Yuengling Lager copy

I just brewed my first batch of beer last week and I'm going to start another soon. I was wondering what extract kit would be similar to a Yuengling Lager. It's hot enough here the I could probably only brew with ale yeast (68F) but I'd be happy with something close.

Annapolis homebrew has a kit (scroll down to the "Pennsylvania Lager"). I've never made it, but I've never seen Yuengling Lager clone kit anywhere else.

I have made it a few times and it came out pretty damn good each time....

wihophead said:

I have made it a few times and it came out pretty damn good each time....

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Does it ferment as an ale, or do you have to lager it?

You have to lager it...

Hopefully if it's an AG kit, they give you a lot of corn grits, since that is the bae grain in that beer

I had to run to the LHBS to get the right size tubing to rack my first batch into the secondary so I just got the Brewers Best English Brown Ale. Anyone tried it? How is it. Any tips for making it? It's only my second batch so I've never added the steeping grains or anything before.

eatpuppies said:

I had to run to the LHBS to get the right size tubing to rack my first batch into the secondary so I just got the Brewers Best English Brown Ale. Anyone tried it? How is it. Any tips for making it? It's only my second batch so I've never added the steeping grains or anything before.

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I've made that a couple of times. I think it was one of my first kits.

Follow the directions in the kit exactly- they are very good directions and make a very nice drinkable brown ale.

Bike N Brew said:

Does it ferment as an ale, or do you have to lager it?

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We brewed it in the winter and fermented it in a ~58° basement and it came out really good and we just did the extract with steeping grains.

Bike N Brew said:

Annapolis homebrew has a kit (scroll down to the "Pennsylvania Lager"). I've never made it, but I've never seen Yuengling Lager clone kit anywhere else.

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Though I've never had any problems, and I've never heard of anyone having problems with them, the description of the kit is wrong on several different levels. I'm surprised they just made **** up and put it on their website. Here's the text:

Do you like Yuengling Lager? We developed Pennsylvania Lager in response to the incredible rise in popularity of this historic microbrew. This recipe has more color and flavor than the beers from the big American megabreweries. We use a special combination of barley malt extract, rice, and premium hops to make this recipe. While this is a great beer all by itself, you can brew Pennsylvania Lager and Pennsylvania Porter to combine them in the glass for authentic Black & Tan. Real Black & Tan flavor is derived from the combination of a lager and an ale, so you must ferment two separate beers to get it right. You can also choose to combine the two beers at bottling time to create Black & Tan in each bottle.

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First, Yuengling Traditional Lager uses corn grits, not rice, as the adjunct.

Second, Yuengling Porter is a lager, and has been since the 1840s.

Third, the pre-packaged Yuengling Black & Tan is a mix of Premium and Porter, not Traditional Lager and Porter. The traditional, self-mixed black & tan from which the brewery formulated the pre-packaged version was made from Lord Chesterfield Ale and Porter. "Real Black & Tan flavor" in fact depends on whether you're in your sixties and frequented the right bars in Philadelphia or you're a fan of the modern Black & Tan.

I guess they're right, in a backhanded sort of way; black & tan is a combination of ale & lager. It's just that, with a Harp & Guinness b&t, the light beer is the lager, and with the old-school Yuengling Chesterfield/Porter b&t, the lager is the dark beer.

Anyhow, have fun!

Bob

Just curious as to why? the kit I didn't look but I am guessing would run around $30 + for a 5 gallon batch

I can get a 1/2 Barrel keg (15 gals right?) for $60 at the grocery store.. are you in an area yuengling is not readily available?

found this at the beer advocate website

8.0 lbs Pilsner Malt
1.0 lbs Flaked Maze
1.0 lbs Cara-pils (Color 1.5)
0.5 lbs Crystal Malt (Color: 60.0)
Mash for 90 min at 150 F
1 oz Cascade 5.4% 60 min
1 oz Cluster 7%, Boiled 10 Minutes
1 starter American Lager Yeast

You forgot corn grits, that is the base grain

98EXL said:

You forgot corn grits, that is the base grain

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maize is the base grain?

not sure what the difference between corn grits and maize is......

Chimone said:

maize is the base grain?

not sure what the difference between corn grits and maize is......

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Oh, I did not know that. So I guess I learned something today!

Chimone said:

not sure what the difference between corn grits and maize is......

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Flaked maize from the homebrew shop is pre-gelatinized. It can be mixed directly with your grains and mashed. Corn grits (unless you use instant grits) are like polenta and will require a cereal mash to release the starches and make them available for mashing.

