Originally Posted by OLDBREW
Pro Brewers come on the those brew-talk shows, and tell the brewers to get the wort off the yeast and transfered to a secondary as soon as primary fermentation slows!
Hmm, have you listened to Basicbrewingradio lately? Have you read the discussion on long primary and on the experiment conducted by many many brewers working together between Basic Brewing radio AND BYO magazine, that backed up what many many many of us have saying on here for 3 or more years, pal? It may be new to you in your 3 months...but not to us.
The results were about two issues back, and BYO wouldn't be suggesting it, if THEY felt it didn't have merit, would they?
Maybe YOU'RE a little behind the times as to what the "pro" brewers are saying.
It's your choice to think it's BS or not, but many of us have plenty of anecdotal evidence and even JUDGING sheets that bear this out. This discussion may be NEW to you, but it's been an ongoing discussion on here for at least three years, with more and more folks trying it and having similar results as the rest of us.
There's 1,000's of threads on here with folks discussing this, and not just ME having success with it....more and more each day, and including some pretty serious brewers that probably brew more than the "pros" do.
A "pro" is just someone who takes a paycheck for doing it, many of us have a bigger passion, and perhaps even a bigger knowledge base but just do it because we love it, and wouldn't do it for pay.
It doesn't mean folks are idiots.
Take Kai, who's been on many podcasts, or Brewpastor who was just on Brewstrong, or Biermuncher who's been in BYO magazine...Plenty of folks on here breaking ground and getting recognition, by the same podcasts you talk about the "pros" being on.
And that's perhaps WHY BYO magazine, AND Basic Brewing Radio, and more and more "pros" are beginning to think "Hey maybe those hobbyiests on HBT who have been doing this for years, MIGHT actually know something that we don't know, and haven't tried, but they have, 'cause THEY don't have a lot to lose, they are willing to risk it to try it out, maybe we should re-evaluate things ourselves."
Rather than scoffing, why don't YOU give it a try and see for your self, you might be surprised.
We've been debating and discussing it on here for nearly 3 years, so it's nothing new to us, and we no longer debate it with any noobs who are stuck in hero worship for what the "pros" say.
We've heard the same line that you just spewed before.....though it's been awhile, since things are changing and more people are trying it for themselves.
And don't even know WHAT the pros' may be saying today as opposed to what they said in a book or something that was writted 3-5 years ago.
Think John Palmer still believes what he wrote in how to brew about IBUs??? Nope.
Ideas change with science, and science changes all the time. Here's a good example John Palmer basically admits that what he wrote about IBU's in How to brew, was essentially "wrong" or at least outdated in light of new science...
Basic Brewing Thursday, March 20, 2008 4:30 PM
John Palmer, author of How to Brew, shares information from a conference that challenged his concept of what defines an International Bitterness Unit (IBU). Click to listen, MP-3
I cite that podcast as an example of how the knowlegebase shifts so fast in this hobby because of places like this or podcasts...A book is a snapshot of the author's body of knowledge and the "common wisdom" at the time the author wrote the book, which may mean 3 years before it was even published. Papazian's book is 30+ years old. The basic knowlege is good, but brewing science and experience has progressed to where some things an author believes or says at that time may no-longer be valid...even to the author...
Hell, Papazian just discovered the joys of rice hulls about 3 years ago. So who says an old dog, can't learn something new?
In that Podcast, Palmer basically contradicts in some was what he wrote in HTB...and I bet it will be reflected in his subsequent writings, but if he doesn't go back and revise HTB, and people don't read or listen to anything by him after, than they won't realize that the knowlegebase has already shifted...
And well probably start seeing long primary mentioned in more and more books in the future.
So believe what you want, but I won't debate you, we've been doing this for a long time, with great success, we're just providing the information.
Oh yeah...and you don't KNOW wtf my background in brewing is do you? Maybe I studied at siebel, or maybe I didn't but maybe 15 years ago I almost opened one of the first brewpubs in Michigan, and DID study a lot about brewing, but my brother and partner in it DIED, and maybe I lost passion for brewing, and sought other careers, and then a few years back got back into it as a hobby/passion, and remembered all the learning I did back then.
That's the funny thing about the internet...we really don't know who is behind the AVATAR and nickname, do we?????
Hell, for all YOU knoe maybe I really AM Charlie Papazian. Edit---But I'm really Chuck Norris.