New Giveaway - Wort Monster Conical Fermeneter!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Legalities




Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-15-2014, 05:50 PM   #1
whiskeysausage
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1
Default Legalities

So I made a few brews with a bottle and carboy, success.
I bought a nanobrew system, still working it.

My specific question comes into play on the 'business/legal' side of things. I understand that I cannot sell from my garage, but can I take 'donations'? Can I give it away and sell T-shirts and mugs?

Also, can a microbrewery sell beer on premise? This question comes from "a guy that talked to another guy" that was telling me what to do, who said that a microbrewery cannot sell beer on premise, and that it must sell 'its beer' to another 'entity' in order to sell the beer on site. I.e., the microbrew sells to the restaurant (both owned by the same person, both under the same roof, but two legal entities) in order for it to be legal per federal guidelines.

Is this true? Is this partially true? I can't find anything that clearly defines the situation and have spent a good amount of time online digging around empty handed, hence, I am offering up the question to the well versed masters (you all) in all things legal and artisan in brewing.

Much appreciated, thanks in advance. For reference, I'm in Colorado.



__________________
whiskeysausage is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 05:57 PM   #2
j1n
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 15
Liked 3 Times on 2 Posts

Default

You can just look up your state laws and what license / permits you would need. just go to the source rather than ask people on a forum.



__________________
j1n is offline
jbaysurfer Likes This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:00 PM   #3
seabass07
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
seabass07's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,123
Liked 78 Times on 74 Posts
Likes Given: 61

Default

Yea, varies state to state, so you'll have to dig through your local laws. Here, there is at least one nano that started in a shed in his back yard and was legally selling keg and growler fills there. Now he's got a tap room. But that's washington.

__________________
Fermenter 1: Beer
Fermenter 2: Beer
seabass07 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:03 PM   #4
Yooper
Frau Admin
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Yooper's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Upper Michigan
Posts: 58,599
Liked 3851 Times on 2813 Posts
Likes Given: 640

Default

You can not sell until you are fully licensed. You can not accept donations, or barter in return for brew.

In some states, microbreweries can not self distribute or have a tap room on premises. In some states, they can. Generally, brewpubs can serve their own beer, but they have to have a "brewpub" license and not be a "microbrewery" that packages beer to be sold outside of their own pub.

Laws vary widely from state to state.

__________________
Broken Leg Brewery
Giving beer a leg to stand on since 2006
Yooper is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:14 PM   #5
sweetcell
Swollen Member
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
sweetcell's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Rockville, MD
Posts: 3,671
Liked 525 Times on 393 Posts
Likes Given: 217

Default

the laws that cover the production and sale of alcohol are a mix of federal, state and municipal, so there is no one-size-fits-all answer unfortunately. you clearly have a lot of research ahead of you. and once you complete it, and if you're ready to proceed, you'll have a lot of red tape ahead of you.

until you get the right permits (which often involve getting a commercial space for making your brew, authorities generally won't grant a license for a residential area), you cannot accept any money for your beer. you can sell t-shirts and mugs but their purchase can't be related to alcohol in any way (you can't offer beer to someone only if they buy a t-shirt, for example).

__________________
.
What hops should I grow? Hop grower's comparison table

Drinking: a chocolate oatmeal stout, a belgian imperial stout, a Vertical Epic 09.09.09 clone
Fermenting: a split-batch belgian blond/saison
Aging: an oud bruin, a BDSA/Dubbel thingy, a soured Saison, my "Wild Oats" brett/sour, and some other stuff i can't think of at the moment...
Up next: who knows. maybe providing links to recipes for the above beers.
sweetcell is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:14 PM   #6
Brewbien
Brewer. Lover. Everyman.
Feedback Score: 15 reviews
 
Brewbien's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 448
Liked 85 Times on 64 Posts
Likes Given: 62

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yooper View Post
You can not sell until you are fully licensed. You can not accept donations, or barter in return for brew.

In some states, microbreweries can not self distribute or have a tap room on premises. In some states, they can. Generally, brewpubs can serve their own beer, but they have to have a "brewpub" license and not be a "microbrewery" that packages beer to be sold outside of their own pub.

Laws vary widely from state to state.
The laws do vary quite a bit. There are two pretty well known basement bars here in Portland where they do take donations while serving homebrew and allowing people to smoke since it is in someones home. We seem to have some of the most lenient beer laws here though.
__________________
Brewbien is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:17 PM   #7
sandyeggoxj
Head of Research and Development
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
sandyeggoxj's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Sunshine and Big Holes
Posts: 778
Liked 68 Times on 57 Posts

Default

Here is some homework. You are new at this and that is cool, but you have A LOT of reading to do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_and_Tobacco_Tax_and_Trade_Bureau
http://www.ttb.gov/beer/
http://www.ttb.gov/industry-startup/beer/beer-startup.shtml
http://www.colorado.gov/revenue/liquor


Once you have read all that go to probrewer.com and read all that. Then think of a company name and go to this site and this site and see if you can register that name.

Now you are getting started. You have some information and now you can start the physical side of things: building, business licenses/tax id's, permitting, equipment, etc. Get ready to learn a lot about everything. Once you figure out your plan take your expected costs and double them. And then maybe add 20%.

__________________

**Everything I say is fully substantiated by my own opinion

sandyeggoxj is offline
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:18 PM   #8
fosaisu
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
fosaisu's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 300
Liked 30 Times on 28 Posts
Likes Given: 46

Default

Permitting regs will also vary from town to town within a state, so you really do need to carefully research the rules for your locality.

If there are any brewpubs in your town, you might consider chatting them up about the process they went through to get up and running. They'll probably be hesistant to give you legal advice (and rightly so) but if you find someone friendly and knowledgable they might be able to share enough info to help you decide if it's worth pursuing (at which point you'd want to actually look at the laws and regs on the books, talk to the relevant local permitting offices, etc.) If you've read any of the brewery startup threads on this site, you'll quickly see that one thing you really want to avoid is running up costs by building a setup that doesn't meet federal/state/local code requirements.

__________________
fosaisu is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:18 PM   #9
Zuljin
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
Zuljin's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Armed Compound
Posts: 13,140
Liked 3182 Times on 2953 Posts
Likes Given: 114

Default

When a a bar and grill in Texas was sold to someone else who opened it under a new name, that new owner was having trouble getting a liquor license. He could not sell beer during the first charity poker run he held.

What he did was serve beer and suggest that people make donations each time they ordered one. You know, to help cover costs for the poker run. The event, and the bar and grill, were open to the public, even if you weren't participating in the bike ride. It was an end run around the license issue.

It's not the same as the topic here, just an example of accepting donations for beer. I mean, to help cover costs of a charity event.

__________________

Stuff and things.

Zuljin is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-15-2014, 06:19 PM   #10
fosaisu
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
fosaisu's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 300
Liked 30 Times on 28 Posts
Likes Given: 46

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brewbien View Post
The laws do vary quite a bit. There are two pretty well known basement bars here in Portland where they do take donations while serving homebrew and allowing people to smoke since it is in someones home. We seem to have some of the most lenient beer laws here though.
That sounds pretty cool - are you sure they're legal operations though?


__________________
fosaisu is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Legalities of prostitution - Food for thought OrdinaryAvgGuy Debate Forum 48 03-18-2013 02:43 PM
On the ethics and legalities of acquiring bottles... djinn88 General Beer Discussion 16 10-06-2010 02:03 PM
Legalities of selling your beer? Code General Beer Discussion 10 03-01-2010 11:20 PM