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Old 07-10-2008, 04:07 PM   #1
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Default "Brewing Classic Styles" - walk me though this recipe (long)

I'm trying to learn and work things out and am reading Brewing Classic Styles by Zainasheff/Palmer.

Can someone answer some PROBABLY obvious questions from a newbie who is fascinated but confused?

Walking through the page 37 example

1. Estimate yield of steeping grains 1.25 pounds of crystal malt in 3 gallons of water Assuming 70% yield equates to . . .

(1???) where did this figure come from?

1.25* 24ppg (I assume this is common knowledge for crystal malt?)/3 gal = 10 gravity points or 1.010 - so far so good. Subtract 10 points from boil gravity 55-10=45

2. Calc the amount of extract to use in boil
From the gravity equation 45 / 12 = 3.75 (this is just an easier way to do it - I understand the actual calculation.

So - at this point if we were all done (which we are not). Would I use 3.75 pounds of extract in the partial boil? and would I add that all at once?

I understand the rest and actually understand it MUCH better now that I typed it out.

So the BIG question is this

Where did the "Assuming 70% yield" come from and if I'm using 3.75 pounds of extract in a partial boil - do I just dump it all in at once in the beginning of the boil or as I had read use 1/2 of it and put the rest in near the end of the boil!

Sorry for being long winded but - this is SERIOUSLY fascinating me.

rod

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Old 07-10-2008, 04:27 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinder12000 View Post
Walking through the page 37 example

1. Estimate yield of steeping grains 1.25 pounds of crystal malt in 3 gallons of water Assuming 70% yield equates to . . .

(1???) where did this figure come from?
1.25* 24ppg (I assume this is common knowledge for crystal malt?)/3 gal = 10 gravity points or 1.010 - so far so good.
Most crystal malts are in the low 30's range for potential extract; he's likely using 34ppg and assuming (based on lots of experience) that he'll get 70% of that. 34 * 70% = 24


EDIT: removed answer to the partial boil question; answered better in following posts
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:28 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinder12000 View Post
I'm trying to learn and work things out and am reading Brewing Classic Styles by Zainasheff/Palmer.

Can someone answer some PROBABLY obvious questions from a newbie who is fascinated but confused?

Walking through the page 37 example

1. Estimate yield of steeping grains 1.25 pounds of crystal malt in 3 gallons of water Assuming 70% yield equates to . . .

(1???) where did this figure come from?
That's an average efficiency figure. It's what Jamil usually gets. Your brewhouse efficiency will probably vary, and it's based on many factors----grain crush, water profile, mash tun design, etc. For instance, I usually get 80+%. You won't know what your efficiency is until you do a handful of batches and average it out based on what your original gravity numbers are. So for the time being, assume 70%, and if your gravity numbers are higher or lower than expected, you can adjust your recipes next time by assuming this new efficiency figure. If I were you I'd take fastidious notes and get brewing software like Beertools, Promash (what I use), or Beersmith.

Quote:
1.25* 24ppg (I assume this is common knowledge for crystal malt?)/3 gal = 10 gravity points or 1.010 - so far so good. Subtract 10 points from boil gravity 55-10=45

2. Calc the amount of extract to use in boil
From the gravity equation 45 / 12 = 3.75 (this is just an easier way to do it - I understand the actual calculation.

So - at this point if we were all done (which we are not). Would I use 3.75 pounds of extract in the partial boil? and would I add that all at once?
You'd add whatever extract you need to add around 15 minutes from the end of your boil. This will reduce caramelization in the kettle which can darken your beer.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:38 PM   #4
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Only thing is the recipes in the book all assume a full boil which means there would no need to do late extract additions.

If you have to do a partial boil, you'll want to try to boil with your target pre-boil gravity to get the proper hop utilization, then add the rest of the extract in the last 10 or 15 minutes.

According to Jamil, doing a full boil makes a huge improvement in extract brewed beers.

Linc

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Old 07-10-2008, 04:53 PM   #5
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Partial boil - he(they say) - they have an entire section on partial boils.

Quote:
Boil all of your hops in 1/2 of your total malt extract, in half the recipe volume, add the remaining extract at the end of the boil to pasteurize it, then dilute to the final recipe volume in the fermenter.
So - in ENGLISH with a 3 gallon boil

Boil ALL of your hops in the 3 gallons but use ONLY 1/2 the extract - then add the remainder near the end.

He then says just use ALL the steeping grains at once - it's not IDEAL but it's practical.

same with Hops - just use the recipe and don't worry about the partial boil.

HOWEVER - I understand what you are saying about the target boil gravity. Just let me digest things for a couple brews (small steps and going from a kit to this is a big one).

thanks
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Old 07-10-2008, 05:22 PM   #6
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One more question

In the example recipe on pages 36-37

the 3 gallon boil will consist of
1.25 lb of steeping grains
0.50 lb of Munich LME
3.25 lbs of light LME

This means that there is still 6.5lbs of light LME left over correct? That goes in at the end of the boil.

I think I'm making THIS harder then it looks but I want to make sure (first time worries).

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Old 07-10-2008, 05:59 PM   #7
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If a late extract addition is the source of your confusion, just don't do it. It's not going to kill your beer to put all the extract in at the beginning, even with a partial boil.

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Old 07-10-2008, 06:07 PM   #8
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Download a free trial of beersmith, throw your recipe in there and it will calculate your late extract, steeping amounts etc. I've never used Beersmith for that but I know it will do it. PLus it is a great way to check yourself, keep notes and it will really help later on if you decide to try PM or AG.

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Old 07-10-2008, 06:34 PM   #9
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Not confused - just makign sure I was reading it correctly. Thanks

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Old 07-10-2008, 08:10 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinder12000 View Post
...Walking through the page 37 example

1. Estimate yield of steeping grains 1.25 pounds of crystal malt in 3 gallons of water Assuming 70% yield equates to . . .

(1???) where did this figure come from?
On page 40 under the Malts section he explains that "The estimated yield for steeping of specialty grains is assumed to be the same as the mashing yield, 70 percent."
Yes, it's odd that he gave an example before his reasoning.

Quote:
1.25* 24ppg (I assume this is common knowledge for crystal malt?)
I'm surprised they did not include a table similar to this in the book. But you can find similar tables around the internet. That table doesn't list Crystal 15L but it should be close to 35 ppg. 35 x 70% = 24.5.
They do say in the book on page 40 under the Malts section that you should get the maximum yield from the malt analysis sheet for the malt in question. They assume a 70% yield of the maximum yield.
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