texas
Posts: 5,444
Liked 85 Times on 54 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Less carmelization of the wort and improved hop utilization. If you do a late extract addition, your hop utilization is about the same as if you did a full volume boil, so you save 20-30% on bittering hops.

__________________
[How to Calculate Mash Efficiency | Do I Need a Yeast Starter? | My Ghetto Fermentation Chamber | Twitter | 6 Gal. HDPE Fermenters | Slanting Yeast | No Sparge Brewing]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soperbrew
big brother only monitors facebook and untappd
Saccharomyces is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 07:29 PM   #4
HOOTER
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 1,854
Liked 10 Times on 8 Posts

Default

It's mainly to lighten the color. I've also noticed that heavily caramelized extract changes the flavor of the beer a bit. Just remember to remove the pot from heat when adding LME to avoid scorching.

__________________
Primary:
Secondary:
Bottled: Lots of stuff
On tap: Hefeweizen, Centennial Blonde
Up next: Quality Beverages

Quote:
Originally Posted by Homercidal View Post
Shorts Would Make Boners Obvious
HOOTER is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 07:40 PM   #5
Eves
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 380
Liked 3 Times on 3 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saccharomyces View Post
Less carmelization of the wort and improved hop utilization. If you do a late extract addition, your hop utilization is about the same as if you did a full volume boil, so you save 20-30% on bittering hops.

Wait, you're saying if I am only boiling 2-3 gallons but just add the LME late then I'll get a higher IBU out of the bittering hops? Is that for real? Does adding DME late make a difference in terms of IBUs?
__________________
Eves is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 07:46 PM   #6
JamjaPA
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

im as new as it gets around here, so im not being a jerk, but if you search late extract addition, a ton of threads will pop up completely explaining everything about the procedure. and dme and lme are the same except 2.75lbs dme = 3.3lbs lme... people seem like like dme more because of less 'twang' and its doesnt have a tendency to carmalize as much....please correct me if i am wrong anybody

__________________
JamjaPA is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 07:52 PM   #7
mawa
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Monterrey, Mexico
Posts: 80
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Quote:
Wait, you're saying if I am only boiling 2-3 gallons but just add the LME late then I'll get a higher IBU out of the bittering hops? Is that for real? Does adding DME late make a difference in terms of IBUs?
Yep, and I say this from experience. In two partial mashes I did a while ago, I tried the late extract addition method but did not change the hop schedule. The beers were more bitter that they should've been. In my las batch i did alter the hop schedule with the help of beersmith and the bitterness of that beer was just right!

If you haven't download beersmith, do it, it takes the late extract addition into account when formulating recipes.
__________________
mawa is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 07:52 PM   #8
flyangler18
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Hanover, PA
Posts: 5,679
Liked 30 Times on 29 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eves View Post
Wait, you're saying if I am only boiling 2-3 gallons but just add the LME late then I'll get a higher IBU out of the bittering hops? Is that for real? Does adding DME late make a difference in terms of IBUs?
Yes, Sacc speaks the truth. Hop utilization is a function of time, temperature and wort density. If you only do partial boils of 2-3 gallons and then top-up to your final volume in the fermenter, you will see a marked improvement in hop utilization by adding a portion of the extract at the beginning (to get your starting OG around 1.040) and adding the rest at flameout. You will more effectively isomerize alpha acids at this SG compared to the SG from adding all X lbs of malt extract at the very beginning of the boil.
__________________
flyangler18 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 09:23 PM   #9
Eves
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 380
Liked 3 Times on 3 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Fantastic. I had no idea. Thanks.


And yes Beersmith is on the list of things to get

__________________
Eves is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-18-2008, 10:28 PM   #10
HOOTER
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 1,854
Liked 10 Times on 8 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eves View Post
Wait, you're saying if I am only boiling 2-3 gallons but just add the LME late then I'll get a higher IBU out of the bittering hops? Is that for real? Does adding DME late make a difference in terms of IBUs?
I brewed an American pale ale recently with only 1 oz. of Cascades for bittering with 1 lb. of DME at the beginning of the boil and 6 lbs. of LME with 5 minuted remaining. The bitterness was surprising to say the least and quite a bit more aggressive than I expected with only 1 oz. low alpha hops for bittering.
__________________
Primary:
Secondary:
Bottled: Lots of stuff
On tap: Hefeweizen, Centennial Blonde
Up next: Quality Beverages

Quote:
Originally Posted by Homercidal View Post
Shorts Would Make Boners Obvious
HOOTER is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DME late addition beerbelay General Techniques 14 12-22-2010 04:53 PM
NB New Old Ale - Late Hop Addition horseman Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 3 05-05-2009 04:32 AM
Late DME Addition aryiman Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 1 07-01-2008 06:59 PM
how late is too late for late-extract-addition? riored4v Extract Brewing 10 04-21-2008 10:08 PM
late addition Adam's Apples General Techniques 7 02-17-2008 09:12 PM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS