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Old 12-18-2013, 12:12 AM   #1
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Default lager help

right now I have a lager in the primary fermentation that'll be 2 weeks on next friday

my question is when I do the diytcl rest for the two to three days on next Friday for the first lager can I have a another lager ready to go and place it in the fermentation chamber with the first lager that'll be in secondary

Ill let both of them go for 2 or 3 days at 60 degrees and then drop to lagering temps

Would the yeast for the second lager work at such a low temp? Would i just have to let it ferment in primary for longer? I will be using white labs helles yeast in the second lager

I hope this makes sense

Thanks in advance

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Old 12-18-2013, 01:39 AM   #2
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For the diacetyl rest you need to bring the temps up to 65F for a few days. You should be fermenting around 50F. So no, you cannot have both at the same temps at different stages of fermentation.

Primary fermentation should only take 5-7 days, or until you hit 75% of your attenuation, then do a D-rest for 3 days.

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Old 12-18-2013, 02:13 AM   #3
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For the diacetyl rest you need to bring the temps up to 65F for a few days. You should be fermenting around 50F. So no, you cannot have both at the same temps at different stages of fermentation.

Primary fermentation should only take 5-7 days, or until you hit 75% of your attenuation, then do a D-rest for 3 days.
This goes against everything i have read... I've read that primary fermentation takes 2 to for weeks then raise to 60 to 62 for the d rest then transfer to secondary then lower to lagering temps
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Old 12-18-2013, 03:27 AM   #4
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This goes against everything i have read... I've read that primary fermentation takes 2 to for weeks then raise to 60 to 62 for the d rest then transfer to secondary then lower to lagering temps
Yeast don't follow the calendar all that well. Much depends on pitch rate and how well you oxygenated the wort.

I usually take a hydro reading at around 7-8 days to see where it's at. When it hits about 80% on the way to expected FG, that's the time to raise the temp into the lower 60's for the d-rest. I'd not go shorter than 3 days. 5-7 days for a d-rest before cold crashing is fine.

You're going to want to rack it off the cake, either to a keg or to a secondary for long-term cold lagering.
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Old 12-18-2013, 12:59 PM   #5
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I brew lagers a lot. My tried and true method is to leave the wort in the primary for a 30 days. This allows the yeast to follow their own schedule (you don't have to be constantly testing to see when it's ready), also helps with the flavor. Then d-rest for 3 days at 65 degrees. The drop to lager temps over the course of 48 hrs. I ususally leave it there for at least two months, sometimes longer depending on style (I.E. Marzen, Bock Etc). Since your not getting paid for it there is no rush to get it into lagering. The beer will be just fine in the primary for a few weeks longer (actually lets the yeast clean up abit, and improves flavor). Just relax, your not brewing for cheap quick beer...right. A certain person I know of said once "Relax, don't worry, have a homebrew"

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Old 12-18-2013, 01:14 PM   #6
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I brew lagers a lot. My tried and true method is to leave the wort in the primary for a 30 days. This allows the yeast to follow their own schedule (you don't have to be constantly testing to see when it's ready), also helps with the flavor. Then d-rest for 3 days at 65 degrees. The drop to lager temps over the course of 48 hrs. I ususally leave it there for at least two months, sometimes longer depending on style (I.E. Marzen, Bock Etc). Since your not getting paid for it there is no rush to get it into lagering. The beer will be just fine in the primary for a few weeks longer (actually lets the yeast clean up abit, and improves flavor). Just relax, your not brewing for cheap quick beer...right. A certain person I know of said once "Relax, don't worry, have a homebrew"
i wanted to finially try a lager after brewing for about 3 years. Since i just got my ferm chamber about 2 months ago i decided to give it a shot. I did not realize (dumb) that it would tie up my ferm chamber for so long. That was why the original question was posed. I guess i should really let it go for the time it needs but it stinks since i wont be able to brew until the lager is done.

I have been able to use my downstairs bathroom as a fermentation room but since my chest freezer is in there now i dont have room to use a swamp cooler and the like. My gf has given me that room to do as i please and i have run outta room haha.... i guess it is what it is
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Old 12-18-2013, 02:10 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by CliffMongoloid View Post

i wanted to finially try a lager after brewing for about 3 years. Since i just got my ferm chamber about 2 months ago i decided to give it a shot. I did not realize (dumb) that it would tie up my ferm chamber for so long. That was why the original question was posed. I guess i should really let it go for the time it needs but it stinks since i wont be able to brew until the lager is done.

I have been able to use my downstairs bathroom as a fermentation room but since my chest freezer is in there now i dont have room to use a swamp cooler and the like. My gf has given me that room to do as i please and i have run outta room haha.... i guess it is what it is
You do not have to tie up your chamber that long. A lager only needs to ferment at 50F until 75% of your attenuation which should be 5-7 days depending on how active your fermentation is. I have brewed 30+ lagers in the last few years and the 99% of them are ready to be pulled out of the fermentation chamber and warmed up for a D-rest within 7 days.

So let's say your lager had an OG of 1.050 and expected final gravity is 1.010. You have 40 points to ferment so 75% of that is 30, so when your gravity hits 1.020 it should be given a D-rest at 65F. So you only need to keep a lager at 50F for a week or so.
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Old 12-18-2013, 04:04 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CliffMongoloid View Post
i wanted to finially try a lager after brewing for about 3 years. Since i just got my ferm chamber about 2 months ago i decided to give it a shot. I did not realize (dumb) that it would tie up my ferm chamber for so long. That was why the original question was posed. I guess i should really let it go for the time it needs but it stinks since i wont be able to brew until the lager is done.

I have been able to use my downstairs bathroom as a fermentation room but since my chest freezer is in there now i dont have room to use a swamp cooler and the like. My gf has given me that room to do as i please and i have run outta room haha.... i guess it is what it is
I found this out just like you did! Take a look see at what a forum member did that can address this problem at www.plasticconicals.com. I'm building my version. Not planning anther lager until it's done. It hold up my only temp controlled ferm space for too long.

It's been my limited experience that primary can last a very very long time for lagers.

TD
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Old 12-18-2013, 08:48 PM   #9
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You do not have to tie up your chamber that long. A lager only needs to ferment at 50F until 75% of your attenuation which should be 5-7 days depending on how active your fermentation is. I have brewed 30+ lagers in the last few years and the 99% of them are ready to be pulled out of the fermentation chamber and warmed up for a D-rest within 7 days.

So let's say your lager had an OG of 1.050 and expected final gravity is 1.010. You have 40 points to ferment so 75% of that is 30, so when your gravity hits 1.020 it should be given a D-rest at 65F. So you only need to keep a lager at 50F for a week or so.
+1, 7 days is generally the most it should take for primary fermentation. if you pitch cold and ferment cold, more often than not a d-rest isn't even needed too, but it shouldn't take any longer than 48 hours for one, longer time won't hurt tho. you want active yeast for a d-rest, so if you wait til ferm is already done, it can be a slow process. you do however need another chamber for the lagering process, which it will tie up for a fairly significant time
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Old 12-19-2013, 01:43 AM   #10
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you do however need another chamber for the lagering process, which it will tie up for a fairly significant time
Agreed. Having the second chamber (for lagering, cold crashing, storing yeast, storing extra bottled beer) is so very nice if you do lagers on any sort of regular basis.
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