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Old 07-30-2012, 05:43 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by ReverseApacheMaster View Post
Does the hotdog flavor get worse? Change into any other flavors?
The flavor got worse with my witbier, but I've not had enough of the Cream Ale to know if it will become worse or not. The witbier was very good for the first few weeks and then the hot dog taste took over. I didn't consider my water but that would make more sense than my equipment. All of my other misc equipment goes through the same cleaning process I use for my fermenter, and it all soaks in Oxiclean and then StarSan.

We just moved, though we still have the same water source at the new house and it tastes the same as the old house. Can I boil the water first to remove chlorine and chloramine?
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Old 07-30-2012, 05:54 PM   #12
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ask them if they want to try your weiner cream ale.
Totally what I'd do!!!

Now, I'm gonna be that guy who asks you to post your recipes and processes, including yeast and ferm temps, for both batches in question. I'm leaning away from coriander as the culprit if it was only used in one batch.
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can i drink this? I mean. Im gunna. But is it fine?
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it's not a barley wine. it's an ale.
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Have you seen the price of ketchup lately? And I'm not talking Heinz.
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Old 07-30-2012, 06:47 PM   #13
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Now, I'm gonna be that guy who asks you to post your recipes and processes, including yeast and ferm temps, for both batches in question.
Witbier recipe:
1 can Cooper's Lager
2 lbs Briess Bavarian Wheat DME (original recipe called for 1kg)
3.25oz Cooper's Brew Enhancer 1
25g dried sweet orange peel
25g crushed coriander seed
10g Hallertauer Hersbrucker Hops
1 11g packet Safbrew WB-06

Boiled 6 quarts of water and added DME. Once break cleared I added the orange peel and hops and set my timer to 15 minutes. At 5 minutes I added my coriander. Cooled the wort and poured the Cooper's can into the fermenter. Poured the wort into the fermenter through a mesh collinder and topped up to 23L. Aerated wort and pitched the yeast dry at 74*F and stirred well into the wort. Ferm temps were between 72*F and 74*F. Kept in the primary for 3 weeks and bottled.

Liberty Cream Ale (Midwest kit):
6lb Briess Gold LME
8oz Carapils
2oz Cascade pellet hops (7.1% Alpha)
1 11g packet of S-05

Brought 3 gallons of water to a boil, let cool to 155*F. Added 8oz Carapils and let steep for 30 minutes, covered, adding heat as necessary to keep temp. Rehydrated yeast in 90*F water and left covered. After 30 minutes removed Carapils and brought to boil. Turned off heat, removed from burner and slowly stirred in LME. Put back on burner and brought back to boil. Once boil started I added .5oz Cascade pellets and set timer to 30 minutes. At 15 minutes I added .5 oz Cascade pellets. At 2 minutes I added 1oz Cascade pellets. Proofed yeast. Put kettle in ice bath uncovered and cooled to 72*F.

Poured wort through fine mesh collinder into fermenter and topped up with water from tap to 19L. Aerated wort. Pitched rehydrated yeast at 72*F. Used a swamp cooler and kept temps at 64*F until fermentation took off on day 2 (and ambient increased due to heat wave). Temps then went to 68*F with one or two spikes to 70*F (when I didn't swap ice in time) over the first week, then 68*F for the 2nd week. For week 3 I allowed the temp to go up to 72*F while still in the swamp cooler. Racked into my Tap-a-Draft bottles after 3 weeks in primary, then left to age at ambient (~72*F) temps.
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Old 07-30-2012, 07:48 PM   #14
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Ok, I'm familiar with the Liberty Cream ale. I actually have a batch of it conditioning in bottles right now. Definitely shouldn't have any hammy flavors to that. I have heard of meat-y and/or sulphur-y flavors/aromas when using wheat yeasts though. Check out this thread about meat-y flavors in weissbier.
About the cream ale.... you say you were sure to thoroughly clean and sanitize everything in between these batches. And your temps were fine for that yeast. Do you happen to know the production date or lot # of the packet?
I have to think that with an off flavor carrying over into two batches, and assuming your sanitation regimen is up to par, that you might want to consider your brewing water. A simple way for you to figure out if water may be the cause is to get the Liberty Cream kit again, and brew it using r/o or spring water, but doing everything else, including fermentation temps and schedule, the same as the batch in question. If it comes out different than the one with the off flavor, your usual brewing water is likely the culprit.
When I use my tap water, I pre boil all of the water I'll need. I'll also use Camden tabs to ensure that I've gotten rid of all the chlorine and chloramine.

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can i drink this? I mean. Im gunna. But is it fine?
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it's not a barley wine. it's an ale.
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Have you seen the price of ketchup lately? And I'm not talking Heinz.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:06 PM   #15
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I understand why folks think it might be the water since it is a common ingredient to both beers, but I don't know of any water chemistry that leads to 'hot dog' flavor.

I suppose it could be autolysis, but that is so rare these days unless your brewing with really poor yeast and are keeping the beer on the yeast cake for a LONG time at elevated temps.

Even after oxyclean and star san, my plastic buckets have a hop/beer aroma to them. To the OP - does your fermenter smell like coriander/hot dogs?

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Old 07-30-2012, 08:30 PM   #16
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I understand why folks think it might be the water since it is a common ingredient to both beers, but I don't know of any water chemistry that leads to 'hot dog' flavor.
I'm not convinced a meaty flavor is the most accurate descriptor but that's what OP connects with. Chlorophenols can taste really strange, especially at first. Then they go all medicinal. It can take a couple months for it to reach pure medicinal so it could come off as a less offensive flavor at first.

Even if it was just an ingredient left behind, like coriander, it doesn't explain the change in the rest of the flavor of the cream ale from hoppy to malty. Chlorine/chloramine fits both explanations. Since OP isn't using bleach as a cleaner but is using tap water the only source of chlorine/chloramine coming into the beer is the water.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:37 PM   #17
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Do you happen to know the production date or lot # of the packet?
I looked at the packet when I got and threw it in the fridge until I was ready for it. I don't recall the date, but it wasn't very old iirc.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:38 PM   #18
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To the OP - does your fermenter smell like coriander/hot dogs?
I'll open it tonight and see. It had a hoppy smell even after I cleaned after I racked the beer.

Edit:
@JLem - I just opened the lid and it smells very strongly of hops; it might even be as strong of hops smell as when I made this batch. I detect no other "off" smells.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:40 PM   #19
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Just to clarify, you boiled the coriander for 5 minutes (not 55) until flame-out?

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Old 07-30-2012, 08:54 PM   #20
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Just to clarify, you boiled the coriander for 5 minutes (not 55) until flame-out?
Correct, 5 minutes until flame out.
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