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Old 03-04-2012, 11:28 PM   #1
Tidwellc
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Default Irish moss ineffective?

Ok, so third brew ever, and first brew with irish moss or any sort of clarifier. I threw it in at 15 minutes left in the boil, about 1 1/2 tsp. of it. Spent about a week in the primary, racked it over to secondary and poured a sample for the hydro and noticed it had not cleared up at all, just as cloudy as my last beer which was a dunkelweizen. Does it take longer than a week to clarify? It's still got another couple weeks to go before bottling day, so should it clear up by then or did I do something wrong?

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Old 03-04-2012, 11:38 PM   #2
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Irish moss only helps clear up the wort during the post boil cool down.

After the beer has been moved to the primary the irish moss is gone.
you can try some gelatin finings in the secondary that should help clear up your beer.

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Old 03-04-2012, 11:38 PM   #3
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It's not magic. It will only help precipitate proteins. There are a whole lot of reasons a beer could be cloudy.

http://www.brewerslair.com/index.php...&id=&v=&term=1

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Old 03-04-2012, 11:50 PM   #4
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Time is usually the answer here. If it doesn't seem to be settling as quickly as you'd like, you can add gelatin when you bottle. Works awesome.

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Old 03-05-2012, 12:26 AM   #5
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Gelatin really does the trick for me. I've used it on my last couple of beers and think it works great. I just put some in my secondary a couple days ago and within 24 hours i could see through the carboy. Love gelatin.

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Old 03-05-2012, 12:38 AM   #6
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Transfer to secondary after a week? That's a little rushed IMHO... Most agree a secondary is not always needed but you can go 30 days in primary and that gives a good deal of time for ferment to complete, yeast cleanup to happen and flocculation....

Gelatin is a reliable fining agent, I would not use it on a dry-hopped beer as I am too concerned about stripping the aroma but otherwise it's very reliable. Works well in conjunction with cold crashing.

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Old 03-05-2012, 02:18 AM   #7
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what type of beer is this batch? what yeast did you use? Some yeast strains do not flocculate well, staying in suspension a long time. As indicated above, Irish moss only helps with remove certain types of proteins, so it will not help with other sources of cloudiness (e.g. yeast, tannins, polyphenols)

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Old 03-05-2012, 03:31 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rawlus View Post
Transfer to secondary after a week? That's a little rushed IMHO... Most agree a secondary is not always needed but you can go 30 days in primary and that gives a good deal of time for ferment to complete, yeast cleanup to happen and flocculation....
I was taught to transfer to secondary after about a week. Mostly because initial fermentation is mostly over after a few days, and leaving it in a plastic fermenter could possibly cause it to become oxidized if left in for too long.

But as far as the gelatin is concerned, what would be the best method to introduce it into the car boy? Does it need to be stirred into the wort or mixed up in any way, or just pitch it on in?

Quote:
what type of beer is this batch? what yeast did you use? Some yeast strains do not flocculate well, staying in suspension a long time. As indicated above, Irish moss only helps with remove certain types of proteins, so it will not help with other sources of cloudiness (e.g. yeast, tannins, polyphenols)
It is an Irish Red recipe, and the yeast was WLP004. The recipe did call for the moss (making me assume it is in fact "clarifiable").

I think I may try the gelatin trick, although getting it thoroughly mixed might be difficult. Since it is already in a glass carboy, I could make up some gel solution, put it in the bottom of an empty bottling bucket, siphon the beer into the bucket to mix, and then siphon back into another carboy? Am I on the right track or am I thinking too hard?..
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Old 03-05-2012, 03:45 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tidwellc View Post
I was taught to transfer to secondary after about a week. Mostly because initial fermentation is mostly over after a few days, and leaving it in a plastic fermenter could possibly cause it to become oxidized if left in for too long.

But as far as the gelatin is concerned, what would be the best method to introduce it into the car boy? Does it need to be stirred into the wort or mixed up in any way, or just pitch it on in?



It is an Irish Red recipe, and the yeast was WLP004. The recipe did call for the moss (making me assume it is in fact "clarifiable").

I think I may try the gelatin trick, although getting it thoroughly mixed might be difficult. Since it is already in a glass carboy, I could make up some gel solution, put it in the bottom of an empty bottling bucket, siphon the beer into the bucket to mix, and then siphon back into another carboy? Am I on the right track or am I thinking too hard?..
You'll find debate on this, but a lot of homebrewers are no longer using a secondary. The risk of oxidation in the plastic bucket is really not an issue if only leaving it there for a relatively short time (3-6 weeks).

Wlp004 flocculates pretty well, so I doubt you should have to worry about a yeast haze. The haze you have may be from excessive tannins/polyphenols and/or proteins not pulled out of suspension my the Irish moss. Lots of things can affect these compounds - water chemistry, recipe, pH, hops. Here's a nice primer on polyphenols that may help you figure out where to start looking. http://www.draymans.com/articles/arts/05.html
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Old 03-05-2012, 06:15 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLem View Post
what type of beer is this batch? what yeast did you use? Some yeast strains do not flocculate well, staying in suspension a long time. As indicated above, Irish moss only helps with remove certain types of proteins, so it will not help with other sources of cloudiness (e.g. yeast, tannins, polyphenols)
Isn't that a redundancy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tannin
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