New Giveaway - Wort Monster Conical Fermenter!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Extract Brewing > ESB and Alt




Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-11-2012, 12:16 AM   #1
HopHead10
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Chicago
Posts: 116
Default ESB and Alt

Hi fellow brewers ... wonder if you can give me some e-feedback:

Recently brewed two different styles and both came out rather sweet and a tad bid "metallic" that I was expecting. These are 2 of my first 3 beers tapped in the kegerator. Wondering if you can tell me if that is how they should taste. I know there are infinite reasons that could be why but wonder if you can pick up anything from my descriptions.

First I made a German Alt :


Description : A well-balanced, bitter yet malty, clean, smooth, well-attenuated, copper-colored German ale. This is an intermediate style that can be brewed by extract-with-grain or all-grain methods. Ferments at 60 deg. F.
Extract:
Pilsener LME 6.6 lbs
Munich DME 1 lb
Steeping Grains
Aromatic Malt 1 lb
Caramunich .5 lb
Carafa Special II 3 oz.
Hops:
Mt. Hood 1 oz
Tettnang .5 oz
Yeast:
Wyeast 1007 German Ale

This got a bit warmer than 60 and sat at ambient. It was not a full volume boil I boiled ~ 3 gallon and topped off with faucet water. This one has the touch of the metallic flavor but is not the malty mouthfeel I was expecting. I tried an Alt at Goose Island from the tap and it had a much better mouthfeel, and sweet but not this sweet.

Then, I brewed this ESB, it's a Fuller's Best clone from BYO (and my first full-volume boil). The boil did not get that strong as it was windy fyi, but I don't think that should matter for an extract :

Ingredients
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
1 lbs 3.2 oz Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 2 12.1 %
1 lbs 3.2 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 1 12.1 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 3 15.2 %
1.00 oz Target [8.60 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 4 17.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Northdown [9.60 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 9.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Styrian Goldings [5.10 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 5.0 IBUs
0.25 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Primary 3.0 days) Other 9 -
6 lbs Light Dry Extract [Boil for20 min](8.0 SRM) Dry Extract 5 60.6 %
1.0 pkg London ESB Ale (Wyeast Labs #1968) [124.21 ml] Yeast 8 -

Still too sweet. Flavors sit on the back corners of my palate and generally not the mouthfeel and taste I was looking for from an ESB. BUT I've never had a Fuller's Best so maybe thats how it's supposed to taste. Still kind of tastes Cidery, which I guess is from the Corn Sugar. But why would they advise to use a # and a half of corn sugar in the recipe?!


OVERALL I'm just generally disappointed in these low gravity, low hop session beers that I was aiming for for my first kegerator beers. Usually I brew IPA's cuz I can mask the failures with hops.

Bottom line : what am I doing wrong?



__________________
HopHead10 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-11-2012, 12:28 AM   #2
passedpawn
Moderator
HBT_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
passedpawn's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: ☼ Clearwater, FL ☼
Posts: 17,494
Liked 2651 Times on 1708 Posts
Likes Given: 2152

Default

Alt's should not be sweet. Maybe a bit malty.

I don't see OG/FG numbers here, but if you have them then you want session beers finishing < 1.015, and hopefully closer to 1.010. Otherwise you will have too much sweetness.

I don't use extract, so maybe that's a factor somehow.

Everybody's process is different, so you'll have to live with some minor disappointments until you dial it in. Make the same recipe again but add more hops. That will definately balance the sweetness.

Cidery does NOT come from using corn sugar. Period. Just get rid of that thought forever. Cidery can be a sanitation problem or a yeast problem.

You should NOT need 1.5# of corn sugar in a session beer. I hope an extract brewer comes in here and corrects that, it sounds crazy.



__________________
It is finished, It is finished - IT IS THE MERCY
passedpawn is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-11-2012, 12:38 AM   #3
HopHead10
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Chicago
Posts: 116
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by passedpawn View Post

Cidery does NOT come from using corn sugar. Period. Just get rid of that thought forever. Cidery can be a sanitation problem or a yeast problem.

You should NOT need 1.5# of corn sugar in a session beer. I hope an extract brewer comes in here and corrects that, it sounds crazy.
I found this correlation from John Palmer's "How to Brew" on pg. 256 describing off-flavors:

"Cidery flavors can have several causes but are often the result of adding too much cane or corn sugar to a recipe"
__________________
HopHead10 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-11-2012, 12:44 AM   #4
passedpawn
Moderator
HBT_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
passedpawn's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: ☼ Clearwater, FL ☼
Posts: 17,494
Liked 2651 Times on 1708 Posts
Likes Given: 2152

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HopHead10 View Post
I found this correlation from John Palmer's "How to Brew" on pg. 256 describing off-flavors:

"Cidery flavors can have several causes but are often the result of adding too much cane or corn sugar to a recipe"
Hmmm, I'm going out on a limb here, but I'd have to say that's just wrong. I've had cidery, and it wasn't from sugar. And I've used lots of sugar (IIPA, Belgian) and had zero cideriness.

I added a dirty beet (don't ask) to a beer after it had cooled and it was nasty with an apple flavor. Ended up dumping that. Had a barleywine that had a nasty cideriness, but that went away after 3 years (!) in the bottle. I've had young beers that had a bit of that but it went away after proper conditioning in bottle or keg.
__________________
It is finished, It is finished - IT IS THE MERCY
passedpawn is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-11-2012, 12:57 AM   #5
HopHead10
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Chicago
Posts: 116
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by passedpawn View Post
I've had young beers that had a bit of that but it went away after proper conditioning in bottle or keg.
I'm hoping this is the case, it's been fermenting in secondary for more than 3 weeks but i just tapped it on tuesday. 12-14 psi and already carbonated so i drank it


__________________
HopHead10 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools
Display Modes