Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Beginners Beer Brewing Forum > Acetylaldehyde in Imperial IPA - Tastes Like Granny Smith Apple

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-30-2012, 04:50 PM   #1
the75
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: San Marcos, California
Posts: 284
Liked 16 Times on 13 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default Acetylaldehyde in Imperial IPA - Tastes Like Granny Smith Apple

So, my 3rd beer ever was supposed to be a DIPA, but is very short of hop flavor & very strong in green apple flavor. From what I've read, that flavor is from acetylaldehyde. I'm trying to figure out where this came from in my process, so here is a quick rundown if anyone can help:

4 1/4 gallon batch in 5 gallon carboy
Water PH 5.6 Bottled (Used 4 gallon kettle - not full boil)
steeped 1 lbs Briess Pale Malt, 1/4 lbs Crystal 20 at 156 for 25 min
Boil, then added 7 lbs Pilsen Light LME & 2 lbs Golden Light Briess DME
2 oz columbus 60
2 oz columbus 45
1 oz warrior 30
1 oz chinook 30
1 oz centennial 15
1 teaspoon irish moss 15
1 teaspoon yeast nutrient 10
1 oz amarillo 5
1 oz simcoe 0
1.082 OG at 77
700 ML starter of Wyeast 1056 (decanted) & 1000ML starter of WLP008 (Briess Golden Light DME) not decanted (yeah, I know...LHBS was out of 1056 or WLP001)
Fermented at 70 Degrees for 21 days. Dryhopped for last 12 days (Too long?)
Gravity was at 1.024 at dryhop, finished at 1.019

I don't see anything blatantly obvious here, but maybe the yeast combo? Maybe oxidation? I think my bottling went pretty well, transfer seemed fine...

__________________
the75 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 05:29 PM   #2
twistr25
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
twistr25's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 1,388
Liked 111 Times on 104 Posts
Likes Given: 14

Default

Here is a wiki page about it, hope it helps. Assuming you've haven't already seen it...

__________________

____________________
Primary: N/A
Bottled: All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale
Kegs: Sunset Orange Kolsch Redux
Future: Black IPA Redux, possibly others
2013 Previous: Sunrise Honey Rye Pale Ale, Dark Skies Black IPA, Sunset Orange Kolsch, All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale, Maple Vanilla Brown Ale, Raining Hops and Dogs IPA, Starry Night Vanilla Bourbon Porter

Awards/Recognition
Dark Skies Black IPA - 2nd Place at a local comp. Score of 39 from a BJCP judge

Twistr25 Recipes

GT Keezer Build

twistr25 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 05:37 PM   #3
the75
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: San Marcos, California
Posts: 284
Liked 16 Times on 13 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by twistr25 View Post
Here is a wiki page about it, hope it helps. Assuming you've haven't already seen it...
Definitely appreciate the response. Yes, I did take a look at that. I was hoping maybe someone here was able to offer insight from looking at my process. I took a look back & nothing really stands out to me, except maybe the combination of yeast...
__________________
the75 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 05:46 PM   #4
twistr25
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
twistr25's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 1,388
Liked 111 Times on 104 Posts
Likes Given: 14

Default

What was your FG supposed to be? The only thing I can think of is that the yeast were good enough to get started and create the alcohol, but couldn't fully finish the cleanup job leaving the acetyladehyde. Since it was reused yeast, looks like you got about 8.5% ABV, could have stressed the yeast a little at the end?

__________________

____________________
Primary: N/A
Bottled: All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale
Kegs: Sunset Orange Kolsch Redux
Future: Black IPA Redux, possibly others
2013 Previous: Sunrise Honey Rye Pale Ale, Dark Skies Black IPA, Sunset Orange Kolsch, All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale, Maple Vanilla Brown Ale, Raining Hops and Dogs IPA, Starry Night Vanilla Bourbon Porter

Awards/Recognition
Dark Skies Black IPA - 2nd Place at a local comp. Score of 39 from a BJCP judge

Twistr25 Recipes

GT Keezer Build

twistr25 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 05:53 PM   #5
Bithead
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Southern, NJ
Posts: 755
Liked 35 Times on 29 Posts
Likes Given: 80

Default

Since acetaldehyde is a normal part of fermentation maybe this recipe / yeast combination just produced more. I'd let it sit and clean itself up more.

