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Old 11-13-2012, 12:53 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post
Tang....you mean hop bitternes?
No, I don't think so... I've tried the newest brew that has a similar tang and so I'm going to add one of the hop teabags at the end to see what that does to it.

What is the description for a yeast tang? It looks clear, smells ok, so I don't think it's that.

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Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
Let it mature of course, but also I've found that those unexplainable weird tastes are most likely not-so-fresh extract. Instead of buying a kit, try first:
a) Finding a busy homebrew shop with lots of customers.
b) Using off-the-shelf extracts, yeasts, and ingredients to mimic the kit you're interested in making.

You're shooting for fresher extract. It'll make a difference. Check out the recipe section for some 5-star extract recipes and try that. Then come back and let us know how it went.
That's my next phase.

Thanks for the advice to crapply worded queries all!
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Old 11-13-2012, 01:21 PM   #12
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I know exactly what you mean. It's a taste that can easily be perceived as, "this was homebrewed wasn't it?" You can easily distinguish it from a blind taste test against a commercial brew of the same style. Something yeasty or twangy about it. Maybe it's the freshness or crispness of the beer.

I have yet to make a beer that has commercial style quality. I just switched to a new distributor and way I'm making my kits. Hopefully this will improve on the taste.

I too am waiting for that special moment when I make commercial equivalent brew, and can confidently say "this is damn good!"

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Old 11-13-2012, 01:24 PM   #13
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I have experienced that taste in homebrew.

I think the ones I've tasted that screamed "homebrew taste" to me where made using cans of extract, especially John Bull and Cooper's. I think it's the canned extract that gives that "canned cooked extract homebrew" taste. Fermenting it above 65 degrees F makes it even worse, and more "twangy".

If you use grains, spray dried malt extract (dried extract called "DME"), hops, better quality yeast (NOT Munton's or Coopers), and good water, that "homebrew" taste goes away.

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Old 11-13-2012, 01:33 PM   #14
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If google is right, 25C is too hot. Shoot for 20-21C (68-70F). Getting hot than that is going to produce a lot of flavors from the yeast which will probably not suit the style and make it taste 'estery, yeasty, or fruity'.

I also forgot about the late extract (I have been all grain for a while now). Adding the majority of the extract late in the boil will keep the color lighter and helps with the flavor. So that's a good route to try like the others have said. Also, when it comes to fresh, the best indicator of fresh is high turnover in the store. If the shelves are rotating stock, then the chances are high fresh stock is coming in.

I really would encourage anyone to 'build their own kit' from the recipes on this site. It's really easy to buy some good malt extract, a tiny bit of steeping grains, hops, and some good yeast and make great beer. The people here will also be more than happy to help you formulate a recipe if you have questions too.

You could do something simple like

(US measurements because I'm not good with metric)
Recipe: Extract Pale Example
Style: American Pale Ale
TYPE: Extract

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.50 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.053 SG
Estimated Color: 8.5 SRM
Estimated IBU: 38.7 IBUs
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L - Steep at 150F for 30 minutes.
2 lbs 8.0 oz Extra Light Dry Extract - Boil for 60 minutes. (always make sure to turn off your heat when mixing in extract)
1.25 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min
0.75 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 20.0 min
4 lbs Extra Light Dry Extract Boil for 15 min
0.50 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 5.0 min
0.50 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 0.0 min
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast - Cool wort to at least 75F (68-70 better) before pitching yeast.
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days


That should make a solid American Pale Ale. (Might want to get some opinions on it as I threw it together in like 10 minutes).

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Old 11-13-2012, 01:35 PM   #15
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OP - you are bound to get some funky beer at those temps. 22.5 C = 72.5 F. Yeast created heat while it ferments, so your actual temp will be higher than that. For most ale yeast, you should be targeting 18C or so.

