Lagering & Secondary questions

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pnh2atl

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I have a Belgian Dubbel which is has been fermenting for 11 days now. It is still bubbling about every minute or so. I am going out of town for 5 days tomorrow and wanted to rack it to the secondary fermentation bucket and wondered if I should wait or if it is ok to do it now? If I do it when I get home it will have been in primary for 16 days.

I also have a Munich Dunkel lagering at 34 degrees. I fermented it at 54F for about 2 weeks then I let the temp increase to 67 for 48 hours and during that time it started to bubble again. After that I racked it and stuck it in the fridg and it has been there since 7/4. When I racked it smelled great and looked great too. But it was kind of bitter when I tasted it. My question is will the flavor change much during the time it is lagering (I planned 4-6 weeks)?

These were my 1st & 2nd AG batches. I have a Belgian Wit also fermenting which was number 3.

Thanks for the help.

Nick

I appreciate your help.
 
Not sure about anyone else in here, but opinion would be to let it ride. I don't have the equipment to lager, but nothing but good things have come from letting it ride. At least for me.
 
Ok I'm replying only to get it back to the top of the list and hopefully get a few more eyes on it.
 
Let the Dubbel sit. 16 days is a non-issue.

I have no experience with lagering, but with most beers bitterness mellows over time. Your Dunkel is what...4 weeks old at this point? Still green. RDWHAHB.

:mug:
 
Hmmm... I can't believe no one answered this. We apologize.

I hope you left the Belgian in the primary. Secondary fermentation is very debated here....

To properly use a primary/secondary (IMO :D) fermentation schedule you need to transfer to secondary while the fermentation is still active and ideally when about 2/3-3/4 of the fermentation have been consumed. The eye-ball rule-of-thumb for this is when your airlock slows to 4 bubbles per minute. Then you transfer the slightly turbid fermenting beer into your secondary vessel and allow it to finish away from the trub but with a significant amount of yeast in suspension.

The other school of thought is to say "the hell with the trub" and to allow the beer to finish in the primary on the yeast and trub cake.

Both methods will produce good beer and people who finish in the primary often use a secondary vessel as a bright tank or clearing vessel (lets not debate the syntax of what it is called ;)) This is used to drop out anything left in suspension and to help clear the beer before bottling or kegging.

The worst thing you can do, is to ferment the work fully (full attenuation in ~6-8 days), then rack off the cake into a secondary. In this case, the beer is fully fermented and the majority of yeast will have dropped out. Then, when you transfer to secondary, you leave that yeast behind and there is nothing (or significantly less) in your secondary to condition the beer. This is why so many people rag on using a secondary because they find just using a primary for 2-3 weeks produces a cleaner better beer. In order to use a secondary properly, you need to transfer when the beer is still actively fermenting.

As to your lager question, yes it will mellow with time and lagering will clean up the flavor profile.


Hope that helps! :mug:
 
Thanks. I'll leave the dubbel fo another week and I'll let the lager, lager fo six weeks even though I really want to bottle it so I can try some. I'll just brew something else as a distraction.
 
To properly use a primary/secondary (IMO :D) fermentation schedule you need to transfer to secondary while the fermentation is still active and ideally when about 2/3-3/4 of the fermentation have been consumed. The eye-ball rule-of-thumb for this is when your airlock slows to 4 bubbles per minute. Then you transfer the slightly turbid fermenting beer into your secondary vessel and allow it to finish away from the trub but with a significant amount of yeast in suspension.


That's your IMHO, not MY IMHO :D

My IMHO, and a lot of people, is that nothing should be happneing fermentaion in your secondary. Your secondary is for clearing or adding things to. The secondary fermentation stage and you secondary are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS AND ALLOT OF PEOPLE, including my friend, Boerderij (I still love you though) GET IT WRONG.

The secondary fermentation stage is part of the LIFE CYCLE OF THE YEAST and all happens inside your primary.

The secondary vessel (which is also called the brite tank) is where you add things like oak or fruit or hops and also where you clear your beer, or lager it in, or bulk age it.

AND you don't move to that vessel until fermentation has ceased in the primary. And you determine that by taking 2 consequetive hydrometer readings over a three day period.

If you follow donkey sniffer's advice you are moving you beer too soon, and interrupting the natural cycle of your yeast, AND you are not getting some of the benefit of leaving the beer alone for even a couple three days before racking to allow for the yeast to clean up after themselves.
That's why some folks who do secondary, wait 2 weeks, to insure fermentation is complete and the job is done in the primary, then rack to secondary.

(Oh and you also shouldn't go by airlock bubbling, since many airlocks don't bubble anyway....and it's not a gauge of fermentation, your hydrometer is)

You will also find that a lot of people forgo secondary, leave it in their fermenter for a month and bottle, and only use the secondary vessel for the above mentioned reasons, adding fruit, etc.

But yeah, it's been debated a lot....:D
 
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