The BYO article on American Pilsner has some information for doing a cereal mash with corn grits, though Chris Colby doesn't do a protein rest at ~120°, which I've seen recommended elsewhere for cereal mashes. Treat the separate cereal mash as a decoction for calculating the strike temp of your main mash, i.e. strike low knowing that you'll be adding a quantity of boiling cereal mash.

Chad

Chad said:

Flaked maize from the homebrew shop is pre-gelatinized. It can be mixed directly with your grains and mashed. Corn grits (unless you use instant grits) are like polenta and will require a cereal mash to release the starches and make them available for mashing.

The BYO article on American Pilsner has some information for doing a cereal mash with corn grits, though Chris Colby doesn't do a protein rest at ~120°, which I've seen recommended elsewhere for cereal mashes. Treat the separate cereal mash as a decoction for calculating the strike temp of your main mash, i.e. strike low knowing that you'll be adding a quantity of boiling cereal mash.

Chad

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hmmm....interesting

So what will the corn grits impart on the beer that maize won't? Pardon my ignorance, I don't normally use either but Im really thinking about doing the Yuengling for my first lager

Chimone said:

So what will the corn grits impart on the beer that maize won't?

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Inconvenience .

They do the same thing -- lighten the body and add a tiny hint of corn sweetness, though probably not detectable with just a pound. American brewers originally used corn as a way of cutting the higher protein levels of six-row barley. Now we add it because we like the light, crisp lagers and cream/blonde ales you can make with it.

The short answer is that if you are already going to the homebrew store, go ahead and get flaked maize (flaked corn) and simply add it to your mash. It's easier. If you have a couple of pounds of grits or polenta in your pantry (I do) and want to experiment with cereal mashes, or just don't want to drive all that way for just one ingredient, go with the cereal mash.

Chad

Chimone said:

found this at the beer advocate website

8.0 lbs Pilsner Malt
1.0 lbs Flaked Maze
1.0 lbs Cara-pils (Color 1.5)
0.5 lbs Crystal Malt (Color: 60.0)
Mash for 90 min at 150 F
1 oz Cascade 5.4% 60 min
1 oz Cluster 7%, Boiled 10 Minutes
1 starter American Lager Yeast

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When i toured the brewery in Pottsville, the tour guide told me the base malt was a blend of 2-row and 6-row pale, besides that, the above recipe seems consistent with what they are using.

anyone want to ship me a bottle?

Chimone said:

anyone want to ship me a bottle?

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I don't think it's worth your taste buds' time really, there are so many better lagers than that

While I think that Sam Adams boston lager is better ... there is a specific flavor and detail .....a certain earthy-ness that it has.. it's a iron-dark metalic / roasty-grain flavor that can't be seen in lagers anywhere else.. I like it... it's in my top 5 lagers...

I'd try it out...

98EXL said:

I don't think it's worth your taste buds' time really, there are so many better lagers than that

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Actually Yuengling is pretty good. It's a nice step up from BMC, it's inexpensive and is fairly widely available. I also appreciate the fact that it's still a family-owned business.

There's a pretty good writeup in today's Washington Post (8/27): Biggest of a Dying Breed.

I haven't tried their Lord Chesterfield Ale. That sounds pretty good.
Chad

Chad said:

Flaked maize from the homebrew shop is pre-gelatinized. It can be mixed directly with your grains and mashed. Corn grits (unless you use instant grits) are like polenta and will require a cereal mash to release the starches and make them available for mashing.

The BYO article on American Pilsner has some information for doing a cereal mash with corn grits, though Chris Colby doesn't do a protein rest at ~120°, which I've seen recommended elsewhere for cereal mashes. Treat the separate cereal mash as a decoction for calculating the strike temp of your main mash, i.e. strike low knowing that you'll be adding a quantity of boiling cereal mash.

Chad

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Good article, but I am not getting the "add some 6-row to your adjunct and then boil it for half an hour" part.... The purpose of the boil is to gelatinize starches in your adjunct so that they are more accesable to enzymatic degredation in your mash. For the several beers with adjuncts that I have done with normal everyday plain white rice (not minute rice, the real stuff) I bring a mixture 2 parts water and 1 part rice by volume to a boil for ~10minutes, and simmer covered for another 20-30 minutes until the rice is almost mush. This is then added to my main mash which works through a 122-148-168 temp mash. I have had great sucess with this proceedure.

Anyways, why add the 6-row for 5 minutes then boil? You wont get much (if any) enzymatic conversion in that time, esp if the starches are not gelatinized, then you boil the crap out of it. Not getting the point here.....

deathweed said:

Anyways, why add the 6-row for 5 minutes then boil? You wont get much (if any) enzymatic conversion in that time, esp if the starches are not gelatinized, then you boil the crap out of it. Not getting the point here.....