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Old 11-13-2012, 01:43 PM   #16
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OP - you are bound to get some funky beer at those temps. 22.5 C = 72.5 F. Yeast created heat while it ferments, so your actual temp will be higher than that. For most ale yeast, you should be targeting 18C or so.
I've got an internal digi thermometer, so it should be the true temp.

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...That should make a solid American Pale Ale. (Might want to get some opinions on it as I threw it together in like 10 minutes).
Thanks, will try that - how does IPA differ from APA?!
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Old 11-13-2012, 01:44 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billl
OP - you are bound to get some funky beer at those temps. 22.5 C = 72.5 F. Yeast created heat while it ferments, so your actual temp will be higher than that. For most ale yeast, you should be targeting 18C or so.
You'll be amazed at how just putting the fermenter in a big tub (like anything 6 inches wider than your bucket) of tap water can keep the temps down. Not only does the water stay about a degree C colder than ambient air (evaporation) but the water buffers against temperature rises in the fermenting beer.
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Old 11-13-2012, 01:51 PM   #18
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It's certainly not burned caramelisation, as I didn't boil (there were no instructions to, IIRC).
not sure if folks missed that little detail... if i understand correctly, you are using a no-boil kit. add a can of pre-hopped liquid extract to water, mix, add yeast - correct? if so, this is the paint-by-numbers equivalent of making beer. a great way to start and to learn techniques like sanitation, but you can't expect the mona lisa.

your beer will improve greatly by moving to a recipe that calls for boiling. from your no-boil kits, next step up is partial boil: add your extract to boiling water, throw in hops at various times, cool that mix, then make up your total volume with cool water. this approach allows you to choose the types of extract and hops you want (i.e. fresh), and allows you a lot more flexibility in the kinds of beer you choose to brew. as DonMagee called it, you can "build your own kit" by selecting only what you want.

next step beyond that is to use steeping grains to give your beer more and unique flavors and color.
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Drinking: a belgian pale ale, a belgian imperial stout, an Epic 09.09.09 clone, a brett'ed saison
Carbing: a hop-bursted APA, a citra farmhouse
Fermenting: an abbey ale (to be soured)
Aging: an oud bruin, a BDSA/Dubbel thingy, a soured fruit saison, my "wild oats" brett/sour, a saison with a brett mix added at bottling.
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Old 11-13-2012, 02:08 PM   #19
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not sure if folks missed that little detail... if i understand correctly, you are using a no-boil kit. add a can of pre-hopped liquid extract to water, mix, add yeast - correct? if so, this is the paint-by-numbers equivalent of making beer. a great way to start and to learn techniques like sanitation, but you can't expect the mona lisa.

your beer will improve greatly by moving to a recipe that calls for boiling. from your no-boil kits, next step up is partial boil: add your extract to boiling water, throw in hops at various times, cool that mix, then make up your total volume with cool water. this approach allows you to choose the types of extract and hops you want (i.e. fresh), and allows you a lot more flexibility in the kinds of beer you choose to brew. as DonMagee called it, you can "build your own kit" by selecting only what you want.

next step beyond that is to use steeping grains to give your beer more and unique flavors and color.
Thanks SC, I realise that I wasn't going to get perfection, but I probably also believed the hype about how wonderful the brew kit was (ther was a lot of talk around about how they've moved on and taste like beer ought to).

Defo next brew will be more manual, and hopefully I can have graduated on to something 'proper' by the time my own hops have been harvested.

I aim to start the next brew as soon as the IPA is bottled, probably in 10 days time... new baby on the way, so I'm hardly going to go out much....!
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Old 11-13-2012, 02:14 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by onerainmaker View Post
I've got an internal digi thermometer, so it should be the true temp.



Thanks, will try that - how does IPA differ from APA?!
I'm not a style expert, but to me the difference is a focus on american hops and slightly less malty/carmel flavors. It's probably best to go with the actual style descriptions. To me however, there isn't all that much difference.

APA - http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style10.php#1a
IPA - http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style14.php
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