Secondary Fermentation - good, bad, ugly???

So I am knew to all grain, I know that has nothing to do with secondary fermentation, but well I am new to that, and wondering if I should be incorporating it as I venture to AG too.

I am wondering what is the point of secondary fermenting? I understand it may be more necessary for lagering, but for Ales what is the point?

Can you secondary ferment in a keg without putting gas on it? Then when the appropriate amount of time has passed, put the gas on? Just realized you probably need a airlock system on the secondary fermentor, so that shoots that idea in the foot.

I suppose there are going to be a lot of "well, it depends" on this, but what are they?

For beer the secondary is better referred to as the clearing tank. You don't have a secondary fermentation (unless you dump your beer on more fermentables like fruit). It is a step to get the beer of the yeast and let it age a bit more. Many people go right from primary to the keg.

Primary to Keg is fine for ales and can be conditioned in a keg. Actually same for lagers, just make sure you have cut about an inch off of the dip tub so you dont scuk up yeast.

I go straight to the keg for ales and lagers. In both cases, I give the brew long enough to settle out before kegging. You don't need airlocks on the kegs, since the ferment is done. Even if it isn't 100%, all that means is you get some carbonation.

david_42 said:

I go straight to the keg for ales and lagers. In both cases, I give the brew long enough to settle out before kegging. You don't need airlocks on the kegs, since the ferment is done. Even if it isn't 100%, all that means is you get some carbonation.

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Ok thanks for all the info. From the sounds of it, the reason to use a secondary fermentor is if you had a flavor to add in the secondary such as coffee grounds, fruit etc...

If I left it in the primary for 2 weeks on an ale, that should be plenty of time for all the gas to release and no need for a secondary anyways.

Well, it depends.

I only brew alse, and I used to secondary all the time. Why? because it was always recommended. It was reported that if you didn't secondary, you would end up with cloudy beer, and I didn't want that. Then, some time ago, JZ recommended not using a secondary, but leaving the beer in the primary for 3 - 4 weeks, and then bottling or kegging. I tried it, and to my surprise, my beer was not cloudy, and undoubtedly tasted better.

The only reasons I secondary now are:
1. I have run out of primaries, and need to make another brew.
2. I'm going to dry hop
3. A beer is ready to bottle/get, but I don't have any bottles/kegs available, and I don't want to leave it in the primary for more than about 5 weeks.

It could possibly be true that a secondary fermentation used to be necessary with the ingredients (especially yeasts) that were available in the old days, but is no longer necessary with modern ingredients which are of a much higher quality.

-a.

I use secondarys when i want to harvest clean yeast. Helps me avoid old hops, hot/cold break etc..

i quit using secondaries some time ago....all my beers have tasted better since then.

ajf said:

Well, it depends.

I only brew alse, and I used to secondary all the time. Why? because it was always recommended. It was reported that if you didn't secondary, you would end up with cloudy beer, and I didn't want that. Then, some time ago, JZ recommended not using a secondary, but leaving the beer in the primary for 3 - 4 weeks, and then bottling or kegging. I tried it, and to my surprise, my beer was not cloudy, and undoubtedly tasted better.

-a.

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Can you explain what process you go through for leaving your brew in the primary for 3-4 weeks? I'm new to all of this and I am learning a lot. Thanks.

Bob8690 said:

Can you explain what process you go through for leaving your brew in the primary for 3-4 weeks? I'm new to all of this and I am learning a lot. Thanks.

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It's pretty easy. Just leave it. Don't touch it. No peeking if you use a bucket. Take a gravity reading 3 - 4 days before bottling to make sure it's ready, and another on bottling day. If the two readings are the same, and in range, you're ready to bottle. As you will have a lot more trub in the primary than you would in the secondary, you need to be a bit more careful when racking to the bottling bucket or keg. I clamp the siphon so the pickup is well above the trub, and then gradually lower it as the siphon proceeds. If I start to pick up trub, I've lowered it too far, and I raise it a bit. Just stop when you can't get any more beer out without picking up trub.

-a.

ajf said:

It's pretty easy. Just leave it. Don't touch it. No peeking if you use a bucket. Take a gravity reading 3 - 4 days before bottling to make sure it's ready, and another on bottling day. If the two readings are the same, and in range, you're ready to bottle. As you will have a lot more trub in the primary than you would in the secondary, you need to be a bit more careful when racking to the bottling bucket or keg. I clamp the siphon so the pickup is well above the trub, and then gradually lower it as the siphon proceeds. If I start to pick up trub, I've lowered it too far, and I raise it a bit. Just stop when you can't get any more beer out without picking up trub.

-a.

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So I am guessing trub is sediment?

so i'm guessing the search function is broken? oh, wait, there it is, it works! i really wish the mods/ownership folks around here would discuss a solution to the parade of same questions being constantly asked. maybe the mods can take a harder line by replying with a request to search for the answers and block the thread from future posts.

just a thought

humann_brewing said:

So I am guessing trub is sediment?

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Your guess is 100% correct

-a.

steedtucker said:

i quit using secondaries some time ago....all my beers have tasted better since then.

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Can you comment on why you think eliminating racking into a secondary fermenter might improve flavor quality? I look at a beer sitting on 2 inches of trub and think it would be happier getting racked into a secondary fermenter. But I have never made a beer that didn't get put into secondary. I've never experienced a santitation issue, and oxidation should be very low at fermentation temperatures, so what difference does it make?

I tend to go with the 1-2-3 method with my average gravity ales. 1 week in primary, 2 in secondary, 3 in the bottle. Somewhat to significantly modified for bigger beers.

Sixbillionethans said:

Can you comment on why you think eliminating racking into a secondary fermenter might improve flavor quality? I look at a beer sitting on 2 inches of trub and think it would be happier getting racked into a secondary fermenter. But I have never made a beer that didn't get put into secondary. I've never experienced a santitation issue, and oxidation should be very low at fermentation temperatures, so what difference does it make?

I tend to go with the 1-2-3 method with my average gravity ales. 1 week in primary, 2 in secondary, 3 in the bottle. Somewhat to significantly modified for bigger beers.

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if the beer is left in the primary with the yeast, the yeast will actually clean up any esters that they have given off during fermentation....if you rack the beer off the yeast cake then you will have beer left with the esters that could have been cleaned out of the beer...some yeast give off more or less esters depending on temp. and yeast strain.