__________________
Bithead is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 05:55 PM   #6
the75
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: San Marcos, California
Posts: 284
Liked 16 Times on 13 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by twistr25
What was your FG supposed to be? The only thing I can think of is that the yeast were good enough to get started and create the alcohol, but couldn't fully finish the cleanup job leaving the acetyladehyde. Since it was reused yeast, looks like you got about 8.5% ABV, could have stressed the yeast a little at the end?
That's a good possibility! I also did this one with little headspace, so I think I lost my most active yeast at krausen thru the blowoff. My final gravity finished where it was expected to, but is it still possible for me to reach final gravity & end up with this flavor? I'd assume final gravity doesn't fully dictate the yeast' health or their ability to clean things up...
__________________
the75 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 06:03 PM   #7
twistr25
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
twistr25's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 1,388
Liked 111 Times on 104 Posts
Likes Given: 14

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by the75 View Post
That's a good possibility! I also did this one with little headspace, so I think I lost my most active yeast at krausen thru the blowoff. My final gravity finished where it was expected to, but is it still possible for me to reach final gravity & end up with this flavor? I'd assume final gravity doesn't fully dictate the yeast' health or their ability to clean things up...
Correct, most beers take 4-7 days to ferment and the rest of the recommended time is to clean up. If they finished fermenting and were tuckered out, may not have had a chance to clean up even sitting for those additional 2 weeks
__________________

____________________
Primary: N/A
Bottled: All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale
Kegs: Sunset Orange Kolsch Redux
Future: Black IPA Redux, possibly others
2013 Previous: Sunrise Honey Rye Pale Ale, Dark Skies Black IPA, Sunset Orange Kolsch, All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale, Maple Vanilla Brown Ale, Raining Hops and Dogs IPA, Starry Night Vanilla Bourbon Porter

Awards/Recognition
Dark Skies Black IPA - 2nd Place at a local comp. Score of 39 from a BJCP judge

Twistr25 Recipes

GT Keezer Build

twistr25 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 06:36 PM   #8
pfgonzo
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
pfgonzo's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: San Francisco Bay Area, California
Posts: 652
Liked 63 Times on 46 Posts
Likes Given: 54

Default

Also, when you say fermented at 70, do you mean temp of the liquid or ambient? If ambient, the liquid temp was likely 74-78, which is a little high.

Chris White (White Labs) did an experiment for his Yeast book fermenting a 5ga batch at 68 and 75 (temp of wort), and tested for acetaldehyde. With a perception threshold of around 9ppm, the 68 degree batch only produced 7-10ppm, barely noticeable, and easily taken back up by the yeast during conditioning. The batch fermented at 75 produced something like 150ppm of acetaldehyde, quite a significant difference.

As others have said, give it some more time on the yeast to reduce levels if possible. Otherwise, you're stuck with the apple IPA this go-around, and should try fermenting a wee bit cooler next time.

Cheers.

__________________
pfgonzo is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 06:40 PM   #9
twistr25
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
twistr25's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 1,388
Liked 111 Times on 104 Posts
Likes Given: 14

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pfgonzo View Post
Also, when you say fermented at 70, do you mean temp of the liquid or ambient? If ambient, the liquid temp was likely 74-78, which is a little high.

Chris White (White Labs) did an experiment for his Yeast book fermenting a 5ga batch at 68 and 75 (temp of wort), and tested for acetaldehyde. With a perception threshold of around 9ppm, the 68 degree batch only produced 7-10ppm, barely noticeable, and easily taken back up by the yeast during conditioning. The batch fermented at 75 produced something like 150ppm of acetaldehyde, quite a significant difference.

As others have said, give it some more time on the yeast to reduce levels if possible. Otherwise, you're stuck with the apple IPA this go-around, and should try fermenting a wee bit cooler next time.

Cheers.
I think he's already bottled...
__________________

____________________
Primary: N/A
Bottled: All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale
Kegs: Sunset Orange Kolsch Redux
Future: Black IPA Redux, possibly others
2013 Previous: Sunrise Honey Rye Pale Ale, Dark Skies Black IPA, Sunset Orange Kolsch, All Hallow's Eve Pumpkin Ale, Maple Vanilla Brown Ale, Raining Hops and Dogs IPA, Starry Night Vanilla Bourbon Porter

Awards/Recognition
Dark Skies Black IPA - 2nd Place at a local comp. Score of 39 from a BJCP judge

Twistr25 Recipes

GT Keezer Build

twistr25 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-30-2012, 06:48 PM   #10
Brandonovich
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Posts: 189
Liked 5 Times on 5 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

I think you may want to be wary of your head space issue as well. The healthiest most viable yeast is going to be at the top during active fermentation, and if you blow it all out the top, you will not be left with enough healthy yeast at the end.

__________________
Brandonovich is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Another "my beer tastes like green apple" question csdunham Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 14 05-05-2012 11:21 PM
Beer smells and tastes cidery/apple like h22lude Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 5 12-27-2011 02:02 AM
acetylaldehyde and my ruined life!!! weaselburner Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 28 12-26-2011 02:16 AM
Friend said my beer tastes like apple juice Kegstand Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 12 05-17-2010 04:49 PM
pilsner tastes...like apple cider:( SeanyP321 Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 2 03-09-2009 02:26 PM