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Good point. This is the only explanation I can find.

This guy's method makes more sense to me: Cereal Mashing. He mashes the corn with some 2-row at 153° for 20 minutes to get conversion, then boils for gelatinization. Note the links at the bottom of the page.

As you rightly point out, there seems to be some confusion and misinformation about what actually happens in the cereal mash. Does the added grain actually convert the starches? Can they even be converted before they are gelatinized? Or are you just gelatinizing starches from the adjunct to release them for conversion in the main mash?

Chad

Just because I'm intrigued by cereal mashing:

Preparing a Corn Mash.
and
What is the American adjunct mash for?

Chad

Chimone said:

anyone want to ship me a bottle?

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...if you really really want some, I can. I second that it's not really worth the effort.

Now, if we were talking Penn, Victory, Sly Fox or Stoudts, that's a different story.

Munton's premium Lager canned kit is real similar to Yeungling.

Chimone said:

anyone want to ship me a bottle?

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I agree with the above posts on shipping a bottle. I've also noticed that their bottles are a crap shoot, sometimes its good, and more often in my experience its terrible, not sure what the deal is there. Draft seems to be the best bet, though i've been meaning to try it in cans.

Chad said:

Good point. This is the only explanation I can find.

This guy's method makes more sense to me: Cereal Mashing. He mashes the corn with some 2-row at 153° for 20 minutes to get conversion, then boils for gelatinization. Note the links at the bottom of the page.

As you rightly point out, there seems to be some confusion and misinformation about what actually happens in the cereal mash. Does the added grain actually convert the starches? Can they even be converted before they are gelatinized? Or are you just gelatinizing starches from the adjunct to release them for conversion in the main mash?

Chad

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Ahhh, I see.... I do admit my way gets the "goo" effect, but I found adding the goo to my strike water before I add the grains and stiring the crap out of it frees up all the individual grains of rice. At that point I dough in with the rest of my grains to my first step temp at 122. I have not had any problems lautering with this method, but my adjunct concentration has never exceeded 35% either.....

This is what I found:
This week's recipes is a Yuengling Clone. Yuengling calls itself America's oldest brewery and is located here in Pennsylvania. I had the pleasure of touring the brewery in 2001 and it was excellent. Yuengling makes several products and this recipe is from Tastybrew.com is for the Amber Lager. Notes About The Recipe This recipes calls for rice. I know for a fact that Yuengling uses corn grits. Yes, corn grits, the kind that you can buy at the grocery store. I have used corn grits it recipes and I know that they can cause boil overs. So, after the malt begins to boil, slowly add the corn grits and stir to keep them from settling to the bottom of the pot. Name Yuengling Clone Description Lager Clone Added by bsummers12 Date Submitted Fri, 23 Nov 2001 01:07 PM (GMT)
Ingredients
4.5 lbs Laaglander Light Malt Extract
1 lb Rice
1 lb Cara-pils
.5 lb Crystal Malt
1 oz Northern Brewer hops (60 mins)
1/3 oz Tettnanger (10 mins)
1/5 oz Saaz (5 mins)
California Lager 2112 yeast
Preparation
Steep grains in 1 gallon water at 158 degrees for 1/2 hour. Remove grains. Add DME and rice solids. Boil 1 hour adding hops at times listed above. Cool wort and pitch yeast.
Specifics
Style Lager Recipe Type Partial Mash Batch Size 5 US gallons Original Gravity 1.047 Final Gravity 1.012 Boiling Time 60 mins Primary Fermentation Plastic, 7 days @ 68 degrees Secondary Fermentation Glass, 14 days @ 65 degrees Other Specifics 22 IBU's 4.7% AC
Comments
Best after aging in bottle in a cool place 1 month.
instead of the using the grits and all, try using rice extract. So just do the normal steeping. Now boil as normal, but add the rice extract as a late boil addition. As far as lagering it..... I may be crazy but, when I have made this I took I believe pilsen lager yeast and brewed it @ room temp. This is against most anything I read, but it worked out really well, and was a huge hit at my house on tap.
Hope this helps.

I for one, Love Yuengling Draft and agree the bottles are not the same.

I have not had a "can" and do not plan to go out of my way to get one.

this is my favorite commercial draft beer at the momment.

I am going to try to clone just to try..

thanks for this thread.

If you look under recipes, amber larger. I posted a recipe that is just about spot on. It was alittle sweeter at first, I'm guessing because it was still ' green'. After 3 weeks in the keg it's as close as its going to get to the real thing. I even compared it to the real thing, no difference that I can tell.