Numbers numbers everywhere! My efficiency is???

Zymurgrafi · 12-12-2007, 07:17 PM

Okay, I am not too worried about what my efficiency is except for the fact that I kinda want to know for recipe formulation purposes.

I use a free program, Homebrew Formulator, and it works well but I cannot figure my efficiency. I am fairly certain it is operator error.

Firstly, It calculates mash efficiency and pre-boil mash efficiency. Which of these is the one I plug into my overall "brewery environment"? They tend to be about 10 points different all the time. Usually with the pre-boil being lower (say 62%) and then the mash efficiency being higher (say 69%). Is that right?

Admittedly I am not very good at collecting all the data needed. I seem to be all over the place too from batch to batch number wise. I would like to just have a consistent efficiency not matter what it is. Anybody help me figure out what is going on? I realize I need to give some more info but right now I am just wicked confused!

Blender · 12-12-2007, 07:25 PM

I could be in the minority but the gravity measurement of wort into the fermentor is what I would use for efficiency.

**Orfy** · 12-12-2007, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blender

I could be in the minority but the gravity measurement of wort into the fermentor is what I would use for efficiency.

That is okay if you use it as a function of volume other wise extra boiling would increase you effieciency

Evan! · 12-12-2007, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bah Humbug

That is okay if you use it as a function of volume other wise extra boiling would increase you effieciency

Well of course one would use it as a function of volume. You'd have to be a special kind of 'tarded to boil it down to 3 gallons and take that gravity reading and claim your efficiency is high.

Anyway...

ProMash is really weird about it. I always take my readings from the fermenter...but ProMash has 2 options: "measurement taken in kettle" and "measurement taken in fermenter". The kettle option is the default, and the numbers look normal. But if I select the "taken from fermenter" option (which is actually what I do!), which takes into account all the losses from fermenter to kettle, my numbers go through the roof. For example, the IIPA I brewed last week says 78% eff. when the "from kettle" option is selected...but I actually took the reading from the fermenter...so I select the "from fermenter" option, and what does it say? 105% efficiency! And I know I h'aint gettin no 105%. I still don't get that.

Blender · 12-12-2007, 07:50 PM

I may use Promash wrong but if I set efficiency for 70%, it calculates an OG. I have always assumed that was the fermenter measurement for the batch size. When the measurement is taken after the wort is in the fermenter I use the efficiency adjustment to adjust it up or down until it meets the OG. I use that reading for my efficiency.

Zymurgrafi · 12-12-2007, 08:28 PM

Okay. Still

Beerthoven · 12-12-2007, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knights of Gambrinus

Okay. Still

Did you try searching? I did a quick google search and found these for starters:

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f13/all-grain-efficency-hows-calculated-46224/
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/brew-efficiency-question-44375/
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/tedious-i-know-efficiency-18657/#post177948
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/efficiency-calculation-45206/#post444941
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f84/help-brewsmith-38192/

**FlyingHorse** · 12-12-2007, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evan!

ProMash is really weird about it. I always take my readings from the fermenter...but ProMash has 2 options: "measurement taken in kettle" and "measurement taken in fermenter". The kettle option is the default, and the numbers look normal. But if I select the "taken from fermenter" option (which is actually what I do!), which takes into account all the losses from fermenter to kettle, my numbers go through the roof. For example, the IIPA I brewed last week says 78% eff. when the "from kettle" option is selected...but I actually took the reading from the fermenter...so I select the "from fermenter" option, and what does it say? 105% efficiency! And I know I h'aint gettin no 105%. I still don't get that.

Sounds like you may have a mistake in the "losses" number (which is calculated from entries elsewhere). If losses are set to zero, the efficiency number doesn't change if all you do is click from "in the kettle" to "in the fermenter".

From the ProMash help:

Quote:

Measurements taken in the fermenter will consider the recorded volume plus the volume losses from the Kettle to the Fermenter (set in the Water Needed Calculator), and will also take the wort shrinkage into account for these losses. The total volume then used in the efficiency calculation is the recorded volume + all volume loss from kettle to fermenter

So if your stated losses are too high, the program thinks you threw away more sugars than you did, and gives you efficiency "credit" for them even though they didn't show up in the fermenter.

Zymurgrafi · 12-12-2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beerthoven

Did you try searching? I did a quick google search and found these for starters:

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=46224
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=44375
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=177948
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=444941
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=38192

Indeed I did. Sadly, nothing helped me to understand. I will check those threads and see if they help. Sorry to be a bother.

**Orfy** · 12-12-2007, 09:28 PM

Any one want to tidy this up?

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Efficiency