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PJ912 · 01-18-2013, 01:33 AM

I'm brewing extract kits, basically 3kg LDM with whatever hops, yeast and some steeped grain. 10litre boil topped up with 10litres of water. Getting chill haze lately and a bit of turbidity and flavor definition is out.

Questions:
1. I've varied the amount from 1-3 kg of malt in the boil. As you usually add malt or adjuncts to a kit brew and never have chill haze, is it the boil that plays with the proteins?
2. Following on from that thought, Can you just hop the water in the boil and add malt afterwards? It obviously seems that it's better to mix them both in the boil, but can it be done the other way? The water would be like hop syrup?
3. How does the volume of the boil affect hop bitterness and flavours? Would a 5litre 1kg malt boil work just as well? Cold break would be easier that way.

Trying to keep it easy whilst creating my own flavours. Comments and answers appreciated!

stevo4361 · 01-18-2013, 02:59 AM

Not sure on #1, but #2 is no, boiling just hops and water with no malt will not get the hop utilization you are looking for. Chemistry I'm not really up on yet involved, but sure someone more knowledgeable than me will chime in on why. On #3 the larger the boil with malt in some quantity with hops you get more hop utilization as more hop acids can be "absorbed" by the wort, especially when compared to a partial boil method. Hope that helps and hopefully someone with more technical expertise can add to and correct me.

Captain Damage · 01-18-2013, 04:31 PM

Chill haze is not a flaw. It will drop out after a week or two in the fridge. Most beers will have it. Chilling your wort rapidly after the boil to the low 60Fs seems to help it drop out of the finished beer faster. You can also try Clarity Ferm, an enzyme that is said to eliminate chill haze proteins. I haven't trird it so cannot comment further.

PJ912 · 01-18-2013, 06:38 PM

Thanks guys, yeah I'm working in my cold break and looking at getting some Irish moss. I've tended to just strain the whole boil into my fermenter and top with water then try and chill -- expecting the stuff to drop out. Last brew I added a bowl of ice at flame out and that dropped the temp more quickly but still not enough.
Seems some people are advocating late addition of malt for extract brews and apparently this doesnt affect the hop utilisation. see thread on baderbrewing. will try that next time. I'll also try not to transfer the trub to the fermenter.

Captain Damage · 01-18-2013, 07:02 PM

I don't filter my wort in any way, nor do I separate out the trub/coldbreak going into my fermenters. My beers are all crystal clear after the chill haze drops out. I do use Whirlfloc in the last 5 minutes of the boil. I've cold crashed with gelatin only a couple of times when dealing with powdery yeast.

PJ912 · 01-18-2013, 09:29 PM

PJ912 · 01-18-2013, 11:49 PM

Meant to say haha I need a bigger fridge then !

Captain Damage · 01-19-2013, 12:16 AM

I cold crash in a big plastic tub from Walmart with ice.

Just so you can't say nobody mentioned it, some styles will always have a hazy appearance, but not due to chill haze. Hefeweizens often have a protein haze and are by definition served with yeast in the glass; wits have a starch-and-protein haze; heavily dry hopped beers like American IPAs often have a haze. In none of these instances is haze considered a flaw.

stevo4361 · 01-19-2013, 01:24 AM

I've used Irish moss in the last 15 min of boil with good results.

**unionrdr** · 01-19-2013, 02:57 PM

In my extract brews,I boil 2.5-3 gallons of water then add 1.5lb of plain DM for hop additions. At flame out,I add the remaining 1.5lbs of DME & all the LME. Stir to mix well,cover & steep for 15 minutes. The boil is still 180F+ at that point,& pasteurization happens about 162F.
Chilling the hot wort down to pitch temp in 20 minutes or less will greatly reduce or elliminate chill haze come fridge time. Give the bottles 3-4 weeks at room temp to carb & condition on average for average gravity ales. Then at least a week fridge time to get carbonation in the head space into solution. This also gives chill haze time to settle out as well. 2 weeks fridge time gives thicker head & longer lasting carbonation.