The Great Bottle Opener Giveaway

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Heat exchange of cooler mash tun

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-19-2012, 04:59 PM   #1
iverasp
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Oslo, Oslo
Posts: 13
Default Heat exchange of cooler mash tun

Hi,

I did a hot water test of my cooler with aprox 18L. The water had an initial temperature of 71.3'C which sunk to 65.5'C in 70 minutes. I did not preheat the cooler but let it approach equilibrium for about 5 minutes before taking the temperature. The temperature sunk from 65.5'C to 61.6'C during the next 70 minutes. I placed a blanket on top of the lid for better insulation. Using the last measurement that equals a loss of about 3.3'C or 6'F per hour.

Is this heat loss acceptable for a mash tun?

18L ~ 19 quarts
71.3'C ~ 160'F
65.5'C ~ 149'F
61.6'C ~ 142'F

__________________
iverasp is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2012, 05:06 PM   #2
helibrewer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
helibrewer's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 3,069
Liked 171 Times on 155 Posts
Likes Given: 39

Default

Almost all the starch conversion happens in the first 20-30 minutes of the mash, the rest of the time you are just making "tea" -- getting color and flavor. Once that first 30 minutes passes, holding that perfect temperature is not as critical.

For my cooler I built a heat exchanger that uses steam from a pressure cooker and I use a March pump to recirculate. This way I can heat the mash without boiling water or direct heat if I need to.

__________________
Something is always fermenting....
"It's Bahl Hornin'"

Primary:
Brite Tank/Lagering:
Kegged: Hefeweizen, Chocolate Hazelnut Porter, Kumquat Saison, Tart Cherry Cider, Belgian Tripel, Maibock Bock, Ommegang Abbey Ale Clone, Belgian Golden Strong, German Pils (WLP830)
Bottled: Belgian Quad (Grand Reserve), Derangement (Belgian Dark Strong)
On Deck:
My Site: www.restlesscellars.com
helibrewer is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2012, 05:28 PM   #3
iverasp
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Oslo, Oslo
Posts: 13
Default

I think I'll do it the easiest way possible first (never done all-grain before). Making a RIMS sounds like a lot of fun (I love electronics, computers and mechanics) but will have to wait til after some decent beer has been made, drunken and praised

What kind of insulation is typical for drink coolers (mine is a Coleman)? Would I benefit from replacing the possibly old insulation with polyurethane spray foam (R-value of 5.5-6.5) or should I just leave it as-is? Coolers of this size is incredibly expensive and hard to get where I live so I would really like to just stick with what I gathered for free.

__________________
iverasp is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2012, 06:45 PM   #4
helibrewer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
helibrewer's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 3,069
Liked 171 Times on 155 Posts
Likes Given: 39

Default

The cooler insulation should be fine. Do you add boiling water to it first to pre-heat it? That can help. I also made a rigid foam lid that I can push down so it's right over the grain bed reducing the airspace to lose heat to.

__________________
Something is always fermenting....
"It's Bahl Hornin'"

Primary:
Brite Tank/Lagering:
Kegged: Hefeweizen, Chocolate Hazelnut Porter, Kumquat Saison, Tart Cherry Cider, Belgian Tripel, Maibock Bock, Ommegang Abbey Ale Clone, Belgian Golden Strong, German Pils (WLP830)
Bottled: Belgian Quad (Grand Reserve), Derangement (Belgian Dark Strong)
On Deck:
My Site: www.restlesscellars.com
helibrewer is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2012, 07:09 PM   #5
Rowdy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Brick, New Jersey
Posts: 459
Liked 10 Times on 10 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

PREHEAT! the cooler and try your test again.
also the thermal mass of grains will lose heat much slower then just plain water.

__________________

Cruiscín Lán Grúdlann
In wine there is wisdom, In beer there is freedom, In water there is bacteria.

Rowdy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2012, 07:15 PM   #6
iverasp
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Oslo, Oslo
Posts: 13
Default

As said the calculation of -3.3'C/h where from the second measurement where the cooler already had been standing with hot water in it for over an hour (aka preheat). Still, insulating the lid would be advantageous as it's the least insulated wall of the container.

__________________
iverasp is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-19-2012, 07:49 PM   #7
BBL_Brewer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
BBL_Brewer's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Kokomo, IN
Posts: 3,689
Liked 415 Times on 289 Posts
Likes Given: 302

Default

Honestly, I stopped checking my final temp when I do cooler mashes. If you lose a few degrees over an hour it's not a big deal. If you want to hold in more heat, try taping the edges of the lid and wrap the whole thing in a blanket. Most of your heat loss is probably coming from the lid though. Mine doesn't fit air tight and I can see steam coming out around it. Also, I've found pre-heating with boiling water to be an extra step that I just don't like to do. Instead, I made adjustments to my strike equation to compensate for the initial heat loss to the tun.

__________________
Slots Down Brewery
Stick with the plan....not the sparge.


Never Ending Liquid Yeast - How to Farm Yeast and Freeze it.

BBL_Brewer is offline
Calichusetts Likes This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2012, 01:33 AM   #8
CPFITNESS
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: nyc, ny
Posts: 134
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

my first 5 gallon batch i did I only used a plastic bucket wrapped in a blanket and It worked phenomenally. My next batch i had already purchased a cooler and had more heat loss with that however it still worked well. Most likely next time to be on the safe side I will also wrap my cooler with the blanket.

__________________
CPFITNESS is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2012, 02:49 AM   #9
iverasp
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Oslo, Oslo
Posts: 13
Default

Alright, it seems I should not worry. Thanks for the input, much appreciated I'm probably going to install a digital temp. probe and can repost after the first batch. As far as I remember from biological chemistry enzyme activity will decrease below/above a prefered temperature. Beer chemistry is somewhat complex but still, it's been made for ages without much of modern scientific research..

__________________
iverasp is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-02-2013, 06:18 AM   #10
worthogg
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: norcal
Posts: 138
Liked 15 Times on 9 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

helibrewer, do you have any photos of your pressure cooker heat exchanger?

__________________
worthogg is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mash heat loss ryanestrud Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 11 02-21-2012 02:59 AM
Leaving on heat during MASH brewgasm135 Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 7 09-27-2011 09:44 PM
Heat up the mash in a cooler? archer75 Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 5 06-25-2011 08:42 AM
Heat loss in cooler tonyolympia Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 9 05-27-2011 09:25 PM
Mini-mash in cooler mash tun stuck dmako Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 23 12-31-2008 10:39 PM