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paradoc · 06-25-2009, 09:57 PM

Note: I added a post later in this thread with the full recipe, along with the proposed modifications. You can find it here:
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/pliny-elder-recipe-questions-125517/index8.html#post1537060

Greetings,

The July/Aug '09 issue of Zymurgy has a recipe for Pliny the Elder from Vinnie Cilurzo. Looks great... but when I put the recipe into BeerAlchemy, the OG calculations are WAY off. Not sure what I'm doing wrong. The recipe calls for:

11 lb 2 row
0.5 lb Crystal 45
0.5 lb Carapils
0.4 lb corn sugar

8 gallons wort from mash, 90 minute boil, 6 gallons into fermenter.
OG from recipe: 1.070
FG: 1.011

When I put it into Beer Alchemy, I'm only getting an OG of 1.055. I've checked my efficiency number, and volumes, and all look correct. Can someone plug those numbers into one of the other beer software programs and let me know what you get for OG? I'm sure I've got something wonky in my recipe in BeerAlchemy... but not sure what it is.

Thanks!

steelerguy · 06-25-2009, 10:03 PM

Looks right on as long as you get 92-93% efficiency.

I could just look at that recipe and tell it is not enough grain/sugar. For what it is worth...1.057 with beercalculus.com and 75% efficiency.

**uwjester** · 06-25-2009, 10:25 PM

I get about the same thing in BeerSmith. I'm going to bump the 2row and corn sugar up when I do this recipe next week. I'm choosing not to bump the crystal because Mike said not to.

**midfielder5** · 06-25-2009, 11:29 PM

the one i have seen was for 29 # of 2-row
+
DME 8.0 lbs
Corn Sugar 1.0 lbs
Dextrine Malt 2.0 lbs
Crystal 40L 1.0 lbs
Wheat Malt 1.0 lbs
*for a 12 gal recipe.

***Yooper*** · 06-26-2009, 01:07 AM

Here's the one I did: http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f69/pliny-bastid-21229/

I used an even 12 pounds of 2-row and got an OG of 1.073 at 75%. It was my favorite beer, that's for sure!

paradoc · 06-26-2009, 04:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uwjester

I'm choosing not to bump the crystal because Mike said not to.

Pardon my ignorance... but who is Mike? Any input on why not to scale the crystal?

I'm thinking about bumping the grain bill up to something like this:
14.5 pounds Maris Otter
0.66 pounds Crystal 40
0.66 pounds Carapils
0.5 pounds corn sugar

That is an increase in my grain bill of 33%, which should yield an OG of 1.058 if I hit my typical 65% efficiency (only done a couple of all grains so far and still working on efficiency), and 1.076 if I can hit 80% efficiency.

Rick500 · 06-26-2009, 04:59 AM

I noticed the same thing when I put that recipe from the magazine into Beersmith. Something's amiss...

By the way, I'm an IPA lover, and have wanted to try Pliny the Elder forever (but we can't get it here in KY).
I have had the Pliny clone in the current Sam Adams Longshot pack, and didn't like it at all...it was just ridiculously, sharply bitter, like they put all the hops in at the beginning of the boil and didn't bother with flavor or aroma additions. Is the real thing really like that?

samc · 06-26-2009, 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick500

Is the real thing really like that?

No the real thing is insanely hoppy and works well with bitterness. I wonder just how fresh and handled the Longshot was. I was not able to find any so I never tried it. The early bottles of Pliny I had this year were great, the later batch was somewhat of a letdown on the hoppy scale. I attribute it to age & handling.

I recently brewed this version http://www.homebrewtalk.com/129699-post14.html with some hop substitutions for Warrior (Nuggget) & Columbus (Zeus).

Eastside Brewer · 06-26-2009, 06:11 AM

Pliny is my favorite beer, I'm only 40 minutes from the Brewery, but it is Fresh on tap at 3 locations blocks from my house!

In an attempt to brew it myself, I have brewed 12 batches in a row, slightly changing the hop bill each time. No sense fooling with the grain bill, it's 2-row, c-45(I actually us a combo of c-15 and c-120 in very small amounts), then carapils and of course corn sugar which gives it a nice dryness. I have actually gotten really close by using a different hop bill and hop schedule. Of course I humbly resign myself to the fact that there is only ONE Pliny and Vinnie has that market cornered for me!

McDole's Long Shot beer is no Pliny!

Eastside

**uwjester** · 06-26-2009, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paradoc

Pardon my ignorance... but who is Mike? Any input on why not to scale the crystal?

That is an increase in my grain bill of 33%, which should yield an OG of 1.058 if I hit my typical 65% efficiency (only done a couple of all grains so far and still working on efficiency), and 1.076 if I can hit 80% efficiency.

I'm an idiot. I meant Vinnie, the owner of Russian River, but I got his name mixed up. The reason not to add more crystal is that you don't want to add too much crystal character to the beer. You want a good malt background, but you don't want to take anything away from the hops. At least according to Mike or Tom or Dave or Vinnie.